From george at metaart.org Tue May 6 10:43:11 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Tue, 6 May 2008 10:43:11 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Teaching a New Dog Old Tricks Message-ID: <200805061043.11927.george@metaart.org> ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Teaching a New Dog Old Tricks Date: Tuesday 06 May 2008 10:29 From: Manning Publications To: georgemw at metaart.org ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~ Teaching a New Dog Old Tricks There's never been a better time to be an old dog. To thrive in the world of the New Web, deep knowledge of mature technologies like Java, PHP, and JavaScript is proving to be key. * PHP 5 is now at the tipping point, bringing with it powerful tools like Zend Framework and CakePHP that standardize PHP development. * JavaScript fueled the Ajax explosion and now drives richer web development through libraries like Prototype, Scriptaculous, and JQuery. * Flex is now open source, and it's on the desktop via Adobe AIR. It even runs on top of Rails. * Java drives Wicket, Seam, Struts 2, and GWT, along with the algorithms and techniques that make the web smarter. * Microsoft developers are migrating to a new generation of web tools like Silverlight 2, along with Ajax and MVC frameworks for ASP.NET. So if you really want to understand the New Web, go talk to developers with a few cycles under their belt. And if you're an old dog, enjoy the moment--you've earned it. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~ PHP ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~ Zend Framework in Action [http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0015y6lAV6eVC0o7hTSp0mbrKCXb61cj007jEevrKVpt8RbZG6i v0Zn7DrJIQ5-Us4r7BxCl9NEhP82RVn__rY5uMKCM-x-0v_B7DAebm22Sh1KIkYmJFGrAL3wWE0Bb M55] Early Access Baley cover [http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0015y6lAV6eVC0o7hTSp0mbrKCXb61cj007jEevrKVpt8RbZG6i v0Zn7DrJIQ5-Us4r7BxCl9NEhP82RVn__rY5uMKCM-x-0v_B7DAebm22Sh1KIkYmJFGrAL3wWE0Bb M55] Standardize your PHP with this cutting-edge framework. 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coordinator resignation Message-ID: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> hi all, thanks to all who have contributed to the group. - george ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation Date: Tuesday 06 May 2008 10:58 From: George Woolley To: support at pm.org I have the following requests: * I request you remove me [my name, etc.] as coordinator of Oakland.pm in all appropriate places. * I request, in particular, you remove my name and email address from: http://www.pm.org/groups/314.html * I request you not remove me from the group leaders list as I'm still coordinator of Camelot.pm. I attempted to find someone to replace me but failed. [For more detail, see below my "signature".] You are welcome to ask if someone else on the list is willing to take on the coordinator function. [You may well find someone as the administrative interface showed 78 subscriptions when I checked May 5.] If noone is willing to take on the function or you choose not to ask, you may want to shut the group down. - George == Detail on Not Finding Someone to Take Over 2008 Background: I've been actively looking for someone appropriate to take on the function since early april [april 4]. I asked [april 4] two people I thought would be very good to take on the function, but both eventually said no [april 9 & 14]. A third person I thought would also be good [but hadn't considered initially] thought he wanted to do it but eventually decided [may 5] no. Earlier Background [i.e. before 2008]: I began as coordinator of the group in late 2002 so that I would have a close by group to go to [and not because I wanted to coordinate a group]. Twice in the past I've asked people if they'd be willing to take over. Both times they ended up saying no. ---------------------- the end ------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------- From george at metaart.org Tue May 6 11:45:31 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Tue, 6 May 2008 11:45:31 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Article on PerlBuzz Message-ID: <200805061145.31497.george@metaart.org> == link http://perlbuzz.com/2008/05/perl-decentralize-diversify-colonize.html hi all, i found the article & comments [on Perl Buzz] quite interesting. - george From jseidel at edpci.com Wed May 7 05:13:51 2008 From: jseidel at edpci.com (Jon Seidel CMC) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 05:13:51 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Article on PerlBuzz In-Reply-To: <200805061145.31497.george@metaart.org> References: <200805061145.31497.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: And buried away in a linked-to page I found this very interesting site http://lui.arbingersys.com/index.html I think Perl is suffering from (among other things): 1) Perl 6 still isn't here 2) "Object-oriented" gets lots of traction 3) "New" gets lots of traction 4) We've moved beyond "internet glue" 5) It's often viewed as 'obfuscated' It's still a great language, but... Cheers...jon ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Woolley" To: "Oakland Perl Mongers" Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 11:45 AM Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Article on PerlBuzz > == link > http://perlbuzz.com/2008/05/perl-decentralize-diversify-colonize.html > > hi all, > i found the article & comments [on Perl Buzz] quite interesting. > - george > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > From david at fetter.org Wed May 7 07:39:15 2008 From: david at fetter.org (David Fetter) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 07:39:15 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Article on PerlBuzz In-Reply-To: References: <200805061145.31497.