From doomvox at gmail.com  Thu Oct  1 12:24:22 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2020 12:24:22 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 10/4 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXWFK4mRinPDc1ixO_dKKSr_8vgtGo9WNu2erAAfD2kt0Q@mail.gmail.com>

Where is the wisdom we have lost in knowledge? Where is the knowledge
we have lost in information? The Raku Study Group.

October 4th, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88535076025?pwd=MHBOTDltVitVMlh4R2Z5WUFaSDYwQT09
Passcode: 4RakuRoll

RSVPs are helpful, though not necessary:
https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/273646647/

From doomvox at gmail.com  Fri Oct  9 20:08:08 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2020 20:08:08 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 10/11 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXX2s9Z=mWNHd=vQOx+ciA0yO2vr+KWKFGHPtojr1RG31A@mail.gmail.com>

"You engineers are all mystics." -- Bruce Sterling, "Green Days in
Brunei" (1985)

And so, the SF Perl Raku Study Group:

October 11th, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/83672832845?pwd=WWs0Wm5GaDUyN3RkQkZRM2QzMnhzUT09
Passcode: 4RakuRoll


RSVPs can be useful, though they're not needed:
https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/273839687/

From dpchrist at holgerdanske.com  Sat Oct 10 21:05:37 2020
From: dpchrist at holgerdanske.com (David Christensen)
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2020 21:05:37 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] Programmer's guide to Perl I/O
Message-ID: <681d7232-d768-3ec5-2fb0-2ad5531aa340@holgerdanske.com>

sanfrancisco-pm:

I am looking for a programmer's guide to input/ output on current 
versions of Perl:

- Debian 9.13 -- Perl 5.24.1

- FreeBSD 12.1-RELEASE-p10 -- Perl 5.30.3

- macOS 10.15.6 -- Perl 5.18.4


I feel that I need to understand the "big picture", the details -- 
"layers", binary/ character mode, encoding (UTF-8), etc., -- and the 
various generalized forms -- console, files, and network connections, 
etc..  I am looking for a style of presentation that covers the 
principles and concepts of I/O in general, and then covers the design 
and implementation of the Perl I/O subsystem(s) specifically.  While I 
would expect such to contain examples, I am not looking for a tutorial. 
A practical goal is to learn how to use PerlIO::*, IO::*, and/or other 
modules effectively.


I suspect that my printed books are outdated, but I would appreciate any 
relevant citations:

- "Programming Perl" 4 e.

- "Learning Perl" 2 e.

- "Intermediate Perl" 1 e.

- "Mastering Perl" 1 e.

- "Advanced Perl Programming" 1 e.

- "Perl Cookbook" 2 e.

- Others


Suggestions?


David

From doomvox at gmail.com  Sat Oct 10 22:47:28 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2020 22:47:28 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] Programmer's guide to Perl I/O
In-Reply-To: <681d7232-d768-3ec5-2fb0-2ad5531aa340@holgerdanske.com>
References: <681d7232-d768-3ec5-2fb0-2ad5531aa340@holgerdanske.com>
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXUqpnvO24uthUFAfPnWVHn4UXdoCuWkoDgv7Ac-ADTkaQ@mail.gmail.com>

Have you looked at the perlapio page?

  https://perldoc.perl.org/perlapio

If you want some help understanding unicode and i/o layers I might be
able to help with that, but I suspect you want to drill down deeper
than I've gone into what's going on-- e.g. it occurs to me that I
don't even know how big your buffer is if you use standard buffered
output.


David Christensen <dpchrist at holgerdanske.com> wrote:
> sanfrancisco-pm:
>
> I am looking for a programmer's guide to input/ output on current
> versions of Perl:
>
> - Debian 9.13 -- Perl 5.24.1
>
> - FreeBSD 12.1-RELEASE-p10 -- Perl 5.30.3
>
> - macOS 10.15.6 -- Perl 5.18.4
>
>
> I feel that I need to understand the "big picture", the details --
> "layers", binary/ character mode, encoding (UTF-8), etc., -- and the
> various generalized forms -- console, files, and network connections,
> etc..  I am looking for a style of presentation that covers the
> principles and concepts of I/O in general, and then covers the design
> and implementation of the Perl I/O subsystem(s) specifically.  While I
> would expect such to contain examples, I am not looking for a tutorial.
> A practical goal is to learn how to use PerlIO::*, IO::*, and/or other
> modules effectively.
>
>
> I suspect that my printed books are outdated, but I would appreciate any
> relevant citations:
>
> - "Programming Perl" 4 e.
>
> - "Learning Perl" 2 e.
>
> - "Intermediate Perl" 1 e.
>
> - "Mastering Perl" 1 e.
>
> - "Advanced Perl Programming" 1 e.
>
> - "Perl Cookbook" 2 e.
>
> - Others
>
>
> Suggestions?
>
>
> David
> _______________________________________________
> SanFrancisco-pm mailing list
> SanFrancisco-pm at pm.org
> https://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/sanfrancisco-pm
>
> --
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to doom+unsubscribe at kzsu.stanford.edu.
>
>

