From gorthx at gmail.com Mon Dec 1 07:49:55 2008 From: gorthx at gmail.com (gabrielle) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 07:49:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Pdx-pm] Fwd: Winter Coders' Social II - Dec 9, 2008 In-Reply-To: <48bb92b0812010739o62923274te8e1c25fa53f0210@mail.gmail.com> References: <48bb92b0812010739o62923274te8e1c25fa53f0210@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: The 2008 Winter Coders' Social is next week. ?If you missed last year's, you missed out! Date: Tuesday, 9 December Time: 7pm - 10pm Place: Cubespace (http://cubespacepdx.com/) Food: Some beverages will be provided. Potluck signup: ?http://tinyurl.com/coders-social-potluck-form Current potluck list:http://tinyurl.com/coders-social-potluck-list Fun: We'll be playing games, like last year, so bring 'em! There will be a programming competition! Any language welcome, no particular toolkits or api skills necessary. These'll be problems that just require thought. If enough of you are interested and bring a language that you're only vaguely familiar with, we'll have a separate league for language newbies. Prizes? Bragging rights! Plus a surprise or two. Hope to see you there! gabrielle P.S.: We will need a cleanup crew immediately following the party; ?if you don't have to split right away, we'd appreciate your help. :) From enobacon at gmail.com Wed Dec 3 13:11:46 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 13:11:46 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting Message-ID: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> Hi all, Given the coders' social of the day before next Wednesday and the lack of a speaker, I think we will have no December meeting this year, at least not in the regularly scheduled time and place. --Eric -- "You can't win. You can't break even. You can't quit." --Ginsberg's Restatement of the Three Laws of Thermodynamics --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com Thu Dec 4 03:16:16 2008 From: publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com (Ovid) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 03:16:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> ----- Original Message ---- > Given the coders' social of the day before next Wednesday and the lack > of a speaker, I think we will have no December meeting this year, at > least not in the regularly scheduled time and place. Just curious, but when I took over, I made sure we had meetings every month for a year, even if it was only a social. Subsequent Josh's have all held to this, as far as I know. Is this the first month that it will be skipped? That would be sad :( Cheers, Ovid -- Buy the book - http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/perlhks/ Tech blog - http://use.perl.org/~Ovid/journal/ Twitter - http://twitter.com/OvidPerl Official Perl 6 Wiki - http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6 From merlyn at stonehenge.com Thu Dec 4 05:15:52 2008 From: merlyn at stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 05:15:52 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting In-Reply-To: <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> (publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com's message of "Thu, 4 Dec 2008 03:16:16 -0800 (PST)") References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <86skp49j3r.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> >>>>> "Ovid" == Ovid writes: Ovid> Just curious, but when I took over, I made sure we had meetings every Ovid> month for a year, even if it was only a social. Subsequent Josh's have Ovid> all held to this, as far as I know. Is this the first month that it Ovid> will be skipped? That would be sad :( Yes, clearly because Perl is dying. :-) -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion From pagaltzis at gmx.de Thu Dec 4 06:48:05 2008 From: pagaltzis at gmx.de (Aristotle Pagaltzis) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 15:48:05 +0100 Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting In-Reply-To: <86skp49j3r.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <86skp49j3r.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> Message-ID: <20081204144805.GG19319@klangraum.plasmasturm.org> * Randal L. Schwartz [2008-12-04 14:20]: > Yes, clearly because Perl is dying. > > :-) Smalltalk is eating our lunch, obviously. :-) Regards, -- Aristotle Pagaltzis // From keithl at kl-ic.com Thu Dec 4 07:09:18 2008 From: keithl at kl-ic.com (Keith Lofstrom) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 07:09:18 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting In-Reply-To: <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20081204150918.GA11700@gate.kl-ic.com> > > > Given the coders' social of the day before next Wednesday and the lack > > of a speaker, I think we will have no December meeting this year, at > > least not in the regularly scheduled time and place. > On Thu, Dec 04, 2008 at 03:16:16AM -0800, Ovid wrote: > Just curious, but when I took over, I made sure we had meetings every > month for a year, even if it was only a social. ... Reparse the "Given the coder's social ... " part. There is a meeting, it just involves a larger range of coders - no doubt in response to the smaller percentage likely to show up for a Perl-only meeting at this time of year. Of course, at the end of the social, the superiority of Perl will convert all those coders into Perl coders, and the social will extend more than 24 hours as they absorb every drop of brilliance that their new Perl gurus can provide. So the second Wednesday meeting is still happening, it is just beginning 24 hours sooner than normal. Bring lots of caffeine. Keith -- Keith Lofstrom keithl at keithl.com Voice (503)-520-1993 KLIC --- Keith Lofstrom Integrated Circuits --- "Your Ideas in Silicon" Design Contracting in Bipolar and CMOS - Analog, Digital, and Scan ICs From igal at pragmaticraft.com Thu Dec 4 10:06:45 2008 From: igal at pragmaticraft.com (Igal Koshevoy) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 10:06:45 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] no Dec. meeting In-Reply-To: <20081204150918.GA11700@gate.kl-ic.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <311923.60598.qm@web65701.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20081204150918.GA11700@gate.kl-ic.com> Message-ID: <49381C35.6070604@pragmaticraft.com> Keith Lofstrom wrote: > Of course, at the end of the social, the superiority of Perl will > convert all those coders into Perl coders, and the social will > extend more than 24 hours as they absorb every drop of brilliance > that their new Perl gurus can provide. So the second Wednesday > meeting is still happening, it is just beginning 24 hours sooner > than normal. > Exactly. It'll be just another normal Perl meeting. At a slightly different time. With some extra people. A few blocks over. With a coding contest and other opportunities to evangelize and show off Perl. :) > Bring lots of caffeine. > Or rely on CubeSpace, they offers a wide variety of complimentary caffeinated beverages, including soda, coffee and tea. -igal From enobacon at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 11:07:48 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 11:07:48 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] s/Dec. meeting/coders' social/ In-Reply-To: <49381C35.6070604@pragmaticraft.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <20081204150918.GA11700@gate.kl-ic.com> <49381C35.6070604@pragmaticraft.com> Message-ID: <200812041107.48320.enobacon@gmail.com> # from Igal Koshevoy # on Thursday 04 December 2008 10:06: >Exactly. It'll be just another normal Perl meeting. At a slightly >different time. With some extra people. A few blocks over. With a > coding contest and other opportunities to evangelize and show off > Perl. :) Yes. Perhaps I didn't articulate that clearly. Hopefully everyone can manage to make it Tuesday. http://calagator.org/events/1250456151 If anyone is tied to a Wednesday time slot and wants to meet at the Lucky Lab for beers, please speak up and you might find that you are not alone. --Eric -- Moving pianos is dangerous. Moving pianos are dangerous. Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo. --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From jaleto at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 12:00:29 2008 From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 12:00:29 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] s/Dec. meeting/coders' social/ In-Reply-To: <200812041107.48320.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <20081204150918.GA11700@gate.kl-ic.com> <49381C35.6070604@pragmaticraft.com> <200812041107.48320.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0812041200x65d8e4b8kb21989815790a24b@mail.gmail.com> Howdy, I would like to have a regularly scheduled PDX.pm meeting this month and I am willing to give a talk as punishment for missing the last one. I will tentatively call it "Getting Involved with Rakudo (A Flavor of Perl 6)". I would like to gear it more towards a "hack session" where there is a small "briefing" at the beginning of the meeting (like 5 minutes) then people start hacking away, working on what they want to. This is a good time for people to put some ideas on the wiki of what they want to learn about Rakudo or what they want to hack on. The end of the meeting will be a short wrap-up where people voice there experience on working on Rakudo (what needs to be made easier? what rocks? what sucks? what do you want to work on next time?). I personally would like to use Rakudo in production as soon as possible, so why not hack on it now and help it out the door? Cheers, On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > # from Igal Koshevoy > # on Thursday 04 December 2008 10:06: > >>Exactly. It'll be just another normal Perl meeting. At a slightly >>different time. With some extra people. A few blocks over. With a >> coding contest and other opportunities to evangelize and show off >> Perl. :) > > Yes. Perhaps I didn't articulate that clearly. Hopefully everyone can > manage to make it Tuesday. > > http://calagator.org/events/1250456151 > > If anyone is tied to a Wednesday time slot and wants to meet at the > Lucky Lab for beers, please speak up and you might find that you are > not alone. > > --Eric > -- > Moving pianos is dangerous. > Moving pianos are dangerous. > Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo. > --------------------------------------------------- > http://scratchcomputing.com > --------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- [---------------------] Jonathan Leto jaleto at gmail.com From enobacon at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 12:12:25 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 12:12:25 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] s/Dec. meeting/coders' social and then a hackfest/ In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0812041200x65d8e4b8kb21989815790a24b@mail.gmail.com> References: <200812031311.47043.enobacon@gmail.com> <200812041107.48320.enobacon@gmail.com> <9aaadf9c0812041200x65d8e4b8kb21989815790a24b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200812041212.25859.enobacon@gmail.com> # from Jonathan Leto # on Thursday 04 December 2008 12:00: >I would like to have a regularly scheduled PDX.pm meeting this month >and I am willing to give a talk as punishment for missing the last >one. I will tentatively call it "Getting Involved with Rakudo (A >Flavor of Perl 6)" You're on. --Eric -- Never ascribe to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity. --Napoleon Bonaparte --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From chromatic at wgz.org Fri Dec 5 14:13:48 2008 From: chromatic at wgz.org (chromatic) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:13:48 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] January Meeting Message-ID: <200812051413.48521.chromatic@wgz.org> I'm happy to talk about "How a Virtual Machine Works", if anyone's interested. I'll try to keep it at a high level, but I'll explain: - parsing - conversion to execution forms - memory management - dispatch and dispatch techniques - JIT - calling conventions - opcodes/bytecode - interoperability - optimization strategies It'll probably be Perl 5 and Parrot specific (as those are the two examples I know best), but a lot of the techniques work similarly in other VMs (Python, JVM, CLR, Lua virtual machine, Tamarin, V8) -- and it's interesting to know how things work, especially when people start talking about JITs and tagging and trace trees and SSA. I may also be able to scare up some books to give away. -- c From igal at pragmaticraft.com Fri Dec 5 14:25:34 2008 From: igal at pragmaticraft.com (Igal Koshevoy) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 14:25:34 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] January Meeting In-Reply-To: <200812051413.48521.chromatic@wgz.org> References: <200812051413.48521.chromatic@wgz.org> Message-ID: <4939AA5E.5070909@pragmaticraft.com> chromatic wrote: > I'm happy to talk about "How a Virtual Machine Works", if anyone's interested. > I'll try to keep it at a high level, but I'll explain: > > - parsing > - conversion to execution forms > - memory management > - dispatch and dispatch techniques > - JIT > - calling conventions > - opcodes/bytecode > - interoperability > - optimization strategies > > It'll probably be Perl 5 and Parrot specific (as those are the two examples I > know best), but a lot of the techniques work similarly in other VMs (Python, > JVM, CLR, Lua virtual machine, Tamarin, V8) -- and it's interesting to know > how things work, especially when people start talking about JITs and tagging > and trace trees and SSA. > > I may also be able to scare up some books to give away. > Sounds interesting to me. We're also covering a related topic at the next pdxfunc meeting: http://calagator.org/events/1250456023 > Portland Functional Programmers Study Group > Monday, December 8, 2008 from 7?9pm, CubeSpace > > Jim Blandy will present trace-based just-in-time compilation > techniques, how they're being used in his work at Mozilla with the > SpiderMonkey JavaScript implementation, and how these can be applied > to functional programming languages. Jim is a contributor to GNU > Emacs, Guile, GDB, EGLIBC, Mozilla SpiderMonkey, Subversion, and others. -igal From marvin at rectangular.com Fri Dec 5 14:39:43 2008 From: marvin at rectangular.com (Marvin Humphrey) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:39:43 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] January Meeting In-Reply-To: <200812051413.48521.chromatic@wgz.org> References: <200812051413.48521.chromatic@wgz.org> Message-ID: <20081205223942.GA26124@rectangular.com> On Fri, Dec 05, 2008 at 02:13:48PM -0800, chromatic wrote: > I'm happy to talk about "How a Virtual Machine Works", if anyone's interested. Damn, I wish I was still in Oregon. I would have loved to attend this talk. Marvin Humphrey From gorthx at gmail.com Mon Dec 8 12:33:13 2008 From: gorthx at gmail.com (gabrielle) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 12:33:13 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Reminder: Coders' Social tomorrow evening! Message-ID: <48bb92b0812081233i6421a23n5ced83fe8754964@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tuesday, 9 December Time: 7pm - 10pm Place: Cubespace (http://cubespacepdx.com/) http://calagator.org/events/1250456151 Last December, many of the local software developer User Groups banded together and had a party (instead of the regular meetings). It was known as the Winter Coders Social. http://www.flickr.com/photos/tags/pdxcoderssocial/?page=3 In August, we had a Summer Coder's Social as the outdoor and sunny successor! http://www.flickr.com/photos/tags/pdxcoderssocial/ Now, we're having a second Winter Coders' Social. Good and geeky times will be had by all. Come join us. Bring yourself, games if you have them, and a dish to share. Food: Some beverages will be provided. Potluck signup: http://tinyurl.com/coders-social-potluck-form Current potluck list: http://tinyurl.com/coders-social-potluck-list Fun: We'll be playing games, like last year, so bring 'em! There will be a programming competition! Any language welcome, no particular toolkits or api skills necessary. These'll be problems that just require thought. If enough of you are interested and bring a language that you're only vaguely familiar with, we'll have a separate league for