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20080507143915.GG31380@fetter.org> On Wed, May 07, 2008 at 05:13:51AM -0700, Jon Seidel CMC wrote: > And buried away in a linked-to page I found this very interesting site > http://lui.arbingersys.com/index.html > > I think Perl is suffering from (among other things): What makes you think Perl is suffering at all? If you've got some Perl talent and a decent track record, you can pull down a cushy six-figure income just about anywhere. > 1) Perl 6 still isn't here It's a wonderful language, but it's totally, essentially different from Perl 5. > 2) "Object-oriented" gets lots of traction OO code is a tool, not a goal, and plenty of people realize this. OO design is a whole different thing, but few people even attempt it. > 3) "New" gets lots of traction ...and loses it when footgun-of-the-week *cough*rails*cough* turns out to be causing too many injuries and/or there's a new FOTW. > 4) We've moved beyond "internet glue" We may *never* move "beyond internet glue." We get more and more of it as "the internet" has more and more things to glue together. > 5) It's often viewed as 'obfuscated' That's a problem that good coding standards, starting with making strict and warnings mandatory, will eventually fix. That some people have false perceptions has never been a show-stopper for any human endeavor. Cheers, David. -- David Fetter http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter at gmail.com Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate From quinn at fairpath.com Wed May 7 08:17:25 2008 From: quinn at fairpath.com (Quinn Weaver) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 08:17:25 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation In-Reply-To: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> References: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> On Tue, May 06, 2008 at 11:02:54AM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > hi all, > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. > - george Sorry to hear this--thanks for all the good work. Just recently, I was planning to schedule some SanFrancisco.pm meetings in the East Bay. Will this list continue to exist? If so, then I will post those here. In any case, I invite everyone on this list to join the SanFrancisco.pm list. You can do that at http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/sanfrancisco-pm . Its traffic is much like this one's: low volume with occasional peaks into medium volume for certain conversations. And it receives all SF.pm meeting announcements. It's a good way to stay in touch with the greater Bay Area Perl community, which is huge. Thanks, -- Quinn Weaver, independent contractor | President, San Francisco Perl Mongers http://fairpath.com/quinn/resume/ | http://sf.pm.org/ 510-520-5217 From david at fetter.org Wed May 7 09:09:30 2008 From: david at fetter.org (David Fetter) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 09:09:30 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation In-Reply-To: <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> References: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> Message-ID: <20080507160930.GA14401@fetter.org> On Wed, May 07, 2008 at 08:17:25AM -0700, Quinn Weaver wrote: > On Tue, May 06, 2008 at 11:02:54AM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > hi all, > > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. - george > > Sorry to hear this--thanks for all the good work. Thanks also, George. I missed the earlier announcements, but it doesn't matter too much as I can't dedicate the needed time right now. > Just recently, I was planning to schedule some SanFrancisco.pm > meetings in the East Bay. Will this list continue to exist? If so, > then I will post those here. I'd be happy to host East Bay meetings at Casa Donde whenever needed :) Cheers, David. -- David Fetter http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter at gmail.com Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate From george at metaart.org Wed May 7 19:45:34 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 19:45:34 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation In-Reply-To: <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> References: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> Message-ID: <200805071945.34275.george@metaart.org> hi quinn, On Wednesday 07 May 2008 08:17, Quinn Weaver wrote: > On Tue, May 06, 2008 at 11:02:54AM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > hi all, > > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. > > - george > > Sorry to hear this--thanks for all the good work. thanks for the kind words. > > Just recently, I was planning to schedule some SanFrancisco.pm meetings in > the East Bay. sounds like a good idea. > Will this list continue to exist? If so, then I will post > those here. i don't know how long the list will exist. pm.org may know. pm.org has removed Oakland.pm from the list of active PM groups. my guess is until after the pm census. but it could disappear much sooner. > > In any case, I invite