From Peter at PSDT.com Mon Dec 4 11:24:57 2006 From: Peter at PSDT.com (Peter Scott) Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:24:57 -0800 Subject: [VPM] No Dec meeting Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20061204112341.02914cd0@mail.webquarry.com> Reminder: There will be no December Victoria Perl Mongers' meeting. We will resume January 16 with some material for beginners on arrays and hashes. -- Peter Scott Pacific Systems Design Technologies http://www.perldebugged.com/ http://www.perlmedic.com/ From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Wed Dec 6 03:37:25 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:37:25 -0800 Subject: [VPM] perl 5 and hyper operators on lists Message-ID: hi all, I am new to hyper operators....I have been studying them in a perl 6 book. Does using hyper operators,offer better performance, in manipulating lists, than using loops? Can I forget about loops altogether?....how complex can I make a hyper statment? Can Hyper operators be implemented in perl 5?..and will this still offer better performance than loops? what other operators can I use to make my programs loopless, and offer better performance? I am not as concerned about readability of code, just doing things efficiently the perl way. Thanks in advance for your input. -Jeremy A. _________________________________________________________________ Off to school, going on a trip, or moving? Windows Live (MSN) Messenger lets you stay in touch with friends and family wherever you go. Click here to find out how to sign up! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Wed Dec 6 03:56:37 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:56:37 -0800 Subject: [VPM] perl 5 and hyper operators on lists Message-ID: hi all, I am new to hyper operators....I have been studying them in a perl 6 book. Does using hyper operators,offer better performance, in manipulating lists, than using loops? Can I forget about loops altogether?....how complex can I make a hyper statment? Can Hyper operators be implemented in perl 5?..and will this still offer better performance than loops? what other operators can I use to make my programs loopless, and offer better performance? I am not as concerned about readability of code, just doing things efficiently the perl way. Thanks in advance for your input. -Jeremy A. _________________________________________________________________ Enter the "Telus Mobility Xbox a Day" contest for your chance to WIN! Telus Mobility is giving away an Microsoft Xbox? 360 every day from November 20 to December 31, 2006! Just download Windows Live (MSN) Messenger to your IM-capable TELUS mobile phone, and you could be a winner! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Wed Dec 6 23:30:17 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2006 23:30:17 -0800 Subject: [VPM] perl 5 and hyper operators on lists In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 3:37 AM -0800 12/6/06, Jer A wrote: >hi all, >I am new to hyper operators....I have been studying them in a perl 6 book. >Does using hyper operators,offer better performance, in manipulating lists, >than using loops? Hyper-operators have 2 main purposes, one of which is to allow more concise coding (which can reduce bugs), and another is to allow more optimizing by the Perl 6 implementation. When you use a hyper-op, you are saying more *what* you want done with an entire list and aren't specifying how to do it per se, which means the implementation can make some optimizations, including implicit multi-threading. So yes, they should be faster, or at least not slower, and your code is simpler anyway. The reduce-ops are similar in that respect. >Can I forget about loops altogether?....how complex can I make a hyper >statment? A hyper-operator is simply an ordinary operator iterated over a list, and that's about how complicated they get, though I think the current Perl 6 synopsis show that they may also recurse through multidimensional structures in some smart way, which is conceptually more complicated. Have a look at Synopsis 3, http://dev.perl.org/perl6/doc/design/syn/S03.html , which is much more up to date than any Perl 6 books, about operators; half-way down is the hyper-ops section. >Can Hyper operators be implemented in perl 5?..and will this still offer >better performance than loops? They can probably be implemented in Perl 5, but doing it faster will undoubtedly require an XS implementation. That said, the v6.pm implementation of Perl 6 over Perl 5 will have to make hyper-ops work somehow. >what other operators can I use to make my programs loopless, and offer >better performance? In Perl 6, there are also reduction operators, cross operators, junctive operators, which turn some loops into scalar-like expressions. In Perl 5 (and Perl 6), you have "map" and "grep" which let you do some loop-like things as an expression rather than a statement. >I am not as concerned about readability of code, just doing things >efficiently the perl way. Note, in general, if you want to ask questions about using Perl 6, there is a newish "Perl 6 Users" group just for that (List-Subscribe: mailto:perl6-users-subscribe at perl.org) ... if you're wanting to just apply Perl 6 isms to Perl 5, I'm less sure if that group is suitable. -- Darren Duncan From Peter at PSDT.com Thu Dec 7 08:59:05 2006 From: Peter at PSDT.com (Peter Scott) Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2006 08:59:05 -0800 Subject: [VPM] perl 5 and hyper operators on lists In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20061207085802.02a181d0@mail.webquarry.com> At 11:30 PM 12/6/2006, Darren Duncan wrote: > >Can Hyper operators be implemented in perl 5?..and will this still offer > >better performance than loops? > >They can probably be implemented in Perl 5, but doing it faster will >undoubtedly require an XS implementation. That said, the v6.pm >implementation of Perl 6 over Perl 5 will have to make hyper-ops work >somehow. The current ruling on P5P is that there will be no new operators added to Perl 5. // and ~~ have already been aded to 5.8.10-to-be, but that's it. Of course, never say Never... -- Peter Scott Pacific Systems Design Technologies http://www.perldebugged.com/ http://www.perlmedic.com/ From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Thu Dec 7 18:06:53 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 18:06:53 -0800 Subject: [VPM] P5P future plans (was Re: perl 5 and hyper operators on lists) In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20061207085802.02a181d0@mail.webquarry.com> References: <6.2.3.4.2.20061207085802.02a181d0@mail.webquarry.com> Message-ID: At 8:59 AM -0800 12/7/06, Peter Scott wrote: >At 11:30 PM 12/6/2006, Darren Duncan wrote: >> >Can Hyper operators be implemented in perl 5?..and will this still offer >> >better performance than loops? >> >>They can probably be implemented in Perl 5, but doing it faster will >>undoubtedly require an XS implementation. That said, the v6.pm >>implementation of Perl 6 over Perl 5 will have to make hyper-ops work >>somehow. > >The current ruling on P5P is that there will be no new operators added >to Perl 5. FYI, when I said "implemented in Perl 5", I was in no way suggesting that it be added to the Perl core itself; rather, I was saying more what I thought it would take to make an extension module for Perl 5 that provided hyper-operators. > // and ~~ have already been aded to 5.8.10-to-be, but >that's it. Of course, never say Never... On that note, I don't follow the P5P channels, but it looks like you do ... Can you tell me whether the P5P are still in feature-adding mode, or are they now in the stabilize-and-bugfix-for-release mode? Is there a ballpark for when 5.10.0 might be released? Also, is there likely to be another 5.8.x release first (now 10+ months since the last)? More generally, can you tell me where I can look for a P5P TODO document that shows things remaining in the 5.9.x branch, so I can look back to it and see things being ticked off over time? Also, while it looks like version.pm and Module::Build are in 5.9.x, which is nice, do you know if CPANPLUS (used by the CPAN Testers) is going to get included with it too (as I heard some time back), or are users still going to have to use CPAN.pm by default? -- Darren Duncan From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Thu Dec 7 19:43:44 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 19:43:44 -0800 Subject: [VPM] P5P future plans In-Reply-To: References: <6.2.3.4.2.20061207085802.02a181d0@mail.webquarry.com> Message-ID: At 6:06 PM -0800 12/7/06, Darren Duncan wrote: >At 8:59 AM -0800 12/7/06, Peter Scott wrote: >On that note, I don't follow the P5P channels, but it looks like you do ... > >Can you tell me whether the P5P are still in feature-adding mode, or >are they now in the stabilize-and-bugfix-for-release mode? Is there >a ballpark for when 5.10.0 might be released? Also, is there likely >to be another 5.8.x release first (now 10+ months since the last)? > >More generally, can you tell me where I can look for a P5P TODO >document that shows things remaining in the 5.9.x branch, so I can >look back to it and see things being ticked off over time? > >Also, while it looks like version.pm and Module::Build are in 5.9.x, >which is nice, do you know if CPANPLUS (used by the CPAN Testers) is >going to get included with it too (as I heard some time back), or are >users still going to have to use CPAN.pm by default? After sending the above, I was able to find some answers online that I was unable to find before. This P5P thread from about 2 weeks ago seems to collect the main issues: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/perl/porters/210400 So from that, I found what the main TODO items are, that CPANPLUS will indeed be added to the core soon, that a 5.9.5 release is imminent with a 5.9.6 (5.10.0-beta) to be released after 5.9.5 is tested with lots of CPAN. -- Darren Duncan From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Fri Dec 8 17:18:21 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 17:18:21 -0800 Subject: [VPM] P5P future plans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Has there been any mention of hyper-ops being added to this future release of perl 5, or is there a XS coded module from cpan, that performs the same way? -Jeremy A. >From: Darren Duncan >To: victoria-pm at pm.org >Subject: Re: [VPM] P5P future plans >Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 19:43:44 -0800 > >At 6:06 PM -0800 12/7/06, Darren Duncan wrote: > >At 8:59 AM -0800 12/7/06, Peter Scott wrote: > > >On that note, I don't follow the P5P channels, but it looks like you do >... > > > >Can you tell me whether the P5P are still in feature-adding mode, or > >are they now in the stabilize-and-bugfix-for-release mode? Is there > >a ballpark for when 5.10.0 might be released? Also, is there likely > >to be another 5.8.x release first (now 10+ months since the last)? > > > >More generally, can you tell me where I can look for a P5P TODO > >document that shows things remaining in the 5.9.x branch, so I can > >look back to it and see things being ticked off over time? > > > >Also, while it looks like version.pm and Module::Build are in 5.9.x, > >which is nice, do you know if CPANPLUS (used by the CPAN Testers) is > >going to get included with it too (as I heard some time back), or are > >users still going to have to use CPAN.pm by default? > >After sending the above, I was able to find some answers online that >I was unable to find before. > >This P5P thread from about 2 weeks ago seems to collect the main issues: > >http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/perl/porters/210400 > >So from that, I found what the main TODO items are, that CPANPLUS >will indeed be added to the core soon, that a 5.9.5 release is >imminent with a 5.9.6 (5.10.0-beta) to be released after 5.9.5 is >tested with lots of CPAN. > >-- Darren Duncan >_______________________________________________ >Victoria-pm mailing list >Victoria-pm at pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/victoria-pm _________________________________________________________________ Download now! Visit http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ to enter and see how cool it is to get Messenger with you on your cell phone. http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Fri Dec 8 21:07:12 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2006 21:07:12 -0800 Subject: [VPM] P5P future plans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 5:18 PM -0800 12/8/06, Jer A wrote: >Has there been any mention of hyper-ops being added to this future release >of perl 5, or is there a XS coded module from cpan, that performs the same >way? Quoth Peter Scott yesterday: >The current ruling on P5P is that there will be no new operators added >to Perl 5. // and ~~ have already been aded to 5.8.10-to-be, but >that's it. Of course, never say Never... I don't know anything further on this myself. -- Darren Duncan From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Sat Dec 9 01:58:24 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2006 01:58:24 -0800 Subject: [VPM] perl 5.8 threads and Thread::Pool Message-ID: hi all, I want to create a pool of perl 5.8 threads, but Thread::Pool was built for the old Thread implementation, and it does not work! is there a module for perl 5.8 that creates thread pools? Thanks in advance for your help. -Jer A. _________________________________________________________________ Off to school, going on a trip, or moving? Windows Live (MSN) Messenger lets you stay in touch with friends and family wherever you go. Click here to find out how to sign up! http://www.live.com/?mkt=en-ca From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Sat Dec 9 15:50:43 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2006 15:50:43 -0800 Subject: [VPM] simple thread pool creation was : perl 5.8 threads and Thread::Pool Message-ID: Hi all, Activestate only support v.0.1 of Thread-Pool, while the current module, 0.32 is not supported. The one provided in the activeperl repository (0.1) does not support perl 5.8 threads. How can I implement simple thread-pooling using perl 5.8 threads? I would need some way of injecting code into the loaded threads, have the ability to reuse threads, and keep track of thread slots available. A simple example would be great. I am not an expert when it comes to threads, just so you are aware. thanks, -Jer A _________________________________________________________________ Get free, personalized commercial-free online radio with MSN Radio powered by Pandora http://radio.msn.com/?icid=T002MSN03A07001 From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Sat Dec 16 12:34:34 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 12:34:34 -0800 Subject: [VPM] Pretty Syntax formatting problem for C-like code - Help!! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: hi all, I want to pretty up syntax indents of csharp/java/perl code. I want things to be properly indented between the "{" and "}". I have been trying to figure this out for a while, and would appreciate some help. Thanks in advance for any code that can do this. -Jer A. Example: class a { void method() { if(this) { for(;;) { } } else { } } void anothermethod() { } } _________________________________________________________________ Off to school, going on a trip, or moving? Windows Live (MSN) Messenger lets you stay in touch with friends and family wherever you go. Click here to find out how to sign up! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From Peter at psdt.com Thu Dec 21 07:18:05 2006 From: Peter at psdt.com (Peter Scott) Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:18:05 -0800 Subject: [VPM] Pretty Syntax formatting problem for C-like code - Help!! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 12:34 PM -0800 12/16/06, Jer A wrote: >hi all, > >I want to pretty up syntax indents of csharp/java/perl code. I want things >to be properly indented between the "{" and "}". For Perl, get Perl::Tidy from CPAN. For the others... Emacs? From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Tue Dec 26 22:38:54 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 22:38:54 -0800 Subject: [VPM] spliting lines using unpack Message-ID: I hear rumors that unpack is faster than split. suppose I have a very large string, (very very large) that contains "\r\n"'s eg- lines what code do i need to split lines into an array using unpack. thanks in advance for your help. -Jer A. _________________________________________________________________ Enter the "Telus Mobility Xbox a Day" contest for your chance to WIN! Telus Mobility is giving away an Microsoft Xbox? 360 every day from November 20 to December 31, 2006! Just download Windows Live (MSN) Messenger to your IM-capable TELUS mobile phone, and you could be a winner! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Tue Dec 26 22:39:24 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 22:39:24 -0800 Subject: [VPM] spliting lines using unpack Message-ID: I hear rumors that unpack is faster than split. suppose I have a very large string, (very very large) that contains "\r\n"'s eg- lines what code do i need to split lines into an array using unpack. thanks in advance for your help. -Jer A. _________________________________________________________________ Download now! Visit http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ to enter and see how cool it is to get Messenger with you on your cell phone. http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From abez at abez.ca Tue Dec 26 23:28:23 2006 From: abez at abez.ca (abez) Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 02:28:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: [VPM] spliting lines using unpack In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I don't want to be mean or anything but if you're using perl you shouldn't worry too much about performance. abram On Tue, 26 Dec 2006, Jer A wrote: > I hear rumors that unpack is faster than split. > > suppose I have a very large string, (very very large) that contains "\r\n"'s > eg- lines > > what code do i need to split lines into an array using unpack. > > > > thanks in advance for your help. > > -Jer A. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Enter the "Telus Mobility Xbox a Day" contest for your chance to WIN! Telus > Mobility is giving away an Microsoft Xbox? 360 every day from November 20 to > December 31, 2006! Just download Windows Live (MSN) Messenger to your > IM-capable TELUS mobile phone, and you could be a winner! > http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ > > From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Wed Dec 27 02:01:24 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 02:01:24 -0800 Subject: [VPM] spliting lines using unpack In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 10:38 PM -0800 12/26/06, Jer A wrote: >I hear rumors that unpack is faster than split. > >suppose I have a very large string, (very very large) that contains >"\r\n"'s eg- lines > >what code do i need to split lines into an array using unpack. > >thanks in advance for your help. AFAIK, unpack/pack is expressly for fixed-size records, and won't work for variable-width records like delimited ones probably are. Is this string the content of a disk file, or is it from somewhere else? If a file, you should usually just set the file input record separator to "\r\n" instead, so you don't vastly increase the amount of RAM you use by first reading the whole file into a string and then splitting it. And with very large data, using a lot more RAM has its own performance implications. At 2:28 AM -0500 12/27/06, abez wrote: >I don't want to be mean or anything but if you're using perl you shouldn't >worry too much about performance. That's a bad stereotype if there ever was one. Many operations in Perl are actually very fast, depending on what they are, since practically all the work for such is done with C code; eg, 90% as fast as native; or they are "fast enough", and performance concerns are often based on relative terms anyway. So it is perfectly fair to both use Perl and care about performance. -- Darren Duncan From Peter at PSDT.com Thu Dec 28 10:53:01 2006 From: Peter at PSDT.com (Peter Scott) Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 10:53:01 -0800 Subject: [VPM] spliting lines using unpack In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20061228105023.027b6678@mail.webquarry.com> At 11:28 PM 12/26/2006, abez wrote: >I don't want to be mean or anything but if you're using perl you shouldn't >worry too much about performance. But actually it is known that many Perl builtin functions are at least as fast as their C brethren because they are implemented in hand optimized C. Let me know if you desire a citation, but I'm sure you can find what I'm talking about. It's entirely likely that in this case the time required for either a split or an unpack will rival the best the poster can do by any other means. -- Peter Scott Pacific Systems Design Technologies http://www.perldebugged.com/ http://www.perlmedic.com/ From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Thu Dec 28 19:10:33 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:10:33 -0800 Subject: [VPM] GNU GPL vs. GNU LGPL Message-ID: what is the main difference between GPL and LGPL (in easy english) ? what are the advantages and disadvantages, including loopholes etc. -thanks in advance, for those who care to answer. Jer A. _________________________________________________________________ Download now! Visit http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ to enter and see how cool it is to get Messenger with you on your cell phone. http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From jeremygwa at hotmail.com Thu Dec 28 19:11:03 2006 From: jeremygwa at hotmail.com (Jer A) Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:11:03 -0800 Subject: [VPM] GNU GPL vs. GNU LGPL Message-ID: what is the main difference between GPL and LGPL (in easy english) ? what are the advantages and disadvantages, including loopholes etc. -thanks in advance, for those who care to answer. Jer A. _________________________________________________________________ Off to school, going on a trip, or moving? Windows Live (MSN) Messenger lets you stay in touch with friends and family wherever you go. Click here to find out how to sign up! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Thu Dec 28 19:11:14 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:11:14 -0800 Subject: [VPM] 2006 Jan 4th - January RCSS meeting Message-ID: Forwarded from the "Recreational Computer Science Society" mailing list. -- Darren Duncan ------------- Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 17:30:40 -0800 From: "Peter van Hardenberg" To: reccompsci at googlegroups.com, stege at cs.uvic.ca Subject: [reccompsci] RCSS meeting next week List-Id: List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: , Hello again everybody, this month's meeting will be held one week from today on Thursday, January 4th at 7:00PM in the same room we met in last month. (First lecture hall on your right as you enter the ECS building from the campus-side of the main lobby.) Aaron has promised to put a few demos on for our enjoyment while we wait for people to arrive which is always good. Our guest lecturer this month is Dr. Stege. She will be presenting a talk on her research into parameterizing computational complexity and teaching us how to write a program to play Minesweeper. I'll be talking a bit about the memory fragmentation paper I posted last week, with an emphasis on dlmalloc. dlmalloc is Doug Lea's memory allocation algorithm (hence the name) and is widely considered the one of the best-general purpose memory allocators in the world. If anyone else would like to present a talk on anything, there should be room for one more speaker. After the meeting, we'll head over to Felicita's to celebrate the end of the holidays and a return to the same old drudgery in a new colder and darker year. Hopefully there will be a good price on beer. -pvh -- Peter van Hardenberg Victoria, BC, Canada "Everything was beautiful, and nothing hurt." -- Kurt Vonnegut From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Thu Dec 28 19:30:28 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:30:28 -0800 Subject: [VPM] GNU GPL vs. GNU LGPL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 7:10 PM -0800 12/28/06, Jer A wrote: >what is the main difference between GPL and LGPL (in easy english) ? >what are the advantages and disadvantages, including loopholes etc. >-thanks in advance, for those who care to answer. The GPL and LGPL are essentially the same except that the LGPL grants an extra permission which the GPL doesn't. The GPL requires that if you distribute a GPL covered work along with your own work that depends on it, then the whole combination, including your work, has to be GPL-licensed. The LGPL says you don't have to make the combination GPL, and your own work has whatever license you want, though the LGPL covered work remains LGPL. With version 2 of each of those, both licenses are self-contained with all their text. With version 3 of each, the LGPL is explicitly just a GPL plus permissions, and you distribute copies of both licenses if you use LGPL. Version 3 hasn't been officially released yet, but should be no later than March of 2007. If you release your code LGPL, then others that make add-ons to it can release their code closed-source if they want, where if yours is GPL, then their add-ons have to have their code available too, if they distribute yours together. Personally, my approach is to use GPL for any of my important or truly significant stuff (such as my QDRDBMS program), with my own linking exception granted for free software (eg, Apache, Mozilla, public domain, ...) to keep their own licenses, but this doesn't extend to closed-source extensions ... those people can pay me for a proprietary license like with MySQL AB. I use LGPL for trivially simple things like my Locale::KeyedText library. I will be expressly using version 3 of both licenses when said licenses are done, most likely; meanwhile I am using "version 2 or later" with both. -- Darren Duncan From abez at abez.ca Fri Dec 29 08:40:14 2006 From: abez at abez.ca (abez) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 11:40:14 -0500 (EST) Subject: [VPM] GNU GPL vs. GNU LGPL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: GPL ensures that everyone who uses your code in all derivative forms will have the same rights as everyone else who ever used your code. No one will have a different license and all systems your code is included in will have to follow the same license (the GPL). Note that anyone can take your code and use it privately without releasing it. The GPL really doesn't matter to people who are not redistributing your code or their changes to your code. LGPL is a cop out, it allows people to use your code without making the rest of their code GPL, LGPL or so on, they only need to need to adhere to the LGPL when they change your code and then they release the changes as LGPL. This means your code can be included in proprietary software which is distributed. GPL forces everyone to play on the same playing field and ensures that future users will be granted the same rights. LGPL simply ensures that your code will be LGPL regardless of being linked to proprietary software. Using the GPL means that you can take any other GPL code and include it into your program with little effort and 0 licensing worries. For more information visit http://fsf.org. abram On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Jer A wrote: > what is the main difference between GPL and LGPL (in easy english) ? > what are the advantages and disadvantages, including loopholes etc. > > -thanks in advance, for those who care to answer. > > Jer A. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Off to school, going on a trip, or moving? Windows Live (MSN) Messenger lets > you stay in touch with friends and family wherever you go. Click here to > find out how to sign up! http://www.telusmobility.com/msnxbox/ > > _______________________________________________ > Victoria-pm mailing list > Victoria-pm at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/victoria-pm > From darren at DarrenDuncan.net Fri Dec 29 13:39:36 2006 From: darren at DarrenDuncan.net (Darren Duncan) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 13:39:36 -0800 Subject: [VPM] GNU GPL vs. GNU LGPL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 11:40 AM -0500 12/29/06, abez wrote: >GPL ensures that everyone who uses your code in all derivative forms will have >the same rights as everyone else who ever used your code. No one will have a >different license and all systems your code is included in will have to follow >the same license (the GPL). Note that anyone can take your code and use it >privately without releasing it. The GPL really doesn't matter to people who >are not redistributing your code or their changes to your code. > >LGPL is a cop out, it allows people to use your code without making >the rest of >their code GPL, LGPL or so on, they only need to need to adhere to the LGPL >when they change your code and then they release the changes as LGPL. This >means your code can be included in proprietary software which is distributed. > >GPL forces everyone to play on the same playing field and ensures that future >users will be granted the same rights. LGPL simply ensures that >your code will >be LGPL regardless of being linked to proprietary software. > >Using the GPL means that you can take any other GPL code and include it into >your program with little effort and 0 licensing worries. > >For more information visit http://fsf.org. Not the same words as I used, but that's absolutely right. And using the straight GPL *is* the best thing for you to do if you don't have a good reason to use something else. If I use anything non-GPL, it is to handle more complicated situations, but I typically just try to make GPL work for all situations as possible. -- Darren Duncan From Peter at PSDT.com Fri Dec 29 17:28:00 2006 From: Peter at PSDT.com (Peter Scott) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:28:00 -0800 Subject: [VPM] January and February Victoria Perl Mongers meetings Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20061206170755.024d3c48@mail.webquarry.com> Following specific requests from members, our next two meetings will deal with these topics: January 16: Array operations; Introduction to hashes February: Installing CPAN modules I'll be presenting, drawing materials from my classes and books. These are aimed at beginners but there will be a few things thrown in there for not-so-beginners. Anyone who thinks the basic stuff like, say, lists, is beneath them is invited to determine in advance what the following program will print and then see how well they did :-) #!/usr/local/bin/perl -l use strict; use warnings; my $x; $x = (5, 6, 7); print " 1: $x"; ($x) = (5, 6, 7); print " 2: $x"; $x = 5..7; print " 3: $x"; ($x) = 5..7; print " 4: $x"; $x = foo(); print " 5: $x"; ($x) = foo(); print " 6: $x"; $x = bar(); print " 7: $x"; ($x) = bar(); print " 8: $x"; $x = () = (5, 6, 7); print " 9: $x"; $x = () = 5..7; print "10: $x"; sub foo { return (5, 6, 7); } sub bar { my @a = (5, 6, 7); return @a; } -- Peter Scott Pacific Systems Design Technologies http://www.perldebugged.com/ http://www.perlmedic.com/