From dpchrist at holgerdanske.com  Sat Oct 10 23:34:00 2020
From: dpchrist at holgerdanske.com (David Christensen)
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2020 23:34:00 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] Programmer's guide to Perl I/O
In-Reply-To: <CAFfgvXUqpnvO24uthUFAfPnWVHn4UXdoCuWkoDgv7Ac-ADTkaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <681d7232-d768-3ec5-2fb0-2ad5531aa340@holgerdanske.com>
 <CAFfgvXUqpnvO24uthUFAfPnWVHn4UXdoCuWkoDgv7Ac-ADTkaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <22e9c9bf-0acb-467f-fe20-1d1187bfd87e@holgerdanske.com>

On 2020-10-10 22:47, Joseph Brenner wrote:

> David Christensen wrote:

>> I am looking for a programmer's guide to input/ output on current 
>> versions of Perl:

>> I feel that I need to understand the "big picture", the details -- 
>> "layers", binary/ character mode, encoding (UTF-8), etc., -- and
>> the various generalized forms -- console, files, and network
>> connections, etc..  I am looking for a style of presentation that
>> covers the principles and concepts of I/O in general, and then
>> covers the design and implementation of the Perl I/O subsystem(s)
>> specifically.  While I would expect such to contain examples, I am
>> not looking for a tutorial. A practical goal is to learn how to use
>> PerlIO::*, IO::*, and/or other modules effectively.

> Have you looked at the perlapio page?
> 
> https://perldoc.perl.org/perlapio
> 
> If you want some help understanding unicode and i/o layers I might
> be able to help with that, but I suspect you want to drill down
> deeper than I've gone into what's going on-- e.g. it occurs to me
> that I don't even know how big your buffer is if you use standard
> buffered output.

Thanks for the link.  :-)


I have been reading a related document that cross-links with the above:

     https://perldoc.perl.org/perliol


Both cover an important piece of the puzzle, and are probably the 
canonical documents for understanding the I/O layer system.  So, they 
are useful for those details.


Both appear to be C/XS.  I am hoping to work in pure Perl.


There are some key points related to 'open' and 'binmode', and advice 
for UTF-8.


Using the "blind men and an elephant" parable, there seems to be a fair 
number of documents that describe various details of Perl I/O; I desire 
a document that describes the whole elephant.


David

From james at actionmessage.com  Tue Oct 13 16:02:20 2020
From: james at actionmessage.com (James Briggs)
Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2020 16:02:20 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] Programmer's guide to Perl I/O
In-Reply-To: <22e9c9bf-0acb-467f-fe20-1d1187bfd87e@holgerdanske.com>
References: <681d7232-d768-3ec5-2fb0-2ad5531aa340@holgerdanske.com>
 <CAFfgvXUqpnvO24uthUFAfPnWVHn4UXdoCuWkoDgv7Ac-ADTkaQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <22e9c9bf-0acb-467f-fe20-1d1187bfd87e@holgerdanske.com>
Message-ID: <20201013224822.M88250@actionmessage.com>

David:

1) Your question is oddly specific. I haven't seen any detailed
perl io document coming up in the past 2 decades, likely because
anybody who cared about disk IO performance would just use C (like me.)

You may have to write your own benchmarks and write your own guide ...

2) What we did at Yahoo back in the day to characterize database
performance was to compare wire speed to database feature speed, and
then profile and understand the db bottlenecks.

You may want to write a perl io test suite and run it on say a
spinning hard drive (slow enough to contrast) and see what the numbers
tell you. Though of course, it's really the underlying C/glibc doing
any heavy-duty work.

Folks:

a) I'm doing a bunch of REST API client and server programming in perl
this week with OpenAPI, so let me know of any questions about that area.

https://github.com/RackPing/api_client_samples

b) Also, I'm associated with RackPing Monitoring/Observability.
You can sign up for a free monitoring account with RackPing:
https://www.RackPing.com/

Thanks, James.

On Sat, 10 Oct 2020 23:34:00 -0700, David Christensen wrote
> On 2020-10-10 22:47, Joseph Brenner wrote:
> 
> > David Christensen wrote:
> 
> >> I am looking for a programmer's guide to input/ output on current 
> >> versions of Perl:
> 
> >> I feel that I need to understand the "big picture", the details -- 
> >> "layers", binary/ character mode, encoding (UTF-8), etc., -- and
> >> the various generalized forms -- console, files, and network
> >> connections, etc..  I am looking for a style of presentation that
> >> covers the principles and concepts of I/O in general, and then
> >> covers the design and implementation of the Perl I/O subsystem(s)
> >> specifically.  While I would expect such to contain examples, I am
> >> not looking for a tutorial. A practical goal is to learn how to use
> >> PerlIO::*, IO::*, and/or other modules effectively.
> 
> > Have you looked at the perlapio page?
> > 
> > https://perldoc.perl.org/perlapio
> > 
> > If you want some help understanding unicode and i/o layers I might
> > be able to help with that, but I suspect you want to drill down
> > deeper than I've gone into what's going on-- e.g. it occurs to me
> > that I don't even know how big your buffer is if you use standard
> > buffered output.
> 
> Thanks for the link.  :-)
> 
> I have been reading a related document that cross-links with the above:
> 
>      https://perldoc.perl.org/perliol
> 
> Both cover an important piece of the puzzle, and are probably the 
> canonical documents for understanding the I/O layer system.  So, 
> they are useful for those details.
> 
> Both appear to be C/XS.  I am hoping to work in pure Perl.
> 
> There are some key points related to 'open' and 'binmode', and 
> advice for UTF-8.
> 
> Using the "blind men and an elephant" parable, there seems to be a 
> fair number of documents that describe various details of Perl I/O; 
> I desire a document that describes the whole elephant.
> 
> David

From doomvox at gmail.com  Thu Oct 15 19:33:13 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2020 19:33:13 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 10/18 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXX2KFix9tpo7Hyo-4dMFva8PS7yHa2cw+1dU+XeFkR0ow@mail.gmail.com>

"... I collected the instruments of life around me, that I might
infuse a spark of
being into the lifeless thing that lay at my feet."

The Raku Study Group
October 18th, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:

https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89020855442?pwd=VitIMS9pU1g5QWl2eEFSN3RGTS82UT09

Passcode: 4RakuRoll

RSVPs helpful, though not required:

https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/273968180/

From doomvox at gmail.com  Sat Oct 24 14:04:49 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2020 14:04:49 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 10/25 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXU-uZboB7gG0psmMKkikarF9ZwmNRAWW4Z_i3kROQw-Dw@mail.gmail.com>

With great power, comes the Raku Study group.

October 25th, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:

https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84087845936?pwd=OXlkQ1UxRGw4bHNoUmZwMlE5dDBndz09

Passcode: 4RakuRoll

https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/274150568/

From doomvox at gmail.com  Thu Oct 29 18:52:26 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2020 18:52:26 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 11/01 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXXjLtqZPH-WNt-cYOh29WFF=yXzEpC9CAuOW_PXBBSdog@mail.gmail.com>

"Man or Child, Stong or Weak, None of those matter
once you are out at sea!"  -- Usopp ("One Piece")

The Raku Study Group.

November 1st, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84566910601?pwd=R0ppbC9JRm5rV0hCdTJISkQ0Rml0QT09

Passcode: 4RakuRoll

RSVPs are useful, though not needed:
https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/274271613/

From doomvox at gmail.com  Thu Oct 29 18:57:11 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2020 18:57:11 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] Silicon Valley Perl seeking speakers
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXU=Wo1=PgtzMHR+BUpn3ZBXfkwRo00M7TYvUnPj8=bstg@mail.gmail.com>

Lambert Lum of the Silicon Valley Perl group asked me to forward
an announcement:

Silicon Valley Perl meetup group is seeking a Perl/Raku lecturer
for its presentation, "Quantum::Superpositions". In Perl5, it's
called Quantum::Superpositions. In Raku, it's called
junctions. The presentation is scheduled for Thursday Dec 3,
6:30PM to 7:45PM, as an online meeting
'https://meet.google.com/kwk-augf-ted';. The lecturer is
encouraged to transition from Perl5 to Raku to discuss
junctions. The lecturer is free to shill for Raku as time
permits, even venturing from junctions to other Raku features. At
7:45pm the lecture will end, so that we may conduct elections. If
you wish to volunteer to be the Perl/Raku lecturer for
"Quantum::Superpositions", please contact Lambert Lum,
emceelam at gmail.com

From doomvox at gmail.com  Fri Oct 30 22:02:22 2020
From: doomvox at gmail.com (Joseph Brenner)
Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2020 22:02:22 -0700
Subject: [sf-perl] The SF Perl Raku Study Group, 11/01 at 1pm PDT
Message-ID: <CAFfgvXWGZACUiC-ZjZhZsTQJiSuMUE4Bm=8AnQ4UsAdXV5NXUg@mail.gmail.com>

And one more time (with a corrected meetup link this time):

"Man or Child, Stong or Weak, None of those matter
once you are out at sea!"  -- Usopp ("One Piece")

The Raku Study Group.

November 1st, 1pm in California, 9pm in the UK

Zoom meeting link:
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/84566910601?pwd=R0ppbC9JRm5rV0hCdTJISkQ0Rml0QT09

Passcode: 4RakuRoll

RSVPs are useful, though not needed:
https://www.meetup.com/San-Francisco-Perl/events/274297040/