language newbies. Prizes? Bragging rights! Plus a surprise or two. Hope to see you there! gabrielle P.S.: We will need a cleanup crew immediately following the party; if you don't have to split right away, we'd appreciate your help. :) From enobacon at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 00:23:34 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Seven till Seven) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:23:34 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Perl 6 workshop - December meeting tonight Message-ID: <200812100023.34253.enobacon@gmail.com> Wed. December 10th, 6:53pm at FreeGeek -- 1731 SE 10th Ave. Topic: Getting Involved with Rakudo (A Flavor of Perl 6) Speaker: Jonathon Leto This will be a "hack session" where there is a small "briefing" at the beginning of the meeting, then people start hacking away and working on what they want to. This is a good time for people to put some ideas on the wiki of what they want to learn about Rakudo or what they want to hack on. http://portland.pm.org/kwiki/index.cgi?December2008Meeting As always, the meeting will be followed by social hour at the Lucky Lab. -- http://pdx.pm.org From enobacon at gmail.com Thu Dec 11 15:54:20 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:54:20 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Padre Message-ID: <200812111554.20237.enobacon@gmail.com> Gabor's editor is turning into a pretty interesting project. See Adam's write-up here: http://use.perl.org/~Alias/journal/38060 And of course, the code should be installable via your friendly (and recently upgraded!) CPAN client: http://search.cpan.org/dist/Padre/ --Eric -- Moving pianos is dangerous. Moving pianos are dangerous. Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo. --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From jd at commandprompt.com Fri Dec 12 12:04:09 2008 From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 12:04:09 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Perl5 is alive Message-ID: <1229112249.7198.75.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org> Hello, Matt S. Trout (of Catalyst/DBIx::Class fame) gave a talk at PostgreSQL Conference West in Portland on why Perl5 is alive. We just got the video up if people are interested: http://www.postgresqlconference.org/2008/west/talks/#perl5_is_alive Sincerely, Joshua D. Drake -- PostgreSQL Consulting, Development, Support, Training 503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/ The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997 From enobacon at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 10:05:46 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:05:46 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods Message-ID: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> Hi all, Yes, this is still alpha, but the coolness/heardofit ratio is entirely too large: http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?Method::Signatures (Backstory for those who missed the meeting: we had a "your most frustrating thing when learning Perl" round during the introductions and subroutine prototypes were mentioned.) --Eric -- Turns out the optimal technique is to put it in reverse and gun it. --Steven Squyres (on challenges in interplanetary robot navigation) --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From erik at hollensbe.org Mon Dec 15 10:30:25 2008 From: erik at hollensbe.org (Erik Hollensbe) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:30:25 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods In-Reply-To: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4946A241.2020607@hollensbe.org> Eric Wilhelm wrote: > Hi all, > > Yes, this is still alpha, but the coolness/heardofit ratio is entirely > too large: > > http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?Method::Signatures > > (Backstory for those who missed the meeting: we had a "your most > frustrating thing when learning Perl" round during the introductions > and subroutine prototypes were mentioned.) > > --Eric > Yeah, I remember Schwern mentioning it on IRC and my excitement/discipline ratio started to get too large. Has this been talked about at a meeting? I'm wondering what the catch is, if any. -Erik From hdp.perl.pm.pdx at weftsoar.net Mon Dec 15 10:16:25 2008 From: hdp.perl.pm.pdx at weftsoar.net (Hans Dieter Pearcey) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:16:25 -0500 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods In-Reply-To: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081215181625.GB31656@glaive.weftsoar.net> On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 10:05:46AM -0800, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?Method::Signatures Also worth looking at: http://search.cpan.org/~rhesa/Method-Signatures-Simple-0.03/lib/Method/Signatures/Simple.pm http://search.cpan.org/~flora/MooseX-Method-Signatures-0.06/lib/MooseX/Method/Signatures.pm hdp. From hdp.perl.pm.pdx at weftsoar.net Mon Dec 15 10:43:45 2008 From: hdp.perl.pm.pdx at weftsoar.net (Hans Dieter Pearcey) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:43:45 -0500 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods In-Reply-To: <4946A241.2020607@hollensbe.org> References: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> <4946A241.2020607@hollensbe.org> Message-ID: <20081215184345.GC31656@glaive.weftsoar.net> On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 10:30:25AM -0800, Erik Hollensbe wrote: > Yeah, I remember Schwern mentioning it on IRC and my > excitement/discipline ratio started to get too large. > > Has this been talked about at a meeting? I'm wondering what the catch > is, if any. All the method signatures modules use Devel::Declare, which is pretty black magic; the distribution includes a file called stolen_chunk_of_toke.c, which should tell you something. That said, as black magic goes, its possible side effects are pretty limited. It rewrites your source during compilation, so there's no possibility of e.g. run-time segfaults or other weirdness. Think of it as a source filter that doesn't need to roll its own buggy Perl parser. All in all, I think the biggest catch is for people who are wanting to use Devel::Declare directly, since its API is still changing and you have to use a lot of boilerplate code to do stuff with it (at least, last time I looked). End users pretty much just have to worry about Devel::Declare failing to install, and according to cpantesters its track record has been pretty good recently. hdp. From jshirley at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 10:56:27 2008 From: jshirley at gmail.com (J. Shirley) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:56:27 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods In-Reply-To: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <756703690812151056q4db4b713ke466fb1593c20792@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > Hi all, > > Yes, this is still alpha, but the coolness/heardofit ratio is entirely > too large: > > http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?Method::Signatures > > (Backstory for those who missed the meeting: we had a "your most > frustrating thing when learning Perl" round during the introductions > and subroutine prototypes were mentioned.) > > --Eric > -- > Turns out the optimal technique is to put it in reverse and gun it. > --Steven Squyres (on challenges in interplanetary robot navigation) > --------------------------------------------------- > http://scratchcomputing.com > --------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > Because you can happily use Moose for EVERYTHING, there is also: http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?MooseX::Method::Signatures Praise the Moose (and Schwern and mst, crazy sorcerers) From ben.hengst at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 12:37:09 2008 From: ben.hengst at gmail.com (benh) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:37:09 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Method::Signatures - prototypes for methods In-Reply-To: <756703690812151056q4db4b713ke466fb1593c20792@mail.gmail.com> References: <200812151005.46276.enobacon@gmail.com> <756703690812151056q4db4b713ke466fb1593c20792@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ddf48b0812151237ua29880tb46c02dc6db10fd4@mail.gmail.com> My