everyone on this list to join the SanFrancisco.pm > list. You can do that at > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/sanfrancisco-pm . that also sounds like a good idea. i encourage people to try out the SF.pm list [and the SF.pm meetings too if practical] and decide for yourself. > > Its traffic is much like this one's: low volume with occasional peaks into > medium volume for certain conversations. And it receives all SF.pm meeting > announcements. It's a good way to stay in touch with the greater Bay Area > Perl community, which is huge. my impression is there are more peaks [than the Oakland.pm list has]. my impression is the list attracts more perl heavy weights. > > Thanks, skoal, george From george at metaart.org Wed May 7 19:54:17 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 19:54:17 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation In-Reply-To: <20080507160930.GA14401@fetter.org> References: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> <20080507151725.GA18191@mtn.fairpath.com> <20080507160930.GA14401@fetter.org> Message-ID: <200805071954.17145.george@metaart.org> hi david, On Wednesday 07 May 2008 09:09, David Fetter wrote: > On Wed, May 07, 2008 at 08:17:25AM -0700, Quinn Weaver wrote: > > On Tue, May 06, 2008 at 11:02:54AM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > > hi all, > > > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. - george > > > > Sorry to hear this--thanks for all the good work. > > Thanks also, George. thanks. > I missed the earlier announcements, but it > doesn't matter too much as I can't dedicate the needed time right now. oh well. > > > Just recently, I was planning to schedule some SanFrancisco.pm > > meetings in the East Bay. Will this list continue to exist? If so, > > then I will post those here. > > I'd be happy to host East Bay meetings at Casa Donde whenever needed :) > > Cheers, > David. skoal, george From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Wed May 7 22:21:27 2008 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Wed, 7 May 2008 22:21:27 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation In-Reply-To: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> References: <200805061102.54200.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1210224087.48228dd75aea4@webmail.rawbw.com> Thanks for all the work you've done on this, George. Not sure I caught earlier item(s) on call for a new coordinator. Is it in the list archives? Perhaps if folks know what's needed to cover it, perhaps some volunteer(s) would step forward ... or maybe among a few folks or so, all the bits could get covered. Perhaps Perl Mongers already has a nice prepared list/description that could be referenced, of what's needed in a "coordinator"? If nothing else, it'd be nice to keep the list archives around ... even if they become a static collection, that's better than having all that information go bye-bye from the Internet. And at the same URLs is quite preferable, if feasible ... so the stuff's still findable (e.g. avoid breaking all the links and bookmarks that poing to them). Keep us posted. And thanks again! Quoting George Woolley : > hi all, > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. > - george > > ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- > > Subject: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation > Date: Tuesday 06 May 2008 10:58 > From: George Woolley > To: support at pm.org > > I have the following requests: > * I request you remove me [my name, etc.] > as coordinator of Oakland.pm in all appropriate places. > * I request, in particular, you remove my name and email address from: > http://www.pm.org/groups/314.html > * I request you not remove me from the group leaders list > as I'm still coordinator of Camelot.pm. > > I attempted to find someone to replace me but failed. > [For more detail, see below my "signature".] > You are welcome to ask if someone else on the list is willing > to take on the coordinator function. > [You may well find someone as the administrative interface > showed 78 subscriptions when I checked May 5.] > If noone is willing to take on the function or you choose not to ask, > you may want to shut the group down. > > - George > > == Detail on Not Finding Someone to Take Over > 2008 Background: > I've been actively looking for someone appropriate to take on the function > since early april [april 4]. > I asked [april 4] two people I thought would be very good > to take on the function, > but both eventually said no [april 9 & 14]. > A third person I thought would also be good [but hadn't considered > initially] > thought he wanted to do it but eventually decided [may 5] no. > > Earlier Background [i.e. before 2008]: > I began as coordinator of the group in late 2002 > so that I would have a close by group to go to > [and not because I wanted to coordinate a group]. > Twice in the past I've asked people > if they'd be willing to take over. > Both times they ended up saying no. From george at metaart.org Fri May 9 19:14:39 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Fri, 9 May 2008 19:14:39 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation Message-ID: <200805091914.39225.george@metaart.org> [if you are concerned about the future of the group, i suggest reading what follows as well as other posts on this subject.] hi michael, i thought i sent this yesterday, but i don't see it in the archives. my bad. maybe somehow i sent it to you off-list. [this paragraph added 5/9] == thanks thank you for your concern. you are welcome for the work i've done re the group. == call there was no general call for a new coordinator. my resignation email [among other things] sketches my process [in this matter]. == coordinator in my opinion what is needed in a coordinator is largely in the mind of the beholder. i think the main areas of concern are: * the website * the mailing list * the meetings if someone is seriously interested in being coordinator, i'd be glad to go into more detail with them. the document i found most useful in starting the group is by rick moen and is referenced on our home page. i think perl mongers has something too but don't recall what. if interested, someone could ask them. i think [but don't know] that perl mongers requires a single point of contact. i do think that splitting up the job is desireable, but am inclined to think it's still best to have someone in charge. are you ready to take that on? <<< if so, i suggest you contact perl mongers. == archives i don't know how long perl mongers will keep this list or its archive around. for matters such as this [and for most matters re the group], i suggest contacting perl mongers. i do know that our group is no longer on the list of active perl mongers groups. == posting i will post on this matter as seems appropriate to me. that will probably be mostly answering some questions [and concerns] posted to this list. currently, at the top of my to do list [re this matter] is modifying the website to reflect the current situation. == contact for most matters re the group, i suggest contacting perl mongers. for [questions or] specific requests, i suggest: support at pm.org if that's the wrong place to make your request, hopefully they'll know the right place. in my experience, they are very helpful. == thanks you are welcome again. skoal, george p.s if you feel strongly about keeping the archives available, i guess you could: * capture the list and make the archives available yourself [assuming the archives are still accessible] * or arrange with perl mongers to keep the archives available [much better given your concern as i understand it] p.p.s. i'd review [and proof] this further, but time may be important in this matter. -------------------------------------------------- On Wednesday 07 May 2008 22:21, you wrote: > Thanks for all the work you've done on this, George. > > Not sure I caught earlier item(s) on call for a new coordinator. > > Is it in the list archives? Perhaps if folks know what's needed > to cover it, perhaps some volunteer(s) would step forward ... or maybe > among a few folks or so, all the bits could get covered. Perhaps > Perl Mongers already has a nice prepared list/description that could > be referenced, of what's needed in a "coordinator"? > > If nothing else, it'd be nice to keep the list archives around ... > even if they become a static collection, that's better than having > all that information go bye-bye from the Internet. And at the same > URLs is quite preferable, if feasible ... so the stuff's still findable > (e.g. avoid breaking all the links and bookmarks that poing to them). > > Keep us posted. > > And thanks again! > > Quoting George Woolley : > > hi all, > > thanks to all who have contributed to the group. > > - george > > > > ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- > > > > Subject: Oakland.pm - coordinator resignation > > Date: Tuesday 06 May 2008 10:58 > > From: George Woolley > > To: support at pm.org > > > > I have the following requests: > > * I request you remove me [my name, etc.] > > as coordinator of Oakland.pm in all appropriate places. > > * I request, in particular, you remove my name and email address from: > > http://www.pm.org/groups/314.html > > * I request you not remove me from the group leaders list > > as I'm still coordinator of Camelot.pm. > > > > I attempted to find someone to replace me but failed. > > [For more detail, see below my "signature".] > > You are welcome to ask if someone else on the list is willing > > to take on the coordinator function. > > [You may well find someone as the administrative interface > > showed 78 subscriptions when I checked May 5.] > > If noone is willing to take on the function or you choose not to ask, > > you may want to shut the group down. > > > > - George > > > > == Detail on Not Finding Someone to Take Over > > 2008 Background: > > I've been actively looking for someone appropriate to take on the > > function since early april [april 4]. > > I asked [april 4] two people I thought would be very good > > to take on the function, > > but both eventually said no [april 9 & 14]. > > A third person I thought would also be good [but hadn't considered > > initially] > > thought he wanted to do it but eventually decided [may 5] no. > > > > Earlier Background [i.e. before 2008]: > > I began as coordinator of the group in late 2002 > > so that I would have a close by group to go to > > [and not because I wanted to coordinate a group]. > > Twice in the past I've asked people > > if they'd be willing to take over. > > Both times they ended up saying no. ------------------------------------------------------- From george at metaart.org Wed May 14 11:09:49 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 11:09:49 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Ug Newsletter - Spring Issue Message-ID: <200805141109.49875.george@metaart.org> ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Ug Newsletter - Spring Issue Date: Wednesday 14 May 2008 10:23 From: "Apress User Group Liaison" To: georgeapw at metaart.org Apress User Group Program Newsletter May 2008 Issue Hello registered Apress User Groups! 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URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20080514/98747bae/attachment-0001.html From george at metaart.org Wed May 14 12:04:52 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 12:04:52 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: Promoting Modern Perl Message-ID: <200805141204.52517.george@metaart.org> hi all, there were several urls in the fowarded message that interested me, so i'm forwarding the message to the list. george ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: Promoting Modern Perl Date: Tuesday 13 May 2008 09:46 From: "Perl.com Newsletter" To: sassafras at metaart.org Perl.com update -------------------------------------- The Email for www.perl.com Subscribers =================================================================== Greetings, subscribers. You're skimming the increasingly relevant first paragraph of the Perl newsletter, mailed every two weeks, rain or shine, to land in your inbox. As usual, there's a lot to discuss in the world of Perl. * Perl News Onward to the 100th Perl conference! Philippe Bruhat discovered that there have been nearly one hundred grassroots Perl conferences: http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/04/29/0512200 One Thousand Perl Mongers ... and Jose Castro revealed that there are a thousand Perl Mongers on LinkedIn: http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/04/30/0558209 2008Q2 Grant Proposals The Perl Foundation has published its list of 2008 Q2 grant proposals. The grants committee welcomes comments on the proposals before voting begins. (There are plenty of great proposals this time): http://news.perlfoundation.org/2008/05/2008q2_grant_proposals.html Perl must decentralize, diversify and colonize Andy Lester thinks that the centralization model of Perl is unhealthy and recommends a policy of colonization: http://perlbuzz.com/2008/05/perl-decentralize-diversify-colonize.html YAPC::Asia 2008 The schedule for YAPC::Asia is online: http://conferences.yapcasia.org/ya2008/schedule YAPC::NA So is the schedule for YAPC::NA: http://conferences.mongueurs.net/yn2008/schedule Journal of LaPerla LaPerla tracked the freshness rating of the CPAN. Perl's not dying: http://use.perl.org/~LaPerla/journal/36320 This Fortnight on perl5-porters David Landgren summarized the activities on Perl 5 Porters: http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/05/03/1033231 Perl 6 Design Minutes for 23 April 2008 Your editor minuted the Perl 6 design meetings: http://use.perl.org/~chromatic/journal/36241 Perl 6 Design Minutes for 07 May 2008 http://use.perl.org/~chromatic/journal/36363 * Perl at O'Reilly Pre-order Learning Perl, Fifth Edition The new edition of Learning Perl will be out before OSCON 2008. This edition covers new features in Perl 5.10. Point your next novice there: http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=08/05/01/169214 Beginner's Introduction to Perl 5.10 Perl 5.10 is still shiny and new in the world of Perl 5. Unfortunately, Perl's popularity on the Internet over the past twenty years means that there's a lot of documentation and there are plenty of tutorials that don't teach new users how to take advantage of modern Perl. Your editor is attempting to rectify that situation by updating Perl.com's popular "Beginner's Introduction to Perl" series for 5.10. Here's how to use files and strings in modern Perl: http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2008/05/07/beginners-introduction-to-perl-510-part- 2.html Parrot Compiler Toolkit Your editor also recommends Patrick Michaud's recent presentation on building compilers with Parrot: http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp/blog/2008/05/patrick_michaud_on_the_parrot.h tml Until next week, -c chromatic at oreilly.com Editor, Perl.com, et cetera ====== OSCON CONFERENCE 2008 We're celebrating the 10th anniversary of OSCON in a big, big way. Fourteen tracks, two days of in-depth tutorials, hundreds of sessions, and thought-provoking keynotes will make it hard to decide how best to use your time. Come and join us July 21-25 in Portland, Oregon. Register now and SAVE $250! http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2008/ ------------------------------------------------------------------ PRE-ORDER FIFTH EDITION OF LEARNING PERL Learning Perl, Fifth Edition, --This latest edition has been updated to account for the recent changes to the language up to Perl 5.10. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/9780596520106/ ------------------------------------------------------------------ Interested in sponsoring the Perl.com newsletter? Please email us at advertising at oreilly.com for rate and availability information. Thank you! ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your newsletter subscription options, please visit http://www.oreillynet.com/cs/nl/home For assistance, email help at oreillynet.com O'Reilly Media, Inc. 1005 Gravenstein Highway North Sebastopol, CA 95472 (707) 827-7000 ------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------- From afife at untangle.com Wed May 14 23:06:18 2008 From: afife at untangle.com (Andrew Fife) Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 23:06:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [oak perl] BALUG Dinner: WiFi Mesh Networking (Tuesday) Message-ID: <01e701c8b651$c1923590$4101a8c0@afmeatloaf> Howdy Folks: Balug on Tuesday will host a new speaker, Thomas Belote. Tom will be talking about wireless mesh networking. As a grad student at San Jose State, Thomas has worked on Wireless Mesh Networking and Mobile Ad Hoc Networking. His talk will compare solutions like OLSR and Microsoft's semi open source Mesh Connectivity Layer (that doesn't run on Linux). He will discuss why WDS is not sufficient and a mesh protocol is needed, and discuss the lack of openness thus far in 802.11s even though it is included in the OLPC, as well as security issues and implications. If you'd like to come, please RSVP: RSVP at balug.org Meeting Details... 6:30pm April 20th, 2008 (Tuesday) Four Seas Restaurant 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy $5 Parking: http://www.portsmouthsquaregarage.com/ Cost = $13 for dinner, but the meeting itself is free Upcoming 2008 speakers include: June - Andrew Morton (Linux Kernel) July - Mike Linksyaver (Creative Commons) Aug - TBD Sept - Ian Murdock (Debian & Sun) Signup for BALUG's extremely low volume announce list: http://lists.balug.org/listinfo.cgi/balug-announce-balug.org About BALUG: ------------ BALUG is lively gathering of Linux users & free software enthusiasts that combines great food, community & intimate access to featured speakers. We meet in the bar of the Four Seas Restaurant from 6:30pm. At 7pm, we share a family-style Chinese dinner, which is followed by our guest speaker. BALUG Mailing list Policy: -------------------------- BALUG promises not to abuse other LUGs mailing lists. Our current policy is to make one monthly announcement on other Bay Area LUGs mailing lists. If you feel this is not appropriate for a particular list, please tell us which list and what you feel would be a more appropriate policy for that list. Please send feedback to balug-contact at balug.org. -- Andrew Fife Untangle - The Open Source Network Gateway www.untangle.com/download 650.425.3327 desk 415.806.6028 cell -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20080514/a4d286ba/attachment.html From george at metaart.org Sat May 17 18:00:46 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 18:00:46 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordination Message-ID: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> hi all, i'm thinking i'll disappear from this list june 6. if anyone wants inputs from me re coordinating the group, i suggest contacting me asap, but in any case before june 6. george From david at fetter.org Sat May 17 18:15:49 2008 From: david at fetter.org (David Fetter) Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 18:15:49 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordination In-Reply-To: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> References: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 06:00:46PM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > hi all, > i'm thinking i'll disappear from this list june 6. > if anyone wants inputs from me re coordinating the group, > i suggest contacting me asap, I'd like to help, but I can't take on the whole thing. Some things I *can* do, and have a track record for, are: * Arrange venues * Pester speakers into presenting * Present my own stuff Cheers, David. > but in any case before june 6. > george > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland -- David Fetter http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter at gmail.com Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sat May 17 20:00:08 2008 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 20:00:08 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordination In-Reply-To: <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> References: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> Message-ID: <1211079608.482f9bb85e12d@webmail.rawbw.com> If no one else wants to jump up and do it (or if I'm wanted for additional/fallback/backup coverage), I could likely cover maintaining the web pages and mailinglist (I already do much of that for BALUG). I'm guestimating (based on some DNS information) that most all of the oakland.pm.org. resources exist on pm.org. system(s), and there are administrators already covering core stuff there ... but "Oakland Perl Mongers" needs person(s) to cover maintenance of the oakland.pm.org. web pages and list administration. Let us know if that's not the case. As for book shipments (O'Reilly, etc.) - I could probably accept, or temporarily accept those, if need be - but would probably be better if we find someone who might be a bit better set up to receive such shipments (e.g. business or multi-person residence in Oakland, and/or someone that wouldn't mind shlepping the books from shipment receipt location to meeting location perhaps as frequently as every month; ... I receive the BUUG book shipments presently ... but it's fairly unlikely I'd be missing many BUUG meetings, as they're quite conveniently close to me). Just let me know. Quoting David Fetter : > On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 06:00:46PM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > hi all, > > i'm thinking i'll disappear from this list june 6. > > if anyone wants inputs from me re coordinating the group, > > i suggest contacting me asap, > > I'd like to help, but I can't take on the whole thing. > > Some