[SP-pm] Fwd: SYSTEMPLAN CONSULTORIA - ELISA RODRIGUES

Tiago Peczenyj tiago.peczenyj at gmail.com
Wed Oct 5 06:07:46 PDT 2011


Daniel,

acabei me alongando em algums comentários alguns emails atrás.

Seria bom desmembrarmos esta thread para falar sobre mercado de trabalho.

2011/10/5 Daniel Vinciguerra <dan.vinciguerra at gmail.com>

> Senhores,
>
> Para não perdermos o foco ta thread e aproveitarmos melhor a discussão e
> todos os pontos de vista, me prontifiquei e entrei em contato com a Elisa
> (moça do recrutamento) para uma negociação sem compromisso e postarei aqui
> os resultados da negociação para ajudar o pessoal que esta pensando em
> concorrer a vaga.
>
> De qualquer forma em um primeiro contato a Elisa ja deixou escapar que o
> valor é aberto e ela precisa responder a solicitação da IBM ainda hoje.
>
> Forte abraço a todos,
>
> *
> Daniel Vinciguerra*
> Web Solutions Architect and Co-Owner at Bivee
> http://github.com/dvinciguerra <http://github.com/dvinciguerra>
>
>
> 2011/10/5 cleiton alves <cleitondebian at gmail.com>
>
>> Herman
>> Fique tranquilo , cada um esta colocando o ponto de vista sobre o
>> assunto , não precisa de brigas , flamewar essas coisas.
>>
>> Abraços
>>
>> Em 05/10/11, Carlos Eduardo Langoni<ce.langoni at gmail.com> escreveu:
>> > Hernan e demais colegas da lista,
>> >
>> > Eu concordo com generalizar--, mas também acho que isso tudo é reflexo
>> da
>> > experiência de todos com este tipo de negociação, não necessariamente
>> > estamos falando da IBM e suas terceirizadas, mas de uma forma geral o
>> > mercado tem se comportado assim, papel acima da experiência, se você não
>> tem
>> > papel não se encaixa nas vagas.
>> >
>> > Tudo bem, vai lá, ficou totalmente offtopic a conversa, mas daí a ter
>> > vontade de sair da lista, nem tanto.
>> >
>> > Concordo com o Daniel Vinciguerra, gato escaldado tem medo de água fria.
>> >
>> > Abraços a todos!
>> >
>> >
>> > 2011/10/5 Alexei Znamensky <russoz at gmail.com>
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 2011/10/5 hernan.lopes at inexsoft.com.br <hernan.lopes at inexsoft.com.br>
>> >>
>> >> Por acaso alguem ligou e perguntou ou negociou algo ?
>> >>> Essas especulações marrons me dão nojo...
>> >>> Se não tem coisa boa para falar melhor não falar nada.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> hernan++  # se nao sabe, nao fala
>> >> hernan++  # é sempre fácil generalizar e especular
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>>  Só vi comentários ruins, pessimistas e de péssimo gosto, lamento
>> >>> demais... da até vontade de sair da lista
>> >>>
>> >>> abs
>> >>>
>> >>> hernan
>> >>>
>> >>>
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>> >>> From: Carlos Costa <crncosta at gmail.com>
>> >>> Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2011 08:45:40 -0300
>> >>> Message-ID: <
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>> >>> Subject: Re: [SP-pm] Fwd: SYSTEMPLAN CONSULTORIA - ELISA RODRIGUES
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>> >>>
>> >>> Sabem o que é pior sobre esse mercado marrom de TI:
>> >>>
>> >>> - querem pagar mal, com contratos duvidosos via PJ ou quarterizados
>> >>>
>> >>> - tem altas taxas de turnover[1] e funcionários que não se identificam
>> >>> com a missão da empresa (no geral, por falta de motivação $$$)
>> >>>
>> >>> - Praticam uma das 2 maneiras de gerar lucro: aumentar receitas acima
>> >>> das despesas, ou cortar gastos abaixo das receitas. Há relatos de
>> >>> empresas que cortam até café!
>> >>>
>> >>> - E ainda saem por ai dando entrevista pra radio/TV/jornal/web dizendo
>> >>> que falta profissional de TI no mercado. Falta mesmo é pagar bem.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> [ ]s
>> >>> Carlos.
>> >>>
>> >>> [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turnover_(employment)
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> 2011/10/5 Hernan Lopes <hernanlopes at gmail.com>:
>> >>> > nojo!
>> >>> >
>> >>> > 2011/10/4 Hélder Máximo Botter Ribas <helderribas at gmail.com>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> O que esta sendo falado pode ser aplicado ao mercado
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Mas é a velha e boa intuição que se adquire com o tempo que pode
>> >>> >> ajudar
>> >>> a
>> >>> >> "prever" se vai entrar num projeto desafiador ou numa fria.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Pois todos sabemos que exitem projetos e projetos,
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> E sempre vamos ver gerentes que brigam pela equipe e outros que
>> brigam
>> >>> com
>> >>> >> a equipe, equipe de vendas ruim e boas, estratégias de negócios
>> >>> suicidas ou
>> >>> >> conservadoras, produto estabelecido ou briga para oferecer serviços
>> em
>> >>> >> diversos lugares
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Claro que as empresas de body shop que existem na ibm são famosas
>> (e
>> >>> >> as
>> >>> >> mesmas atuam em diversas outras consultorias e outros clientes), e
>> >>> emprega
>> >>> >> muitos colegas.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> E aquela, se o salário não compensar o trabalho ( ou a troca de
>> >>> trabalho),
>> >>> >> para que aceitar?
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Hélder
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> 2011/10/4 Alexei Znamensky <russoz at gmail.com>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>> 2011/10/4 Tiago Peczenyj <tiago.peczenyj at gmail.com>
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> Tem um outro detalhe
>> >>> >>>> Empresas como a IBM possuem centenas de divisões e vivem
>> comprando
>> >>> >>>> outras empresas.
>> >>> >>>> É bem possivel que algumas dessas divisões sejam caóticas, outras
>> >>> sejam
>> >>> >>>> extraordinárias.
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>> Estou lá dentro, e te garanto que é exatamente assim. Há áreas na
>> IBM
>> >>> que
>> >>> >>> são fantásticas para se trabalhar, e outras que são o fino do
>> lixo.
>> >>> >>> Do
>> >>> lado
>> >>> >>> de fora, não se vê isso, então, basicamente você:
>> >>> >>> 1) ou já trabalhou lá e sabe
>> >>> >>> 2) ou conhece alguém que trabalha ou trabalhou lá
>> >>> >>> 3) ou arrisca
>> >>> >>> 4) ou nem arrisca e sai fora
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> Na pratica, no Brasil, com TI Corporativa, existe a tendência a
>> >>> >>>> maior
>> >>> >>>> burocratização do trabalho e terceirização do trabalho. De
>> repente
>> >>> aqueles
>> >>> >>>> caras q foram contratados por 6 meses para fazer um sisteminha
>> >>> simples foi a
>> >>> >>>> unica forma de fazer esse maldito sistema pois o gerente não
>> tinha
>> >>> como
>> >>> >>>> contratar um mizero funcionario (falta autorização, eletricidade,
>> >>> etc) mas
>> >>> >>>> podia gastar 6 milhões com terceiros. Mas se esse gerente
>> consegue
>> >>> uma
>> >>> >>>> empresa que cobra 4 milhões, melhor pra ele que vai economizar
>> >>> dinheiro e
>> >>> >>>> pode sobrar para alguma outra coisa. Se a empresa contratada é
>> ruim,
>> >>> a
>> >>> >>>> galera terceirizada vai sofrer.
>> >>> >>>> E para vencer essas "licitações" quanto mais papel, certificação,
>> >>> sigla,
>> >>> >>>> melhor. Mas é só uma parte da realidade Brasileira e mundial.
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 10:43 PM, Daniel de Oliveira Mantovani
>> >>> >>>> <daniel.oliveira.mantovani at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> 2011/10/4 cleiton alves <cleitondebian at gmail.com>:
>> >>> >>>>> > Uma coisa é classica , estuda-se muito e paga-se pouco
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> Os caras que eu conheço que estudaram muito até onde eu sei não
>> >>> ganham
>> >>> >>>>> pouco não, nenhum deles. E todos eles acham que eles estudaram
>> >>> pouco.
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> >
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>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> --
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>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> --
>> >>> >>>> Tiago B. Peczenyj
>> >>> >>>> Linux User #405772
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> http://pacman.blog.br
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> =begin disclaimer
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>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>> --
>> >>> >>> Alexei "RUSSOZ" Znamensky | russoz EM gmail com |
>> http://russoz.org
>> >>> >>> GPG fingerprint = 42AB E78C B83A AE31 7D27  1CF3 C66F B5C7 71CA
>> 9F3C
>> >>> >>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/alexeiz | http://github.com/russoz
>> >>> >>> "I don't know... fly casual!" -- Han Solo
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>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> --
>> >>> >> ------------------------------------
>> >>> >> Hélder Máximo Botter Ribas
>> >>> >> ------------------------------------
>> >>> >> twitter: @hmbr
>> >>> >> ------------------------------------
>> >>> >>
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>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Alexei "RUSSOZ" Znamensky | russoz EM gmail com | http://russoz.org
>> >> GPG fingerprint = 42AB E78C B83A AE31 7D27  1CF3 C66F B5C7 71CA 9F3C
>> >> http://www.flickr.com/photos/alexeiz | http://github.com/russoz
>> >> "I don't know... fly casual!" -- Han Solo
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>>
>> --
>> cleiton alves
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-- 
Tiago B. Peczenyj
Linux User #405772

http://pacman.blog.br
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