days would be much more frustrating if it was not for the work of the crazy sorcerers so I'm grateful to take a little black magic in the process. On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 10:56 AM, J. Shirley wrote: > On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Yes, this is still alpha, but the coolness/heardofit ratio is entirely >> too large: >> >> http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?Method::Signatures >> >> (Backstory for those who missed the meeting: we had a "your most >> frustrating thing when learning Perl" round during the introductions >> and subroutine prototypes were mentioned.) >> >> --Eric >> -- >> Turns out the optimal technique is to put it in reverse and gun it. >> --Steven Squyres (on challenges in interplanetary robot navigation) >> --------------------------------------------------- >> http://scratchcomputing.com >> --------------------------------------------------- >> _______________________________________________ >> Pdx-pm-list mailing list >> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org >> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list >> > > Because you can happily use Moose for EVERYTHING, there is also: > > http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?MooseX::Method::Signatures > > Praise the Moose (and Schwern and mst, crazy sorcerers) > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- benh~ http://three.sentenc.es/ From enobacon at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 15:24:02 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:24:02 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] FreeTUIT - Fwd: PLUG Advanced Topics December 17th 2008 Message-ID: <200812151524.02448.enobacon@gmail.com> Hi all, You may find this presentation interesting. Some of you may have seen the quick preview of FreeTUIT at the October meeting. --Eric ---------- Forwarded Message: ---------- Subject: [PLUG-ANNOUNCE] PLUG Advanced Topics December 17th 2008 Date: Monday 15 December 2008 13:03 From: Alan To: PLUG list PLUG Advanced Topics Meeting December 17th, 2008 7pm Jax Bar 826 SW 2nd Ave Portland, OR 97204 (503) 228-9128 Speaker: Eric Wilhelm Codeless GUI Programming A Declarative Syntax Layer for Desktop Graphical User Interfaces This will be the world premiere of a game-changing advancement in the development of desktop graphical user interfaces (GUIs). FreeTUIT removes the verbosity, tedium, and confusion from GUI development and provides a unified syntax for widget layout and configuration which supports good software design practice without getting in the way of rapid application development. FreeTUIT is a syntax and runtime for concisely declaring the layout and configuration of GUI widgets (such as forms, toolbars, buttons, and dialogs). The freetuit interpreter drives a unified object layer which is accessible from event callbacks. This takes you from a blank page to a static demo of the layout with zero setup and allows desktop applications to be developed and deployed faster than web applications by simply removing the HTML, CSS, XML, HTTP, Javascript, Database, Network, and User Agent components. Jax is next to the 2nd Ave Max stop, so you don't need to park at the downtown icerink. _______________________________________________ PLUG-announce mailing list PLUG-announce at lists.pdxlinux.org http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-announce ------------------------------------------------------- -- Introducing change is like pulling off a bandage: the pain is a memory almost as soon as you feel it. --Paul Graham --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From kellert at ohsu.edu Tue Dec 16 14:09:38 2008 From: kellert at ohsu.edu (Thomas Keller) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:09:38 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Test::More and Inline Message-ID: <5BFCC1E7-1662-4CCC-B65C-6F6B79A81B77@ohsu.edu> Greetings, I'm not understanding the explanation given for using Test::More with Inline C in chromatic's Perl Testing book. The example in the book (this works): #!/usr/local/bin/perl # test_math.t from "Perl Testing" p 172 BEGIN { chdir 't' if -d 't'; } use strict; use warnings; use Test::More tests =>6; use Inline C => Config => LIBS => '-lm', ENABLE => 'AUTOWRAP' ; Inline->import( C => < From erik at hollensbe.org Tue Dec 16 14:15:09 2008 From: erik at hollensbe.org (Erik Hollensbe) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:15:09 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Test::More and Inline In-Reply-To: <5BFCC1E7-1662-4CCC-B65C-6F6B79A81B77@ohsu.edu> References: <5BFCC1E7-1662-4CCC-B65C-6F6B79A81B77@ohsu.edu> Message-ID: <1229465709.4039.27.camel@islay> On Tue, 2008-12-16 at 14:09 -0800, Thomas Keller wrote: > > use Inline C => > Config => > LIBS => '-lm', > ENABLE => 'AUTOWRAP' > ; > > But I don't see how Inline knows where to look for the library? > Does Test::More generate "wrapper" code? Is it only in memory, or can > it be retrieved? > ... If so would this be useful for building more extensive programs > using C functions? Inline there is using the -l switch to cc which links your inline code against libm, which has fmin() and fmax(). cc manages this itself, and Inline at that point has very little to do with it (although, you can change htat with the -L switch to cc). HTH, -Erik > From enobacon at gmail.com Wed Dec 17 11:08:50 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 11:08:50 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] FreeTUIT - tonight's talk is cancelled In-Reply-To: <200812151524.02448.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812151524.02448.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200812171108.51082.enobacon@gmail.com> # from Eric Wilhelm # on Monday 15 December 2008 15:24: >Subject: [PLUG-ANNOUNCE] PLUG Advanced Topics December 17th 2008 Sorry. Jax is closing early on account of weather. --Eric -- But as soon as you hear the Doppler shift dropping in pitch, you know that they're probably going to miss your house, because if they were on a collision course with your house, the pitch would stay the same until impact. As I said, that one's subtle. --Larry Wall --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From ben.hengst at gmail.com Wed Dec 17 16:46:32 2008 From: ben.hengst at gmail.com (benh) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 16:46:32 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] FreeTUIT - tonight's talk is cancelled In-Reply-To: <200812171108.51082.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812151524.02448.enobacon@gmail.com> <200812171108.51082.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ddf48b0812171646g2d886a80gd8d5ba6f9e1468e2@mail.gmail.com> rats, I was planning on going. Oh well is this a talk that we could do for Jan? or do we already have a speaker lined up? On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > # from Eric Wilhelm > # on Monday 15 December 2008 15:24: > >>Subject: [PLUG-ANNOUNCE] PLUG Advanced Topics December 17th 2008 > > Sorry. Jax is closing early on account of weather. > > --Eric > -- > But as soon as you hear the Doppler shift dropping in pitch, you know > that they're probably going to miss your house, because if they were on > a collision course with your house, the pitch would stay the same until > impact. As I said, that one's subtle. > --Larry Wall > --------------------------------------------------- > http://scratchcomputing.com > --------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- benh~ http://three.sentenc.es/ From enobacon at gmail.com Wed Dec 17 17:26:02 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 17:26:02 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] FreeTUIT - tonight's talk is cancelled In-Reply-To: <85ddf48b0812171646g2d886a80gd8d5ba6f9e1468e2@mail.gmail.com> References: <200812151524.02448.enobacon@gmail.com> <200812171108.51082.enobacon@gmail.com> <85ddf48b0812171646g2d886a80gd8d5ba6f9e1468e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200812171726.02523.enobacon@gmail.com> # from benh # on Wednesday 17 December 2008 16:46: >is this a talk that we could do >for Jan? or do we already have a speaker lined up? I believe chromatic has volunteered to speak on virtual machines in January. I'll see if Alan has a speaker or wants to carry this over to Jan, or it might be the pdx.pm talk in Feb. --Eric -- Chicken farmer's observation: Clunk is the past tense of cluck. --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From kellert at ohsu.edu Thu Dec 18 14:29:53 2008 From: kellert at ohsu.edu (Thomas Keller) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 14:29:53 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] io prompt question Message-ID: <9B89034D-A7B1-46D0-A8D7-0F0E5213670E@ohsu.edu> Greetings, I'm getting a warning using IO::Prompt and don't see why: my $mapper = prompt("Choose a mapper: ", -menu=>[ @mappers ]); gives: Use of uninitialized value $_ in pattern match (m//) at /opt/local/lib/ perl5/site_perl/5.10.0/IO/Prompt.pm line 91. ?? thanks for any insight, Tom K From enobacon at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 14:58:45 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 14:58:45 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] io prompt question In-Reply-To: <9B89034D-A7B1-46D0-A8D7-0F0E5213670E@ohsu.edu> References: <9B89034D-A7B1-46D0-A8D7-0F0E5213670E@ohsu.edu> Message-ID: <200812181458.45409.enobacon@gmail.com> # from Thomas Keller # on Thursday 18 December 2008 14:29: >I'm getting a warning using IO::Prompt and don't see why: > >my $mapper = prompt("Choose a mapper: ", -menu=>[ @mappers ]); > >gives: >Use of uninitialized value $_ in pattern match (m//) at > /opt/local/lib/ perl5/site_perl/5.10.0/IO/Prompt.pm line 91. This sounds like a job for Carp::Always. The line 91 of the IO::Prompt on cpan doesn't have an m//, so we might need to see the source in question (or at least know the version number) to help further. My guess would be that one of your @mappers values is undef, but that is just a guess. --Eric -- A counterintuitive sansevieria trifasciata was once literalized guiltily. --Product of Artificial Intelligence --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From enobacon at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 17:17:28 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 17:17:28 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] io prompt question In-Reply-To: References: <9B89034D-A7B1-46D0-A8D7-0F0E5213670E@ohsu.edu> <200812181458.45409.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200812181717.28566.enobacon@gmail.com> Aside: did you mean to reply to the list? # from Thomas Keller # on Thursday 18 December 2008 16:36: >I mixed up where the warning was coming from. It was actually from a ? >poor approach to assignment: > >my $parser_options = prompt("Accept parser default values: ", -yn) > IO::Prompt returns true if "y" is typed, but the assignment: > $parser_option = "y" doesn't get made. It seems to return 'y' for me. Does your IO::Prompt need upgrading? --Eric -- Atavism n: The recurrence of any peculiarity or disease of an ancestor in a subsequent generation, usually due to genetic recombination. --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From michael at jamhome.us Fri Dec 19 06:15:25 2008 From: michael at jamhome.us (Michael Rasmussen) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 06:15:25 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] True Value Message-ID: <200812190615.25308.michael@jamhome.us> http://xkcd.com/519/ -- Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon Be appropriate && Follow your curiosity http://www.jamhome.us/ The fortune cookie says: You will be called upon to help a friend in trouble. From MichaelRWolf at att.net Fri Dec 19 15:51:16 2008 From: MichaelRWolf at att.net (Michael R. Wolf) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 15:51:16 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] io prompt question In-Reply-To: <200812181717.28566.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <9B89034D-A7B1-46D0-A8D7-0F0E5213670E@ohsu.edu> <200812181458.45409.enobacon@gmail.com> <200812181717.28566.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Dec 18, 2008, at 5:17 PM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > > Aside: did you mean to reply to the list? > > # from Thomas Keller > # on Thursday 18 December 2008 16:36: > >> I mixed up where the warning was coming from. It was actually from a >> poor approach to assignment: >> >> my $parser_options = prompt("Accept parser default values: ", -yn) > Off hand, I'd suggest quoting '-yn', else it looks like the unary negation of the tr/// command that's using the 'y' (for hysterical reasons) alias of the transliteration, and only supplying one (of 3) custom delimiters. In effect, your code is an incomplete start toward this code -($_ =~ ynXXXnYYYn) which may look more familiar as tr/XXX/YYY/; You've supplied 'n' instead of '/', and therefore have an incomplete Regex. Folks get used to having -yn as a string in the following cases, but it's not the dash that does the magic, it's the fat comma. my $answers = ( -yn => 'yes or no', -n => 'no', -y => 'yes', ); Since the only documented uses of the -flag notation are immediately followed by the fat comma, it could be misleading. If this suggestion fixes your code, could you submit your code as a bug fix request at CPAN RT? I guess it's not a "but", but could use a better example in the docs to hilight the problem you ran into. Michael R. Wolf All mammals learn by playing! MichaelRWolf at att.net From exodist7 at gmail.com Sat Dec 20 19:02:33 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 19:02:33 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? Message-ID: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> Hey, I have been lerking on the mailing list for close to a year now, don't think I have ever posted anything. I have also made an appearence in the chat as exodist on occasion. I just completed a module/app and submitted it to cpan, and I am eager for feedback. I am not sure if this is the right kind of thing to post here, if it is great, if not let me know. The module can be found here: https://pause.perl.org/pub/PAUSE/authors/id/E/EX/EXODIST/PPBS.tar.gz Essentially make is limited for large perl projects. The tools such as Module::Install are great for individual modules, but do not work so well on large application projects. Rake is a good alternative to make, but requires installing and learning ruby to install your perl app. I briefly looked at some other perl modules, but found nothing that met my needs. As such I took about 5 hours and wrote this while snowed in today. The goal is to have the file that defines the build tasks to be very similar to Makefiles, because people are used to their syntax. However these files are pure perl, and as such carry perls power within them. I also wanted to be able to write build tasks either as perl code or as shell commands, since some build tasks are obviously simpler in shell. The best documentation is the pod for lib/PPBS.pm within the tarball. I would appreciate feedback both on how it is used (as described in the pod), and on the coding. The code is suprisingly tiny, so it should not take too long. -Chad 'Exodist' Granum -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jacob at technosorcery.net Sat Dec 20 20:28:09 2008 From: jacob at technosorcery.net (Jacob Helwig) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 20:28:09 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8c9a060812202028h68f5b612k5c32e1eb62abfb8f@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 19:02, Chad Granum wrote: > The module can be found here: > https://pause.perl.org/pub/PAUSE/authors/id/E/EX/EXODIST/PPBS.tar.gz > Unless someone already has a PAUSE ID, they won't be able to download it with that link. $ wget https://pause.perl.org/pub/PAUSE/authors/id/E/EX/EXODIST/PPBS.tar.gz --2008-12-20 20:22:53-- https://pause.perl.org/pub/PAUSE/authors/id/E/EX/EXODIST/PPBS.tar.gz Resolving pause.perl.org... 195.149.117.110 Connecting to pause.perl.org|195.149.117.110|:443... connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 401 Authorization Required Authorization failed. I hope you don't mind, but I've thrown the file up at http://technosorcery.net/PPBS.tar.gz so those without a PAUSE ID can take a look, too. ;-) -Jacob From exodist7 at gmail.com Sat Dec 20 21:01:10 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 21:01:10 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> The CPAN page for the module is up, now you can view it there as well in web format. Nicer on the eyes. http://search.cpan.org/~exodist/PPBS/lib/PPBS.pm On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 7:02 PM, Chad Granum wrote: > Hey, I have been lerking on the mailing list for close to a year now, don't > think I have ever posted anything. I have also made an appearence in the > chat as exodist on occasion. > > I just completed a module/app and submitted it to cpan, and I am eager for > feedback. I am not sure if this is the right kind of thing to post here, if > it is great, if not let me know. > > The module can be found here: > https://pause.perl.org/pub/PAUSE/authors/id/E/EX/EXODIST/PPBS.tar.gz > > Essentially make is limited for large perl projects. The tools such as > Module::Install are great for individual modules, but do not work so well on > large application projects. Rake is a good alternative to make, but requires > installing and learning ruby to install your perl app. > > I briefly looked at some other perl modules, but found nothing that met my > needs. As such I took about 5 hours and wrote this while snowed in today. > The goal is to have the file that defines the build tasks to be very similar > to Makefiles, because people are used to their syntax. However these files > are pure perl, and as such carry perls power within them. I also wanted to > be able to write build tasks either as perl code or as shell commands, since > some build tasks are obviously simpler in shell. > > The best documentation is the pod for lib/PPBS.pm within the tarball. I > would appreciate feedback both on how it is used (as described in the pod), > and on the coding. The code is suprisingly tiny, so it should not take too > long. > > -Chad 'Exodist' Granum -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jacob at technosorcery.net Sat Dec 20 21:13:28 2008 From: jacob at technosorcery.net (Jacob Helwig) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 21:13:28 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8c9a060812202113y6555e07el5d0889de16f75ba0@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 21:01, Chad Granum wrote: > The CPAN page for the module is up, now you can view it there as well in web > format. Nicer on the eyes. > > http://search.cpan.org/~exodist/PPBS/lib/PPBS.pm > Looks interesting. Do you have a git/svn/bzr/hg/etc repo of it up anywhere? From exodist7 at gmail.com Sat Dec 20 23:32:08 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 23:32:08 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812202332v22f1ca59y682963e2ca8c931f@mail.gmail.com> I finally got my server up again, now I can share a git repo for PPBS. git clone ssh://anonymous at open-exodus.net/server/git/PPBS Password: anonymous This is the repo I will be pushing all ym changes to in an svn central server style. Anonymous has no write access, you can pull or clone, but not push. If you want to contribute let me know and I will probably give you an account w/ write access to the repo. -Chad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From exodist7 at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 01:02:29 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 01:02:29 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812210049p77384554s5ae8740506bc4b52@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> <200812211037.11745.shlomif@iglu.org.il> <40ce9e660812210049p77384554s5ae8740506bc4b52@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812210102v1a0c5cf4je59d44c420743d28@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for the feedback, I have a few questions: 1. Why doesn't the distribution have a version? The only thing that has a > version is the module which is versioned at 1.00. > By distribution do you mean the file name? I noticed that after the upload I was not thinking, the second upload had the version number. > > 2. Now why did you version it at 1.00 right away? That's not such a good > idea > for open-source software: > > http://catb.org/esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/homesteading/ar01s13.html > > You should have started at 0.01 or something. > oops, too late now. > > 3. That put aside, I also dislike the fact that it's called "PPBS" rather > than "Build::PPBS" or "App::PPBS" or whatever. > I am actually calling it ppbuild because something similar, but much different from what I need called pbs exists, that author contacted me. Would it be worth it at this point to rename it to App::PPBuilder and reversion it to 0.01, or would that just be too much being a third delete/upload change? > > 4. The copyright paragraph for the module reads: > > {{{{{{{{{{{ > Copyright 2008 Chad Granum > > You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along > with > this. If not, see . > }}}}}}}}}}} > > That's not enough. You should say that it is licensed under the GPL and > which > versions exactly. > Will do, Inexperience bit me. > > 5. You're exporting functions that start with an uppercase letter. The Perl > convention (and good practice) is for them to start with a lowercase > letter. > I made them capital specifically in this place because it seemed more approptiate to me, is this not a design choice I should make? > > 6. The synopsis lacks a semi-colon after the sub { ... } > > 7. > > {{{ > File "MyFile, qw/ MyTask /, "touch MyFile"; > }}} > > You're missing a double-quotes. > Will fix, thank you. -Chad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shlomif at iglu.org.il Sun Dec 21 00:37:11 2008 From: shlomif at iglu.org.il (Shlomi Fish) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 10:37:11 +0200 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200812211037.11745.shlomif@iglu.org.il> On Sunday 21 December 2008, Chad Granum wrote: > The CPAN page for the module is up, now you can view it there as well in > web format. Nicer on the eyes. > > http://search.cpan.org/~exodist/PPBS/lib/PPBS.pm > A few comments: 1. Why doesn't the distribution have a version? The only thing that has a version is the module which is versioned at 1.00. 2. Now why did you version it at 1.00 right away? That's not such a good idea for open-source software: http://catb.org/esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/homesteading/ar01s13.html You should have started at 0.01 or something. 3. That put aside, I also dislike the fact that it's called "PPBS" rather than "Build::PPBS" or "App::PPBS" or whatever. 4. The copyright paragraph for the module reads: {{{{{{{{{{{ Copyright 2008 Chad Granum You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along with this. If not, see . }}}}}}}}}}} That's not enough. You should say that it is licensed under the GPL and which versions exactly. 5. You're exporting functions that start with an uppercase letter. The Perl convention (and good practice) is for them to start with a lowercase letter. 6. The synopsis lacks a semi-colon after the sub { ... } 7. {{{ File "MyFile, qw/ MyTask /, "touch MyFile"; }}} You're missing a double-quotes. --------------------------- That's what I could detect from skimming the documentation. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/ways_to_do_it.html Shlomi, so what are you working on? Working on a new wiki about unit testing fortunes in freecell? -- Ran Eilam From exodist7 at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 01:53:47 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 01:53:47 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812210102v1a0c5cf4je59d44c420743d28@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> <200812211037.11745.shlomif@iglu.org.il> <40ce9e660812210049p77384554s5ae8740506bc4b52@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812210102v1a0c5cf4je59d44c420743d28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812210153k506b3c74x9a7bbb3578bba651@mail.gmail.com> Final update before I hit the sack It is now called App:PPBuild. its version is 0.03, the exported functions are lowercase, I have applied some patches from Jacob that help with project management, and I have applied fixes after the advice from Shlomi Fish. This feedback has been amazing, and very helpful so far, thank you to everyone, please keep it comming :-) The git to use for this is: git clone ssh://anonymous at open-exodus.net/server/git/ppbuild password: anonymous At Jacobs advice I will be looking into gitosis to improve ym git server, but that will come later. Thanks again everyone. -Chad On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 1:02 AM, Chad Granum wrote: > > Thanks for the feedback, I have a few questions: > > 1. Why doesn't the distribution have a version? The only thing that has a >> version is the module which is versioned at 1.00. >> > > By distribution do you mean the file name? I noticed that after the upload > I was not thinking, the second upload had the version number. > > >> >> 2. Now why did you version it at 1.00 right away? That's not such a good >> idea >> for open-source software: >> >> http://catb.org/esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/homesteading/ar01s13.html >> >> You should have started at 0.01 or something. >> > > oops, too late now. > > >> >> 3. That put aside, I also dislike the fact that it's called "PPBS" rather >> than "Build::PPBS" or "App::PPBS" or whatever. >> > > I am actually calling it ppbuild because something similar, but much > different from what I need called pbs exists, that author contacted me. > > Would it be worth it at this point to rename it to App::PPBuilder and > reversion it to 0.01, or would that just be too much being a third > delete/upload change? > > >> >> 4. The copyright paragraph for the module reads: >> >> {{{{{{{{{{{ >> Copyright 2008 Chad Granum >> >> You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along >> with >> this. If not, see . >> }}}}}}}}}}} >> >> That's not enough. You should say that it is licensed under the GPL and >> which >> versions exactly. >> > > Will do, Inexperience bit me. > > >> >> 5. You're exporting functions that start with an uppercase letter. The >> Perl >> convention (and good practice) is for them to start with a lowercase >> letter. >> > > I made them capital specifically in this place because it seemed more > approptiate to me, is this not a design choice I should make? > > >> >> 6. The synopsis lacks a semi-colon after the sub { ... } >> >> 7. >> >> {{{ >> File "MyFile, qw/ MyTask /, "touch MyFile"; >> }}} >> >> You're missing a double-quotes. >> > > Will fix, thank you. > > > > -Chad > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From erik at hollensbe.org Sun Dec 21 08:36:44 2008 From: erik at hollensbe.org (Erik Hollensbe) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 08:36:44 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812202332v22f1ca59y682963e2ca8c931f@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202332v22f1ca59y682963e2ca8c931f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1229877404.13211.4.camel@islay.home.hollensbe.org> On Sat, 2008-12-20 at 23:32 -0800, Chad Granum wrote: > I finally got my server up again, now I can share a git repo for PPBS. > > git clone ssh://anonymous at open-exodus.net/server/git/PPBS > Password: anonymous > > This is the repo I will be pushing all ym changes to in an svn central > server style. > > Anonymous has no write access, you can pull or clone, but not push. > > If you want to contribute let me know and I will probably give you an > account w/ write access to the repo. You can use git-daemon to provide this functionality (and it's faster, and login free using the git:// protocol). I see you mentioning gitosis later in the thread, but as I understand that's typically more useful if you have lots of users that need to create repositories. If you want people to fork so you can easily see it and then pull from their forks easily, github is likely the simplest solution right now. You can set up git easily enough (edit your config and setup multiple url= lines in your remote) to push to both places. -Erik From exodist7 at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 11:07:19 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 11:07:19 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <1229877404.13211.4.camel@islay.home.hollensbe.org> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202332v22f1ca59y682963e2ca8c931f@mail.gmail.com> <1229877404.13211.4.camel@islay.home.hollensbe.org> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812211107o6dafbd61y41f140c1838f7fd6@mail.gmail.com> Yes, I tried that initially, but I cannot get it to work, I am running git-daemon with the following options (in the gentoo /etc/conf.d/git-daemon file): GITDAEMON_OPTS="--syslog /var/git --base-path /server/git --export-all" GIT_USER="anonymous" GIT_GROUP="anonymous" (And I restarted it) When I try to use it: exodist at abydos ~/temp $ git clone git://192.168.0.3/ppbuild Initialized empty Git repository in /home/exodist/temp/ppbuild/.git/ fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly exodist at abydos ~/temp $ git clone git://192.168.0.3/server/git/ppbuild Initialized empty Git repository in /home/exodist/temp/ppbuild/.git/ fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly On the server: Dec 21 11:07:29 Luxor git-daemon: [6342] '/ppbuild': unable to chdir or not a git archive Dec 21 11:07:55 Luxor git-daemon: [6350] '/server/git/ppbuild/.git': repository not exported. >From what I can tell setting the base path, and the --export-all should be sufficient, but apparently not. Because of that I ended up giving anonymous ssh access out. -Chad On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 8:36 AM, Erik Hollensbe wrote: > On Sat, 2008-12-20 at 23:32 -0800, Chad Granum wrote: > > I finally got my server up again, now I can share a git repo for PPBS. > > > > git clone ssh://anonymous at open-exodus.net/server/git/PPBS > > Password: anonymous > > > > This is the repo I will be pushing all ym changes to in an svn central > > server style. > > > > Anonymous has no write access, you can pull or clone, but not push. > > > > If you want to contribute let me know and I will probably give you an > > account w/ write access to the repo. > > You can use git-daemon to provide this functionality (and it's faster, > and login free using the git:// protocol). > > I see you mentioning gitosis later in the thread, but as I understand > that's typically more useful if you have lots of users that need to > create repositories. > > If you want people to fork so you can easily see it and then pull from > their forks easily, github is likely the simplest solution right now. > You can set up git easily enough (edit your config and setup multiple > url= lines in your remote) to push to both places. > > -Erik > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From exodist7 at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 11:38:15 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 11:38:15 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812211107o6dafbd61y41f140c1838f7fd6@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202101t138ffe00w1eb581a4855bbcae@mail.gmail.com> <40ce9e660812202332v22f1ca59y682963e2ca8c931f@mail.gmail.com> <1229877404.13211.4.camel@islay.home.hollensbe.org> <40ce9e660812211107o6dafbd61y41f140c1838f7fd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812211138y3cefc7eek411ae2ac596430c2@mail.gmail.com> Der, my problem was /var/git, I thought hat was a parameter to syslog because I did not read that part of the docs, now it works. On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Chad Granum wrote: > Yes, I tried that initially, but I cannot get it to work, > > I am running git-daemon with the following options (in the gentoo > /etc/conf.d/git-daemon file): > GITDAEMON_OPTS="--syslog /var/git --base-path /server/git --export-all" > GIT_USER="anonymous" > GIT_GROUP="anonymous" > (And I restarted it) > > When I try to use it: > > exodist at abydos ~/temp $ git clone git://192.168.0.3/ppbuild > Initialized empty Git repository in /home/exodist/temp/ppbuild/.git/ > fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly > exodist at abydos ~/temp $ git clone git://192.168.0.3/server/git/ppbuild > Initialized empty Git repository in /home/exodist/temp/ppbuild/.git/ > fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly > > On the server: > > Dec 21 11:07:29 Luxor git-daemon: [6342] '/ppbuild': unable to chdir or not > a git archive > Dec 21 11:07:55 Luxor git-daemon: [6350] '/server/git/ppbuild/.git': > repository not exported. > > > From what I can tell setting the base path, and the --export-all should be > sufficient, but apparently not. > > Because of that I ended up giving anonymous ssh access out. > > -Chad > > > > On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 8:36 AM, Erik Hollensbe wrote: > >> On Sat, 2008-12-20 at 23:32 -0800, Chad Granum wrote: >> > I finally got my server up again, now I can share a git repo for PPBS. >> > >> > git clone ssh://anonymous at open-exodus.net/server/git/PPBS >> > Password: anonymous >> > >> > This is the repo I will be pushing all ym changes to in an svn central >> > server style. >> > >> > Anonymous has no write access, you can pull or clone, but not push. >> > >> > If you want to contribute let me know and I will probably give you an >> > account w/ write access to the repo. >> >> You can use git-daemon to provide this functionality (and it's faster, >> and login free using the git:// protocol). >> >> I see you mentioning gitosis later in the thread, but as I understand >> that's typically more useful if you have lots of users that need to >> create repositories. >> >> If you want people to fork so you can easily see it and then pull from >> their forks easily, github is likely the simplest solution right now. >> You can set up git easily enough (edit your config and setup multiple >> url= lines in your remote) to push to both places. >> >> -Erik >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From enobacon at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 09:07:16 2008 From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 09:07:16 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Perl 5 now uses Git for version control Message-ID: <200812220907.16958.enobacon@gmail.com> The Perl 5 core source is now hosted on Git, which removes the perforce barrier. http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/12/22/0830205 Over a year in the making! --Eric -- "Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse." --Murphy's Corollary --------------------------------------------------- http://scratchcomputing.com --------------------------------------------------- From jaleto at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 09:45:05 2008 From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 09:45:05 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Perl 5 now uses Git for version control In-Reply-To: <200812220907.16958.enobacon@gmail.com> References: <200812220907.16958.enobacon@gmail.com> Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0812220945o6b356f18q25e4187725bc8fd6@mail.gmail.com> Howdy, Be sure to git clone git://perl5.git.perl.org/perl.git insted of http://, it is hella faster. Cheers, On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 9:07 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote: > The Perl 5 core source is now hosted on Git, which removes the perforce > barrier. > > http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/12/22/0830205 > > Over a year in the making! > > --Eric > -- > "Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse." > --Murphy's Corollary > --------------------------------------------------- > http://scratchcomputing.com > --------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- [---------------------] Jonathan Leto jaleto at gmail.com From MichaelRWolf at att.net Mon Dec 22 13:02:02 2008 From: MichaelRWolf at att.net (Michael R. Wolf) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:02:02 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Referral requested Message-ID: <13FDA56B-3044-40E4-B5AC-E3642BD4CEA9@att.net> A couple of years ago, I attended a PDX PM meeting of lightening talks where someone presented an animated GIF of the Columbia River, replete with visual information that was previously locked in tabular data: storm events, diurnal heating, dam releases, etc. Who was that? I corresponded with her after the meeting, but have since lost my XP Outlook contacts. (I don't miss XP, being a newbie MacBook user), but do miss the contacts. A student in one of my classes runs a dam (BTW -- how cool is that job description?) in Utah. I wanted to connect the two of them. I think they'd have a lot in common. Thanks, Michael P.S. I hope you don't think it disrespectful if you notice that I want to connect one "dam woman" to another. Michael R. Wolf All mammals learn by playing! MichaelRWolf at att.net From exodist7 at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 22:14:39 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 22:14:39 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812222214i70fc4101ubc1470555933b779@mail.gmail.com> Because I am updating it so fast I have decided to put the pod up on my site. I have put into the documentation answers to many of the questions about the project. http://open-exodus.net/ppbuild.html The most important additions are the WHAT PPBuild IS and WHAT PPBuild IS NOT sections. Hopefully after reading those sections the goals and reasonings behind the project will become clear :-) -Chad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jaleto at gmail.com Thu Dec 25 10:22:25 2008 From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 10:22:25 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Math::GSL::Core Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0812251022k4da6b4acg7f11cdc070743daf@mail.gmail.com> Howdy, I was thinking of making something like use Math::GSL::Core; which would include the most commonly used Math::GSL modules, something like Complex, Matrix, Vector, Eigen, Linalg, Errno, BLAS, Const, and possibly a few others. This would only give you access to the OO interface, if you wanted all of the low-level access to the c-style functions (gsl_*) then you would do: use Math::GSL::Core qw/:all/; which would basically pass the :all to the corresponding modules. My philosophy is thus: Optimize the OO interface for ease of use, but expose the c-style interface for those wanting nothing but speed. The trade off is that the OO interface is roughly 10 times slower but it condenses 10-20 lines of code into one chainable method call. When you find yourself chaining 3 or 4 methods like this: # this code only works in the latest git bleed branch use Math::GSL::Matrix; printf "%.4f %.4f\n%.4f %.4f\n", Math::GSL::Matrix->new(2,2)->identity->inverse->as_list; OUTPUT: 1.0000 0.0000 0.0000 1.0000 the power of chainable method calls shines through. This shows that the inverse of the identity matrix is .....(drumroll).... the identity matrix. Good to be sure, don't trust a numerical algorithm farther than you can throw it! The equivalent code in low-level routines is probably about 20 lines with proper error checking. What do y'all think about this and do you have any other hints for making Math::GSL more user-friendly? Cheers and Happy Holidays, Math::GSL blog: http://leto.net/code/Math-GSL -- [---------------------] Jonathan Leto jaleto at gmail.com From exodist7 at gmail.com Sat Dec 27 00:08:07 2008 From: exodist7 at gmail.com (Chad Granum) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 00:08:07 -0800 Subject: [Pdx-pm] App/Module review? In-Reply-To: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> References: <40ce9e660812201902j2e4042b0j39fffa719fd828e0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <40ce9e660812270008m3f76a149vbca53e575cb886e1@mail.gmail.com> I am unable to find the exact message where it was asked, but I seem to recall someone suggesting I make PPBuild as an extension to Module::Install instead of stand-alone. I think I have clarified the docs well enough to explain what I am trying to accomplish. Obviously ppbuild should not be only extension to Module::Build and nothing else. However it got me thinking, I went ahead and made an extension to Module::Install in order to make them play nicely together. http://search.cpan.org/~exodist/App-PPBuild-0.11/lib/Module/Install/PPBuild.pmfor reference. If that suggestion was not in this mail thread I appologise. but I am not sure where else it could ahve been, perhaps in #pdx.pm? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: