tools of the trade ( was Re: [Charlotte.PM] find index of
dale at lancaster.hm
Thu Mar 24 09:00:28 PST 2005
I am definitely in favor of a 1500 piece craftsman professional tool set vs
the 20 piece "all you will ever need" screwdriver, pliers, socket set
approach. I do have one (possibly more if I think about it) pet peeve with
Perl and it's that Larry Wall decided that it was not necessary to have a
switch/case construct because "there are so many other ways to do the same
thing in Perl". Well, for us programmers coming from C (and possibly
----- Original Message -----
From: "diona kidd" <diona at studio12a.com>
To: "Dale Lancaster" <dale at lancaster.hm>
Cc: "William McKee" <william at knowmad.com>; <charlotte at pm.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:22 AM
Subject: tools of the trade ( was Re: [Charlotte.PM] find index of
>I definitely agree that compactness isn't always advantageous. I really
> value cleanliness and clever shortcuts. Seems like everyone has their
> growing bag of coding tricks. In any project, it's easy to use the wrong
> tool. I like all the options a richer language offers, even if it does
> increase the learning curve.
> Between SQL, XHTML, CSS, Perl, Templating systems, CPAN, etc...it's
> impossible to keep everything in your head. Plus, there's life too. :)
> - diona
> On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 08:49 -0500, Dale Lancaster wrote:
>> The ultimate "compact language" is Forth and that was just way too wierd
>> use as a serious lanuage. I am in agreement, more compact does not mean
>> more useful. I do believe that the most commonly used features should be
>> optimized and made as easy to use as possible. I think the grep()
>> is a good example, but much like a Craftsman tool screwdriver, you could
>> it for the wrong things, but fortunately not void your warranty :-).
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "William McKee" <william at knowmad.com>
>> To: "Dale Lancaster" <dale at lancaster.hm>
>> Cc: <charlotte at pm.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 6:09 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Charlotte.PM] find index of array element
>> > On Wed, Mar 23, 2005 at 12:45:24PM -0500, Dale Lancaster wrote:
>> >> I think the original requirement was to return the index in the
>> >> original
>> >> list of the matching element, not the actual element. I don't believe
>> >> the
>> >> below accomplishes that.
>> > You're right, it doesn't match the requirements. I was thinking form
>> > (she used the keywords grep and array) over function.
>> >> Funny, that your example would actually produce the same answer in my
>> >> test code, but only because perl is subtracting 1 from the value of
>> >> the element in the matching array.
>> > Yeah, that's sheer coincidence. Substituting chars for numbers makes it
>> > very clear.
>> >> This is probably as fast or faster than my original code and of course
>> >> doesn't parse the whole array and is much more readable and
>> >> maintainable
>> >> (and extensible).
>> > Although map and grep are very cool techniques, it's interesting to
>> > find
>> > ways in which they are not as efficient as just writing it out the long
>> > way (like I used to do before I understood these functions).
>> > Your point reminds me of a recent article I was reading by ESR while
>> > looking at the various F/OSS CMS products available. One of the
>> > benefits
>> > that he tauts when comparing Python to Python is the compactness of the
>> > Python language.
>> > I can see where there is some benefit to having to remember fewer
>> > commands to get your work done. At some point though, you're going to
>> > hit the limitations of the language. Sure, it's hard to fit all of
>> > Perl's functions much less the growing mass of modules on CPAN into
>> > your head. All-in-all, I'd prefer the richer language to the compact
>> > language. I presume most folks on this mailing list are of the same
>> > opinion; anyone care to proffer a counter-argument (even if you're not
>> > beholden to it, it might make for an interesting discussion).
>> > William
>> >  http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/3882
>> > --
>> > Knowmad Services Inc.
>> > http://www.knowmad.com
>> charlotte mailing list
>> charlotte at pm.org
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