things I *can* do, and have a track record for, are: > > * Arrange venues > * Pester speakers into presenting > * Present my own stuff > > Cheers, > David. > > > but in any case before june 6. > > george From george at metaart.org Sat May 17 20:35:06 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 20:35:06 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordination In-Reply-To: <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> References: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> Message-ID: <200805172035.06302.george@metaart.org> hi david, thanks for being willing to do those things. and thanks for for your quick response. george --------------------------------------- On Saturday 17 May 2008 18:15, David Fetter wrote: > On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 06:00:46PM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > hi all, > > i'm thinking i'll disappear from this list june 6. > > if anyone wants inputs from me re coordinating the group, > > i suggest contacting me asap, > > I'd like to help, but I can't take on the whole thing. > > Some things I *can* do, and have a track record for, are: > > * Arrange venues > * Pester speakers into presenting > * Present my own stuff > > Cheers, > David. > > > but in any case before june 6. > > george > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland at pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Sat May 17 22:11:14 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 22:11:14 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordination In-Reply-To: <1211079608.482f9bb85e12d@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <200805171800.46023.george@metaart.org> <20080518011549.GF12033@fetter.org> <1211079608.482f9bb85e12d@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <200805172211.14090.george@metaart.org> hi michael, thanks for being willing to do so much. On Saturday 17 May 2008 20:00, you wrote: > If no one else wants to jump up and do it (or if I'm wanted for > additional/fallback/backup coverage), I could likely cover maintaining > the web pages and mailinglist (I already do much of that for BALUG). in my opinion the three main things that need to be addressed are: meetings, web site and mailing list. if i understand correctly, david fetter is willing to handle meetings. and i gather, you are willing to handle the other two. hm, i guess the group also needs someone to be the perl mongers contact. i think the group also needs someone to take on the overall responsibility. i recommend one person do both. > > I'm guestimating (based on some DNS information) that most all of the > oakland.pm.org. resources exist on pm.org. system(s), and there are > administrators already covering core stuff there ... but > "Oakland Perl Mongers" needs person(s) to cover maintenance of > the oakland.pm.org. web pages and list administration. > Let us know if that's not the case. the mailing list is on pm.org and pm has very good administrative support for mailing lists. i have the website on metaart.org currently. however, i recommend a minimalist website similar to http://www.metaart.org/test/regroup/index.html the details would, of course, be different. for a real world model, see the Sonoma.pm website. you may want the website to be on pm.org using webdav. currently, we have a website on pm.org; it redirects to our website. in my experience [mostly not recent], pm support is very good for websites too. > > As for book shipments (O'Reilly, etc.) - I could probably accept, or > temporarily accept those, if need be - but would probably be better > if we find someone who might be a bit better set up to receive > such shipments (e.g. business or multi-person residence in Oakland, > and/or someone that wouldn't mind shlepping the books from shipment > receipt location to meeting location perhaps as frequently as every > month; ... I receive the BUUG book shipments presently ... but it's > fairly unlikely I'd be missing many BUUG meetings, as they're quite > conveniently close to me). nearly all of the books i've gotten from o'reilly recently have been specifically requested. typically they are for putting up banners or for special meetings. it's not necessary to request any books. however, if you want many o'reilly books what you say above is highly relevant. > > Just let me know. i'm hopeful someone will step forward to take on the overall function, especially now that two people have volunteered to take on what i thought of as the three main functions. i think that's the person who should let you know. if you volunteer for that function, then i don't think you need any approval. george -------------------------------------------- > > Quoting David Fetter : > > On Sat, May 17, 2008 at 06:00:46PM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > > > hi all, > > > i'm thinking i'll disappear from this list june 6. > > > if anyone wants inputs from me re coordinating the group, > > > i suggest contacting me asap, > > > > I'd like to help, but I can't take on the whole thing. > > > > Some things I *can* do, and have a track record for, are: > > > > * Arrange venues > > * Pester speakers into presenting > > * Present my own stuff > > > > Cheers, > > David. > > > > > but in any case before june 6. > > > george From george at metaart.org Tue May 20 09:34:01 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Tue, 20 May 2008 09:34:01 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Group Coordinator Message-ID: <200805200934.01964.george@metaart.org> hi all, jon seidel has volunteered to be the new group leader of our group including being listed on perl mongers as such. i highly recommend jon for this function. he's one of the two people i asked last month to take on the function. at the time he declined due to the work load, however, recently two people have volunteered to take on much of the work. skoal, george From george at metaart.org Tue May 20 18:13:46 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Tue, 20 May 2008 18:13:46 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Fwd: UG News - O'Reilly Webcast - Top Five Log Analysis Mistakes Message-ID: <200805201813.46527.george@metaart.org> ---------- Forwarded Message ---------- Subject: UG News - O'Reilly Webcast - Top Five Log Analysis Mistakes Date: Tuesday 20 May 2008 16:48 From: "Marsee Henon" To: george at metaart.org You are invited to a free live webcast: The Top Five Log Analysis Mistakes Presented by Anton Chuvakin In this live webcast, security expert Anton Chuvakin will cover operational security challenges that organizations face while deploying log and alert collection and analysis infrastructure. The talk will center around the common mistakes organizations may make in that process, which include not storing logs long enough, not preserving the forensic quality of the logs, only looking for known bad records, and others. Learn how to avoid these and other mistakes and how to get the most value out of various log files, generated by systems, applications and security devices. =================== Attendance is limited, so register now. We'll send you a reminder before the webcast. And please feel free to share this invitation with others. Date: Tuesday, May 27 at 10am PDT (17:00 GMT) Cost: Free Duration: approximately 45 minutes Meeting link: http://oreilly.com/go/webcast-warrior Teleconference dial-in: (select the number that is closest to your location) East Coast US: +1 617 231-0350 and pin 8136507 West Coast US: +1 213-455-0500 and pin 8136507 Questions? Please send email to webcast at oreilly.com =================== About Anton Chuvakin Dr Anton Chuvakin is a recognized security expert and book author. His current role is Chief Logging Evangelist with LogLogic, a log management company. He is an author and contributor to several security books including "Security Warrior," "Know Your Enemy II," "Information Security Management Handbook," " Hacker's Challenge 3," and "PCI Compliance." Chuvakin has also published numerous papers on security issues and is an active blogger (see www.securitywarrior.org) and frequent speaker at security conferences. He participates in various security industry initiatives and standards organizations. =================== About O'Reilly O'Reilly Media spreads the knowledge of innovators through its books, online services, magazines, and conferences. Since 1978, O'Reilly Media has been a chronicler and catalyst of cutting-edge development, homing in on the technology trends that really matter and spurring their adoption by amplifying "faint signals" from the alpha geeks who are creating the future. An active participant in the technology community, the company has a long history of advocacy, meme-making, and evangelism. # # # O'Reilly is a registered trademark of O'Reilly Media, Inc. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners. ------------------------------------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20080520/3e7367cd/attachment.html From george at metaart.org Thu May 29 17:23:25 2008 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Thu, 29 May 2008 17:23:25 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Blog Entry Message-ID: <200805291723.25017.george@metaart.org> url of blog entry: http://luqui.org/blog/archives/2008/05/29/ oo-is-not-the-one-true-paradigm-but-haskell-still-sucks-at-it/ note: url above is [probably] on two lines. hi all, i found the referenced [above] blog entry interesting. i didn't understand all of it, but it was engaging. the blog entry is by luke palmer. i wondered why i hadn't seen his name lately; now i have some idea why. george From david at fetter.org Thu May 29 18:36:18 2008 From: david at fetter.org (David Fetter) Date: Thu, 29 May 2008 18:36:18 -0700 Subject: [oak perl] Interesting Blog Entry In-Reply-To: <200805291723.25017.george@metaart.org> References: <200805291723.25017.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20080530013618.GF31478@fetter.org> On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 05:23:25PM -0700, George Woolley wrote: > url of blog entry: > http://luqui.org/blog/archives/2008/05/29/ > oo-is-not-the-one-true-paradigm-but-haskell-still-sucks-at-it/ > > note: url above is [probably] on two lines. 'tis indeed. I've found a couple of neat tricks for long URLs: , which has widgets for your browser toolbar, and putting the URLs inside angle brackets, which generally lets email clients know not to stuff linebreaks inside :) What other strategies do people have? > hi all, > i found the referenced [above] blog entry interesting. > i didn't understand all of it, but it was engaging. Perl's TMTOWTDI is much in evidence here. > the blog entry is by luke palmer. > i wondered why i hadn't seen his name lately; > now i have some idea why. Heh. Cheers, David. -- David Fetter http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter at gmail.com Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate