From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 14:03:36 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] stability/usability of perl 6? Message-ID: in the midst of rewriting some of my courseware manuals, and i just got a copy of o'reilly's "Essentials of Perl 6". the question -- give that i'm under no time pressure, what is the wisdom in rewriting my perl programming course for perl 6? i haven't taken a stab at downloading/using whatever is available for perl 6 (i'm assuming there's a CVS tree), but it might be interesting to rewrite the course to be right out there on the leading edge. if that's even doable. thoughts? rday From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 14:59:08 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? Message-ID: just skimming the aforementioned o'reilly perl 6 book, and i'm confused about its description of how to index into an array. on p 26 (if you happen to have the book), we have the example: @array = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian") ; $second_element = @array[1] ; ?????? since when? i thought you'd write that second statement as ... $array[1] ; am i just hopelessly confused? it's been a long day, i'm tired and maybe i'm just not thinking clearly. rday From da at coder.com Tue Jul 8 15:09:39 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and hashes retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. Check earlier in the book- it's probably one of the first things they mention. :-) -D http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > just skimming the aforementioned o'reilly perl 6 book, > and i'm confused about its description of how to index > into an array. > > on p 26 (if you happen to have the book), we have the > example: > > @array = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian") ; > $second_element = @array[1] ; ?????? > > since when? i thought you'd write that second statement as > ... $array[1] ; > > am i just hopelessly confused? it's been a long day, > i'm tired and maybe i'm just not thinking clearly. > > rday > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 15:12:13 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and hashes > retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. > > Check earlier in the book- it's probably one of the first things they > mention. :-) holy crap. so perl 6 is not even remotely backward compatible? apparently, i have some serious reading to do. thanks. rday From da at coder.com Tue Jul 8 15:18:03 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting Message-ID: Summer-itis is firmly upon us. I just got back from a week away, and I didn't remember to post about July's Meeting before I left. We're currently scheduled to meet July 17th, ten days from now, at an as-yet undetermined location. I can get us the same space as last month, if people wanted to meet there... Last month, we had a total of 4 attenders. Are people going to be around and willing to spend their evening cooped up indoors, or would you prefer postponing our mod_perl talk until later in the season? (aug. or sept.?) -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com From akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com Tue Jul 8 15:21:53 2003 From: akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com (Andrew Kohlsmith) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> > > I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and > > hashes retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. > holy crap. so perl 6 is not even remotely backward compatible? > apparently, i have some serious reading to do. thanks. You can do that today, you just get a warning: $ perl -wTe '@ary = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian"); $second_element = @ary[1];' Scalar value @ary[1] better written as $ary[1] at -e line 1. Name "main::second_element" used only once: possible typo at -e line 1. $ perl --version This is perl, v5.8.0 built for i386-linux So perhaps not backward-compatible but Perl somehow manages to be forward-compatible. :-) Regards, Andrew From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 15:32:41 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Summer-itis is firmly upon us. I just got back from a week away, and I > didn't remember to post about July's Meeting before I left. > > We're currently scheduled to meet July 17th, ten days from now, at an > as-yet undetermined location. I can get us the same space as last month, > if people wanted to meet there... > > Last month, we had a total of 4 attenders. Are people going to be around > and willing to spend their evening cooped up indoors, or would you prefer > postponing our mod_perl talk until later in the season? (aug. or sept.?) well, given my last couple of posts, i'd be interested in a tutorial on how to get what i can of perl6/parrot running on my RH 9 box. i'll even supply the box for config purposes, and if someone wants to do this as the next talk, i'll even buy the pizza. any takers? rday -- Robert P. J. Day Eno River Technologies Unix, Linux and Open Source training Waterloo, Ontario www.enoriver.com From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 17:58:39 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Andrew Kohlsmith wrote: > > > I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and > > > hashes retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. > > > holy crap. so perl 6 is not even remotely backward compatible? > > apparently, i have some serious reading to do. thanks. > > You can do that today, you just get a warning: > > $ perl -wTe '@ary = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian"); $second_element = > @ary[1];' > Scalar value @ary[1] better written as $ary[1] at -e line 1. > Name "main::second_element" used only once: possible typo at -e line 1. oh, i knew that. but there were definite gotchas with confusing those two syntaxes if you were, say, assigning from an open filehandle. consider the massive difference between these two assignments: $arr[0] = FH ; @arr[0] = FH ; as i recall, the first would simply read the next line (since this was in a scalar context). the second, however, would (because of the array context) read the entire remainder of the file and throw away everything except for the one line it assigned to the LHS. this suggests that there *will* be major incompatibility problems since using the "@" sigil will be the correct way to do this in Perl 6. anyway, back to reading the Perl 6 book. rday From sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca Tue Jul 8 19:06:50 2003 From: sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca (Simon Law) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> References: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> Message-ID: <20030709000650.GG24731@law.yi.org> On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 04:21:53PM -0400, Andrew Kohlsmith wrote: > > > I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and > > > hashes retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. > > > holy crap. so perl 6 is not even remotely backward compatible? > > apparently, i have some serious reading to do. thanks. > > You can do that today, you just get a warning: > > $ perl -wTe '@ary = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian"); $second_element = > @ary[1];' > Scalar value @ary[1] better written as $ary[1] at -e line 1. > Name "main::second_element" used only once: possible typo at -e line 1. Eliminate those errors with Perl6::Variables, written by our favourite Australian Perl hacker. Simon From sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca Tue Jul 8 19:15:14 2003 From: sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca (Simon Law) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: References: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> Message-ID: <20030709001514.GH24731@law.yi.org> On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 06:58:39PM -0400, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Andrew Kohlsmith wrote: > > > > > I don't have the book, but that's one of perl6 changes- arrays and > > > > hashes retain their sigil when they're sliced/diced. > > > > > holy crap. so perl 6 is not even remotely backward compatible? > > > apparently, i have some serious reading to do. thanks. > > > > You can do that today, you just get a warning: > > > > $ perl -wTe '@ary = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian"); $second_element = > > @ary[1];' > > Scalar value @ary[1] better written as $ary[1] at -e line 1. > > Name "main::second_element" used only once: possible typo at -e line 1. > > oh, i knew that. but there were definite gotchas with confusing those > two syntaxes if you were, say, assigning from an open filehandle. > consider the massive difference between these two assignments: > > $arr[0] = FH ; > @arr[0] = FH ; > > as i recall, the first would simply read the next line (since this > was in a scalar context). > > the second, however, would (because of the array context) read the > entire remainder of the file and throw away everything except for > the one line it assigned to the LHS. The second does not seem semantically correct for Perl 5. Especially if you've already declared my @arr; earlier in the program. (Otherwise, the first line would not make sense.) > this suggests that there *will* be major incompatibility problems > since using the "@" sigil will be the correct way to do this in > Perl 6. Well, that's because Perl 6 is throwing away most of the cruft in Perl. For instance, filehandles are no longer barewords but are properly scalars. So instead of saying: open(FH, ') { # do stuff } you'd say: my $FH = open(') { # do stuff } but that's not quite idiomatic. What you really would say is: while () { # do stuff } Simon From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 19:19:29 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <20030709001514.GH24731@law.yi.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 06:58:39PM -0400, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > $arr[0] = FH ; > > @arr[0] = FH ; > > The second does not seem semantically correct for Perl 5. > Especially if you've already declared > > my @arr; > > earlier in the program. (Otherwise, the first line would not make > sense.) but the "gotcha" above is a well-known feature of perl 5 that is used to emphasize why you shouldn't confuse those two syntaxes. an open filehandle in an array context returns the entire remaining contents of the file as a list, one line per list entry. if you use that second form, the array context forces just that, while only having room to store the first of all those lines. all the rest are read and discarded. really. i'm not making this up. i've seen this example in at least two different places as an example of what can go wrong if you confuse the proper way to refer to an array element in perl 5. has no one else ever seen this? rday From sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca Tue Jul 8 19:33:27 2003 From: sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca (Simon Law) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: References: <20030709001514.GH24731@law.yi.org> Message-ID: <20030709003327.GI24731@law.yi.org> Please respect my Mail-Followup-To header and do not CC me on replies. There is no need. On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 08:19:29PM -0400, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > really. i'm not making this up. i've seen this example in at > least two different places as an example of what can go wrong > if you confuse the proper way to refer to an array element in > perl 5. Well, then this "feature" gets eliminated. Yay. > has no one else ever seen this? Nope. Are you sure that it isn't caught by use warnings and use strict? Simon From rpjday at mindspring.com Tue Jul 8 19:32:24 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <20030709003327.GI24731@law.yi.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 08:19:29PM -0400, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > really. i'm not making this up. i've seen this example in at > > least two different places as an example of what can go wrong > > if you confuse the proper way to refer to an array element in > > perl 5. > > Nope. Are you sure that it isn't caught by use warnings and use > strict? oh, it may very well get flagged, but it does work that way, nonetheless. wish i could remember where i read it first. perhaps "effective programming in perl". the book with 50 tips/hints for good perl programming. rday From akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com Tue Jul 8 19:45:04 2003 From: akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com (Andrew Kohlsmith) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <20030709000650.GG24731@law.yi.org> References: <200307081621.53465@-mixdown.ca> <20030709000650.GG24731@law.yi.org> Message-ID: <200307082045.04167@-mixdown.ca> > Eliminate those errors with Perl6::Variables, written by our > favourite Australian Perl hacker. Or simply not use -w? :-) Personally I code all my perl with -wT and use strict... it's bitten me a few times, mostly with OO I think (it's been quite some time since I've used Perl but will be getting back into it shortly, as I need to create an EDS file creator. :-) Who's our favourite Australian Perl hacker? Regards, Andrew From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Tue Jul 8 22:32:51 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: First read the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy LOL On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 15:59:08 -0400 (EDT) > From: Robert P. J. Day > To: KW Perl list > Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? > > > just skimming the aforementioned o'reilly perl 6 book, > and i'm confused about its description of how to index > into an array. > > on p 26 (if you happen to have the book), we have the > example: > > @array = ("Zaphod", "Ford", "Trillian") ; > $second_element = @array[1] ; ?????? > > since when? i thought you'd write that second statement as > ... $array[1] ; > > am i just hopelessly confused? it's been a long day, > i'm tired and maybe i'm just not thinking clearly. > > rday > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Tue Jul 8 22:54:42 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Summer-itis seems to be endemic. I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( I say we take June, July and August off every year. I'll see you in September. Lloyd On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 16:18:03 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting > > Summer-itis is firmly upon us. I just got back from a week away, and I > didn't remember to post about July's Meeting before I left. > > We're currently scheduled to meet July 17th, ten days from now, at an > as-yet undetermined location. I can get us the same space as last month, > if people wanted to meet there... > > Last month, we had a total of 4 attenders. Are people going to be around > and willing to spend their evening cooped up indoors, or would you prefer > postponing our mod_perl talk until later in the season? (aug. or sept.?) > > -Daniel > > http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From rpjday at mindspring.com Wed Jul 9 07:46:43 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] questions about perl 6? Message-ID: i'm poring over the "essentials of perl 6" book i mentioned earlier. whew, talk about a major rethink about how to program in perl. i have a few questions about the proposed new features. is this a reasonable place to ask them? i'd rather not join the official p6l list, i suspect it's way over my head. rday From da at coder.com Wed Jul 9 11:05:23 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? Message-ID: Regarding compatibility between perl5 and 6: 6 will have a compatibility mode to read perl5 code. See Apocolypse 1. A quote: "A closely related question is how Perl is going to recognize when it has accidentally been fed Perl 5 code rather than Perl 6 code. It would be rather bad to suddenly give working code a brand new set of semantics. The answer, I believe, is that it has to be impossible by definition to accidentally feed Perl 5 code to Perl 6. That is, Perl 6 must assume it is being fed Perl 5 code until it knows otherwise. And that implies that we must have some declaration that unambiguously declares the code to be Perl 6" Robert, I'm curious what the book on perl6 says on the topic. I'll be surprised if this idea got abandoned. Regarding @foo[0] vs $foo[0]: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > > On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 08:19:29PM -0400, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > really. i'm not making this up. i've seen this example in at > > > least two different places as an example of what can go wrong > > > if you confuse the proper way to refer to an array element in > > > perl 5. > > > > Nope. Are you sure that it isn't caught by use warnings and use > > strict? > > oh, it may very well get flagged, but it does work that way, > nonetheless. wish i could remember where i read it first. > perhaps "effective programming in perl". the book with 50 > tips/hints for good perl programming. OK, the note is worth making. "If you don't use warnings, and you expect @foo[0] to act the same as $foo[0], you're doubly screwed." Not oddly, I've never noticed this behaviour, because I tend to use warnings. -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com From da at coder.com Wed Jul 9 11:05:39 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: <200307082045.04167@-mixdown.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Andrew Kohlsmith wrote: > > Eliminate those errors with Perl6::Variables, written by our > > favourite Australian Perl hacker. > > Or simply not use -w? :-) > > Personally I code all my perl with -wT and use strict... it's bitten me a > few times, mostly with OO I think (it's been quite some time since I've > used Perl but will be getting back into it shortly, as I need to create an > EDS file creator. :-) > > Who's our favourite Australian Perl hacker? http://www.coder.com/daniel/photos/yapc_2002/06270003.jpg http://search.cpan.org/author/DCONWAY/ for fun: http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html for work: (excellent OO perl book) http://www.manning.com/Conway/ From akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com Wed Jul 9 12:36:33 2003 From: akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com (Andrew Kohlsmith) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] is perl 6 really that different? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200307091336.33905@-mixdown.ca> > > Who's our favourite Australian Perl hacker? > http://www.coder.com/daniel/photos/yapc_2002/06270003.jpg My god, he looks a lot like Robert! Regards, Andrew From elbie at trig.net Wed Jul 9 16:06:17 2003 From: elbie at trig.net (Christopher Calzonetti) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030709210617.GC69859@trig.net> What? And give up three nights a year of perl-related drinking? On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 03:54:42AM +0000, lloyd carr wrote: > Summer-itis seems to be endemic. > I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel > their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( > I say we take June, July and August off every year. > I'll see you in September. > > Lloyd From rpjday at mindspring.com Wed Jul 9 16:10:53 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] what is "truth value" in perl 6? Message-ID: from what i'm reading, perl 6 *seems* to extend the notion of boolean values from perl 5 in defining a real "truth value" of a variable. according to the book, "The unary ? operator ... forces boolean context... With the ? operator, you can force boolean context and assign the truth value of a variable instead of the numeric value." $value = $number ; # standard assignment $value = ?$number ; # assign truth value of $number but what exactly would be assigned? a zero or one? is this referring to an inherent true or false value that i haven't seen described yet? rday From rpjday at mindspring.com Wed Jul 9 16:14:27 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: <20030709210617.GC69859@trig.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Christopher Calzonetti wrote: > What? And give up three nights a year of perl-related drinking? > > On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 03:54:42AM +0000, lloyd carr wrote: > > Summer-itis seems to be endemic. > > I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel > > their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( > > I say we take June, July and August off every year. > > I'll see you in September. i already emailed daniel. if it's going to be an unpredictable turnout, i vote for finding a bar, and i'll bring the ORA book "perl 6 essentials" and we can argue about it. rday From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Wed Jul 9 16:43:40 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: <20030709210617.GC69859@trig.net> Message-ID: Are you suggesting, summer pub nights on the patio? :-) On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Christopher Calzonetti wrote: > Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:06:17 -0400 > From: Christopher Calzonetti > To: lloyd carr > Cc: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] July Meeting > > What? And give up three nights a year of perl-related drinking? > > On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 03:54:42AM +0000, lloyd carr wrote: > > Summer-itis seems to be endemic. > > I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel > > their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( > > I say we take June, July and August off every year. > > I'll see you in September. > > > > Lloyd > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Wed Jul 9 16:47:10 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Oh so Robert is thirsty :-) On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:14:27 -0400 (EDT) > From: Robert P. J. Day > To: Christopher Calzonetti > Cc: lloyd carr , kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] July Meeting > > On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Christopher Calzonetti wrote: > > > What? And give up three nights a year of perl-related drinking? > > > > On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 03:54:42AM +0000, lloyd carr wrote: > > > Summer-itis seems to be endemic. > > > I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel > > > their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( > > > I say we take June, July and August off every year. > > > I'll see you in September. > > i already emailed daniel. if it's going to be an unpredictable > turnout, i vote for finding a bar, and i'll bring the ORA book > "perl 6 essentials" and we can argue about it. > > rday > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From rpjday at mindspring.com Wed Jul 9 16:47:57 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > Oh so Robert is thirsty :-) that has never been a pre-requisite for drinking beer. rday From da at coder.com Wed Jul 9 20:47:28 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Assuming that Andrew isn't dead-set on giving the mod_perl talk before September, I think it makes sense to have a patio beer meeting instead of a tech meeting during the summer months. I certainly haven't gotten any email (yet) from people saying "no! I wanted to sit inside and stare at a projector all evening!" :-) How about we try someplace new? Does Ethel's Lounge have a patio? I ate there recently, and they have good food and good beer. -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > Are you suggesting, summer pub nights on the patio? :-) > > On Wed, 9 Jul 2003, Christopher Calzonetti wrote: > > > Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 17:06:17 -0400 > > From: Christopher Calzonetti > > To: lloyd carr > > Cc: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] July Meeting > > > > What? And give up three nights a year of perl-related drinking? > > > > On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 03:54:42AM +0000, lloyd carr wrote: > > > Summer-itis seems to be endemic. > > > I've been bitten by a number of groups this summer that didn't cancel > > > their meetings, but when I went no one showed up :-( > > > I say we take June, July and August off every year. > > > I'll see you in September. > > > > > > Lloyd > > > > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org > SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com Wed Jul 9 21:09:05 2003 From: akohlsmith-pm at benshaw.com (Andrew Kohlsmith) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200307092209.05470@-mixdown.ca> > Assuming that Andrew isn't dead-set on giving the mod_perl talk before > September, I think it makes sense to have a patio beer meeting instead of > a tech meeting during the summer months. I certainly haven't gotten any > email (yet) from people saying "no! I wanted to sit inside and stare at a > projector all evening!" :-) I'm giving a mod_perl talk? I remember saying I'd love to be in for a good technical mod_perl talk, but I'm definitely not knowledgeable enough to _give_ a talk on mod_perl... > How about we try someplace new? Does Ethel's Lounge have a patio? I ate > there recently, and they have good food and good beer. I've heard the same. Regards, Andrew From arguile at lucentstudios.com Thu Jul 10 00:09:27 2003 From: arguile at lucentstudios.com (Arguile) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1057813606.15777.16.camel@broadswd> On Wed, 2003-07-09 at 21:47, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Assuming that Andrew isn't dead-set on giving the mod_perl talk before > September, I think it makes sense to have a patio beer meeting instead of > a tech meeting during the summer months. I certainly haven't gotten any > email (yet) from people saying "no! I wanted to sit inside and stare at a > projector all evening!" :-) s/Andrew/Arguile/; # At least last anyone told me :) Anyways, I'd be fine giving it later. Sitting around drinking beer and talking shop -- whilst enjoying the summer eye-candy on the patio -- sounds fine. > How about we try someplace new? Does Ethel's Lounge have a patio? I ate > there recently, and they have good food and good beer. Yes they do have a patio out the side. I will never understand the love for linoleum and cheap dives that drives people to Ethel's, but I'm game :). It should be warned though that any patio meeting is likely to involve other patrons (or some among us?) smoking. From pm at datademons.com Thu Jul 10 00:13:39 2003 From: pm at datademons.com (Justin Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: <1057813606.15777.16.camel@broadswd> Message-ID: Am thinking I'd be in on this one too -- especially since it'd provide a slightly more laid back environment in which I can meet all the people of kw-pm (or at least the ones that show up.) I just need to remind myself when it will be, and figure out where in the hell Ethel's is. As for the smoking, I'm OK with it as long as I'm not downwind. :) Regards, Justin Wheeler -- SENILE.COM found . . . Out of Memory . . . On 10 Jul 2003, Arguile wrote: > On Wed, 2003-07-09 at 21:47, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > > Assuming that Andrew isn't dead-set on giving the mod_perl talk before > > September, I think it makes sense to have a patio beer meeting instead of > > a tech meeting during the summer months. I certainly haven't gotten any > > email (yet) from people saying "no! I wanted to sit inside and stare at a > > projector all evening!" :-) > > s/Andrew/Arguile/; # At least last anyone told me :) > > Anyways, I'd be fine giving it later. Sitting around drinking beer and > talking shop -- whilst enjoying the summer eye-candy on the patio -- > sounds fine. > > > How about we try someplace new? Does Ethel's Lounge have a patio? I ate > > there recently, and they have good food and good beer. > > Yes they do have a patio out the side. I will never understand the love > for linoleum and cheap dives that drives people to Ethel's, but I'm game > :). It should be warned though that any patio meeting is likely to > involve other patrons (or some among us?) smoking. > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From arguile at lucentstudios.com Thu Jul 10 00:23:04 2003 From: arguile at lucentstudios.com (Arguile) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:31 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1057814418.15760.47.camel@broadswd> On Thu, 2003-07-10 at 01:13, Justin Wheeler wrote: [snip] > I just need to remind myself when it will be, and figure out where in the > hell Ethel's is. Ethels is on King Street in Waterloo, a few blocks down from Bridgeport. It's on the right if you're heading from Kitchener into Waterloo. From arguile at lucentstudios.com Thu Jul 10 00:48:47 2003 From: arguile at lucentstudios.com (Arguile) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] what is "truth value" in perl 6? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1057815964.15776.99.camel@broadswd> On Wed, 2003-07-09 at 17:10, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > from what i'm reading, perl 6 *seems* to extend the notion of > boolean values from perl 5 in defining a real "truth value" of > a variable. P5 has real bools, they're just hidden within the internal variable object. I'm sure you've heard of "zero but true" (OEO); the case where the integer value of the object is "0", but the boolean value is "true". Read about variable "Overload"ing. > > according to the book, "The unary ? operator ... forces boolean > context... With the ? operator, you can force boolean context and > assign the truth value of a variable instead of the numeric value." > > $value = $number ; # standard assignment > $value = ?$number ; # assign truth value of $number > > but what exactly would be assigned? a zero or one? No, "true" or "false" would be assigned. As to what the string representation of a pure bool will be I'm not sure. > is this referring to an inherent true or false value that i > haven't seen described yet? Read Apocalype 4 (I think that's the one). It describes the internal types and a bit about their workings. P6, like P5, will still be a dynamically weakly typed language, but you'll be able to declare stuff like this: my $foo : bool; # Not sure if this is even remotely # the correct syntax. This means that you get some of the compile time type checking benefits seen in other languages. Just as importantly though, you're also declaring storage requirements to some extent; again like other (C/C++) languages. When you declare a variable of type 'foo' in P6, it will only keep the parts of it's internal variable structures that relate to that type. Thus using less memory and functioning faster than if the entire object was always carried around (as P5d does). P.S. I'll try to find the threads/articles I read this in but don't hold your breath. P.P.S. My terminology when dealing with P5 and P6 internals is probably way off, I apologize for that. I don't follow it closely enough to pick up on their jargon. I was also trying to avoid explaining perlguts in-depth as I have only a loose/working understanding myself. From elbie at trig.net Thu Jul 10 06:38:13 2003 From: elbie at trig.net (Christopher Calzonetti) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: <1057814418.15760.47.camel@broadswd> References: <1057814418.15760.47.camel@broadswd> Message-ID: <20030710113813.GA18426@trig.net> Across the street from the uptown Waterloo Tim Horton's at Young St. On Thu, Jul 10, 2003 at 01:20:17AM -0400, Arguile wrote: > On Thu, 2003-07-10 at 01:13, Justin Wheeler wrote: > [snip] > > I just need to remind myself when it will be, and figure out where in the > > hell Ethel's is. > > Ethels is on King Street in Waterloo, a few blocks down from Bridgeport. > It's on the right if you're heading from Kitchener into Waterloo. From da at coder.com Thu Jul 10 08:03:47 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] July Meeting In-Reply-To: <1057813606.15777.16.camel@broadswd> Message-ID: On 10 Jul 2003, Arguile wrote: > s/Andrew/Arguile/; # At least last anyone told me :) s/Daniel R. Allen/Brain Sometimes Functional/g; > Anyways, I'd be fine giving it later. Sitting around drinking beer and > talking shop -- whilst enjoying the summer eye-candy on the patio -- > sounds fine. > > > How about we try someplace new? Does Ethel's Lounge have a patio? I ate > > there recently, and they have good food and good beer. > > Yes they do have a patio out the side. I will never understand the love > for linoleum and cheap dives that drives people to Ethel's, but I'm game > :). ...I'd call them a boutique dive, if such could exist. They put some effort into the dive look, the prices were too normal for a dive, they had lots of beers on tap, and the food was better than I expected. > It should be warned though that any patio meeting is likely to > involve other patrons (or some among us?) smoking. Assuming we're not sitting in a blue fog or thundershowers, I can cope. If all else fails, we pick up and go inside. :-) It sounds like we've got more interest in a patio meeting than a tech meeting this month and next. Chris, want to change the website, or shall I? -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com From rpjday at mindspring.com Thu Jul 17 11:14:07 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? Message-ID: given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). rday From pm at datademons.com Thu Jul 17 11:23:54 2003 From: pm at datademons.com (Justin Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. Regards, Justin Wheeler -- Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > rday > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From pm at datademons.com Thu Jul 17 11:25:26 2003 From: pm at datademons.com (Justin Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Alternatively, I could give Daniel a ride, and then *he'll* know what I'm looking for. Regards, Justin Wheeler -- Ultimate office automation: networked coffee. On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > Regards, > Justin Wheeler > > -- > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > rday > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From da at coder.com Thu Jul 17 11:44:22 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethel's? Message-ID: Ack. Apologies for not posting a reminder about this meeting earlier. Mostly because, well, I forgot. :-/ /me madly rushes to see if he has other committments this evening that now conflict... /me makes a mental note to buy himself a replacement brain, as well -D On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > Alternatively, I could give Daniel a ride, and then *he'll* know what I'm > looking for. > > Regards, > Justin Wheeler > > -- > Ultimate office automation: networked coffee. > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > > > Regards, > > Justin Wheeler > > > > -- > > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > > > rday > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From pm at datademons.com Thu Jul 17 11:47:02 2003 From: pm at datademons.com (Justin Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethel's? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Actually, I meant Robert. Wrong name... you might have figured that out by now. :) Regards, Justin Wheeler -- RAM disk is *not* an installation procedure. On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Ack. > > Apologies for not posting a reminder about this meeting earlier. > Mostly because, well, I forgot. :-/ > > /me madly rushes to see if he has other committments this evening that > now conflict... > > /me makes a mental note to buy himself a replacement brain, as well > > -D > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > Alternatively, I could give Daniel a ride, and then *he'll* know what I'm > > looking for. > > > > Regards, > > Justin Wheeler > > > > -- > > Ultimate office automation: networked coffee. > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > > > > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > > > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > > > > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > > > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Justin Wheeler > > > > > > -- > > > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > > > > > rday > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From da at coder.com Thu Jul 17 13:42:46 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] regrets Message-ID: Due to bad planning on my part, it doesn't look like I'll make it to Ethel's tonight. Lloyd, that means I won't be able to get you the LWP book as promised. :-( -D From sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca Thu Jul 17 13:51:24 2003 From: sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca (Simon Law) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] regrets In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030717185124.GD28294@law.yi.org> On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 02:42:46PM -0400, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Due to bad planning on my part, it doesn't look like I'll make it to > Ethel's tonight. Lloyd, that means I won't be able to get you the LWP > book as promised. :-( Neither can I due to previous, long-standing committments. I do encourage everyone to try the Antijitos there. They are quite good. Simon From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Thu Jul 17 15:22:36 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Darn now we can't eat his curry :-( On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 12:23:54 -0400 (EDT) > From: Justin Wheeler > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > Regards, > Justin Wheeler > > -- > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > rday > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Thu Jul 17 15:24:31 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Look for camels LOL Thirsty camels ;-) On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 12:25:26 -0400 (EDT) > From: Justin Wheeler > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? > > Alternatively, I could give Daniel a ride, and then *he'll* know what I'm > looking for. > > Regards, > Justin Wheeler > > -- > Ultimate office automation: networked coffee. > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > > > Regards, > > Justin Wheeler > > > > -- > > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > > > rday > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Thu Jul 17 15:26:44 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethel's? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Daniel, why replace your brain, it's hardly been used On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 12:44:22 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethel's? > > Ack. > > Apologies for not posting a reminder about this meeting earlier. > Mostly because, well, I forgot. :-/ > > /me madly rushes to see if he has other committments this evening that > now conflict... > > /me makes a mental note to buy himself a replacement brain, as well > > -D > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > Alternatively, I could give Daniel a ride, and then *he'll* know what I'm > > looking for. > > > > Regards, > > Justin Wheeler > > > > -- > > Ultimate office automation: networked coffee. > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > > > > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > > > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > > > > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > > > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Justin Wheeler > > > > > > -- > > > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > > > > > rday > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Thu Jul 17 15:31:01 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] regrets In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I take that back about your brain Daniel. It should have read "never been used" ;-) Can you bring it to the next kwlug? On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 14:42:46 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: [kw-pm] regrets > > Due to bad planning on my part, it doesn't look like I'll make it to > Ethel's tonight. Lloyd, that means I won't be able to get you the LWP > book as promised. :-( > > -D > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From pm at datademons.com Thu Jul 17 15:34:34 2003 From: pm at datademons.com (Justin Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That's OK, Ethel's doesn't seem like a "curry" kinda place. :) Regards, Justin Wheeler -- Error: Keyboard not attached. Press F1 to continue. On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > Darn now we can't eat his curry :-( > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Justin Wheeler wrote: > > > Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 12:23:54 -0400 (EDT) > > From: Justin Wheeler > > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? > > > > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. > > > > Regards, > > Justin Wheeler > > > > -- > > Who's General Failure & why's he reading my disk? > > > > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > > > > > > > > given that my car is currently in the shop and *may* not > > > be ready by end of day, is anyone heading to the perl beerfest > > > this eve from north waterloo? i'm sure i can be persuaded to > > > buy someone a beer in exchange for a ride, if it turns out to > > > be necessary. (there's still a chance i'll get the car back in > > > time, but i'm just setting up a plan B). > > > > > > rday > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kw-pm mailing list > > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org > SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org > > From elbie at trig.net Thu Jul 17 17:05:02 2003 From: elbie at trig.net (Christopher Calzonetti) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] ride to /pub/ethels? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030717220502.GA84949@trig.net> I'm wearing a black shirt that says "I like monkeys" at the top of it. On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 12:23:54PM -0400, Justin Wheeler wrote: > Actually, I will be going today myself. (IVE REMEMBERED!) > > ... I know where Ethel's is. Who/what am I looking for? I haven't met a > single one of you. (At least anyone who regularily talks on the list.) > > I figure this would be a good first time to show up, since it's not as > formal as other gettogethers may or may not be. From da at coder.com Fri Jul 18 18:44:33 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] August: Cookout! Message-ID: As discussed previously on this list, we're trying the experiment of having social meetings in July and August, to try and combat summer-itis. Last evening's experience would suggest some success at this; we got 7 bodies at Ethel's. For August (Thursday the 21st), I offered up my place to have a BBQ. (It will be a real BBQ if anybody brings a grill. If not, we can pretend and use the indoor stove. Chris offered to bring a hibachi and ?Arguile? said he had something that was portable and grill-like. It turns out that I don't have one; I thought I did, but it's a camp-stove, which is really lame for a BBQ.) Whatever we want to call it, it's at my place. Bring spouse, date, or other friendly people. More directions forthcoming, say, a week before the event. -Daniel From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Sat Jul 19 08:21:10 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] August: Cookout! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sounds good, hopefully with all that fire around you won't be offering up your place as a "burnt offering" ;-) On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 19:44:33 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: [kw-pm] August: Cookout! > > As discussed previously on this list, we're trying the experiment of > having social meetings in July and August, to try and combat summer-itis. > > Last evening's experience would suggest some success at this; we got 7 > bodies at Ethel's. > > For August (Thursday the 21st), I offered up my place to have a BBQ. > (It will be a real BBQ if anybody brings a grill. If not, we can > pretend and use the indoor stove. Chris offered to bring a hibachi and > ?Arguile? said he had something that was portable and grill-like. It > turns out that I don't have one; I thought I did, but it's a camp-stove, > which is really lame for a BBQ.) > > Whatever we want to call it, it's at my place. Bring spouse, date, or > other friendly people. > > More directions forthcoming, say, a week before the event. > > -Daniel > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From da at coder.com Tue Jul 22 14:15:17 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] Toronto YAPC::NA 2004 bid Message-ID: Toronto is indeed putting in a bid for YAPC::NA 2004, at least if they (we?) can get a proposal together by August 1st. This would be great for us; all the YAPC fun with much less travel or border-crossings. I'm quite enthusiastic about it. I've volunteered to marshall up any people in the KW area who are willing to volunteer, be it to work on the application in the next two weeks, on prep tasks after the bid is in, or on-site during the conference. At this point, I need a show of hands if you're interested, so I can pass the info on to Toronto.pm. I remember from our last meeting that there were two or three people besides me who were interested in helping to some extent? There is no firm committment at this point; ultimately, the work will be as little or much as you like; minimum just a couple hours. In exchange for undying recognition, at least if you do something really useful. :-) If you're interested, but aren't on the to.pm.org mailing list (which doesn't have a web archive, unfortunately), you can get some information from their wiki website: (http://to.pm.org/cgi-bin/kwiki/index.cgi) -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com From shuchit at techie.com Tue Jul 22 16:45:14 2003 From: shuchit at techie.com (Shuchit Velkar) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] Toronto YAPC::NA 2004 bid Message-ID: <20030722214514.89523.qmail@mail.com> > From: "Daniel R. Allen" > At this point, I need a show of hands if you're interested, so I can pass > the info on to Toronto.pm. I remember from our last meeting that there > were two or three people besides me who were interested in helping to some > extent? > Count me in for helping out before and during the event. Not sure I will be able to help out much for putting in the bid, since I am travelling. Shuchit -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup CareerBuilder.com has over 400,000 jobs. Be smarter about your job search http://corp.mail.com/careers From arguile at lucentstudios.com Tue Jul 22 21:30:18 2003 From: arguile at lucentstudios.com (Arguile) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] Toronto YAPC::NA 2004 bid In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1058927244.523.16948.camel@broadswd> On Tue, 2003-07-22 at 15:15, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > I've volunteered to marshall up any people in the KW area who are willing > to volunteer, be it to work on the application in the next two weeks, on > prep tasks after the bid is in, or on-site during the conference. > > At this point, I need a show of hands if you're interested, so I can pass > the info on to Toronto.pm. I remember from our last meeting that there > were two or three people besides me who were interested in helping to some > extent? I don't know the extent I could be of assistance before the event, being contract my schedule can be erratic. If I had the time, I'd be up for pretty much anything that didn't involve phoning lots of people. As for during the event, I would clear that and be available for A/V, mundane setup, ushering, whatever. From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Wed Jul 23 04:22:39 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] Toronto YAPC::NA 2004 bid In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Do volunteers get t-shirts? ;-) Just kidding, I'll stick my hand up. On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 15:15:17 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: [kw-pm] Toronto YAPC::NA 2004 bid > > Toronto is indeed putting in a bid for YAPC::NA 2004, at least if they > (we?) can get a proposal together by August 1st. > > This would be great for us; all the YAPC fun with much less travel or > border-crossings. I'm quite enthusiastic about it. > > I've volunteered to marshall up any people in the KW area who are willing > to volunteer, be it to work on the application in the next two weeks, on > prep tasks after the bid is in, or on-site during the conference. > > At this point, I need a show of hands if you're interested, so I can pass > the info on to Toronto.pm. I remember from our last meeting that there > were two or three people besides me who were interested in helping to some > extent? > > There is no firm committment at this point; ultimately, the work will be > as little or much as you like; minimum just a couple hours. In exchange > for undying recognition, at least if you do something really useful. :-) > > If you're interested, but aren't on the to.pm.org mailing list (which > doesn't have a web archive, unfortunately), you can get some > information from their wiki website: > (http://to.pm.org/cgi-bin/kwiki/index.cgi) > > -Daniel > > http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From da at coder.com Fri Jul 25 16:08:21 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] Library Additions Message-ID: Our O'Reilly Library is growing by leaps and bounds. They have sent us three new books: Practical mod_perl Perl 6 Essentials Perl Objects, References, and Modules All of these are available to be checked out; drop me an email if you're interested. I would think that any of them would be good review material if anybody didn't mind writing a freebie review. Also, in light of local LUG member Charles McColm's recent Slashdot review of an O'Reilly Linux Security book (which was well-written and well-received), I think a bit of friendly "review competition" would be fine, if you wanted to up the ante and review these for somewhere more prominant than our mailing list. -Daniel http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Sat Jul 26 07:52:16 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly (fwd) Message-ID: See "good" reviews do pay ;-) dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2003 04:25:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert P. J. Day Reply-To: kwlug-disc@kwlug.org To: KWLUG discussion list Subject: [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly a short note i just got from the LUG book person at ORA: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2003 16:00:49 -0700 Hi Robert, Thanks for the great Slashdot review from your group. I am so happy Charles liked the book. I have a couple of other new books I am going to send you. --marsee ---------------------------------------- keep it up, we get more books. gotta like how that works. way to go, charles. rday ---- This Post sent to the kwlug-disc list by mailto:"Robert P. J. Day" To unsubscribe mailto:majordomo@kwlug.org with 'unsubscribe kwlug-disc' in the body (minus the ticks). Report problems mailto:owner-kwlug-disc@kwlug.org List: mailto:kwlug-disc@kwlug.org From da at coder.com Sat Jul 26 09:32:51 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly Message-ID: Well, that's one interpretation. Rest assured, though, unfavourable reviews don't seem to jynx the process, since she just sent us three free books. Thanks for finding that out for us, Lloyd. :-) I expect we might have a different result if we published an unfavourable review on slashdot. -D http://coder.com/ - Prescient Code Solutions - (519) 575-3733 da@coder.com On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > See "good" reviews do pay ;-) > > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org > SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2003 04:25:35 -0400 (EDT) > From: Robert P. J. Day > Reply-To: kwlug-disc@kwlug.org > To: KWLUG discussion list > Subject: [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly > > > a short note i just got from the LUG book person at ORA: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2003 16:00:49 -0700 > > Hi Robert, > > Thanks for the great Slashdot review from your group. I am so happy > Charles liked the book. I have a couple of other new books I am going to > send you. > > --marsee > > ---------------------------------------- > > keep it up, we get more books. gotta like how that works. > way to go, charles. > > rday > ---- > This Post sent to the kwlug-disc list by mailto:"Robert P. J. Day" > To unsubscribe mailto:majordomo@kwlug.org with 'unsubscribe kwlug-disc' in the body (minus the ticks). > Report problems mailto:owner-kwlug-disc@kwlug.org > List: mailto:kwlug-disc@kwlug.org > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > From sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca Sat Jul 26 12:24:30 2003 From: sfllaw at engmail.uwaterloo.ca (Simon Law) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030726172430.GL31246@law.yi.org> On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 10:32:51AM -0400, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Well, that's one interpretation. > > Rest assured, though, unfavourable reviews don't seem to jynx the process, > since she just sent us three free books. Thanks for finding that out for > us, Lloyd. :-) > > I expect we might have a different result if we published an unfavourable > review on slashdot. Yeah, but I'd rather have the reputation of being an honest reviewer, than one that could be bought by free (and potentially bad) books. I mean, if I were dishonestly saying bad books were good, would I still want to get complimentary bad books? That seems like an undesirable deal. Simon From rpjday at mindspring.com Sat Jul 26 14:23:08 2003 From: rpjday at mindspring.com (Robert P. J. Day) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly (fwd) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > See "good" reviews do pay ;-) oh, i don't know. charles' review was not gushy, falling over itself with praise. he criticized what needed to be criticized, which is what a good review should do. i'm curious what might have happened if he had absolutely *hammered* the book. after all, ORA does occasionally put out a real dog. from what i've heard, their book on linux clusters was so bad, it was dropped from print. and i've heard there's at least one perl book that's not worth the money, no? i think the only inviolable rule is to be honest. brutally so, if need be. rady From da at coder.com Sat Jul 26 17:52:30 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly Message-ID: On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 10:32:51AM -0400, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > > I expect we might have a different result if we published an unfavourable > > review on slashdot. > > Yeah, but I'd rather have the reputation of being an honest > reviewer, than one that could be bought by free (and potentially bad) > books. Absolutely. I didn't mean to give the impression that I was suggesting otherwise. One's reputation for integrity and honesty, and that of our group, is worth more than free books. My sentence above ought to have a slightly rueful smiley after it. When I wrote it, I meant to gently tease Lloyd, who was a good enough sport to write the negative review for the O'Reilly XML book which, frankly, deserved a negative review. As for Robert's question, "what if it was an absolute dog of a book", I would say there is nothing dishonourable about only publishing the review locally, and not on Slashdot. My comment was only about *where* the review was published, not at all about watering down the contents. If somebody in the group wanted to publish a really negative oreilly review on slashdot (for a book they got for review), I'd suggest we discuss it as a group and come to a general agreement. Sure, there might be a book so bad we need to warn the world. But this is a hypothetical case, and I don't think it's necessarily worth hashing over until that really awful book comes up! Cheers, -Daniel > Simon From dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org Sun Jul 27 07:21:34 2003 From: dcarr at sdf.lonestar.org (lloyd carr) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The "slightly rueful smiley", what exactly does that one look like Daniel? My vocabulary of emoticons is paltry, too say the least. -Lloyd On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2003 18:52:30 -0400 (EDT) > From: Daniel R. Allen > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly > > On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > > > On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 10:32:51AM -0400, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > > > I expect we might have a different result if we published an unfavourable > > > review on slashdot. > > > > Yeah, but I'd rather have the reputation of being an honest > > reviewer, than one that could be bought by free (and potentially bad) > > books. > > Absolutely. I didn't mean to give the impression that I was suggesting > otherwise. One's reputation for integrity and honesty, and that of our > group, is worth more than free books. > > My sentence above ought to have a slightly rueful smiley after it. When I > wrote it, I meant to gently tease Lloyd, who was a good enough sport to > write the negative review for the O'Reilly XML book which, frankly, > deserved a negative review. > > As for Robert's question, "what if it was an absolute dog of a book", I > would say there is nothing dishonourable about only publishing the review > locally, and not on Slashdot. My comment was only about *where* the > review was published, not at all about watering down the contents. > > If somebody in the group wanted to publish a really negative oreilly > review on slashdot (for a book they got for review), I'd suggest we > discuss it as a group and come to a general agreement. Sure, there might > be a book so bad we need to warn the world. But this is a hypothetical > case, and I don't think it's necessarily worth hashing over until that > really awful book comes up! > > Cheers, > -Daniel > > > Simon > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org From da at coder.com Sun Jul 27 12:22:16 2003 From: da at coder.com (Daniel R. Allen) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:31:32 2004 Subject: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ;-P On Sun, 27 Jul 2003, lloyd carr wrote: > The "slightly rueful smiley", what exactly does that one look like Daniel? > My vocabulary of emoticons is paltry, too say the least. > > -Lloyd > > On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > > > Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2003 18:52:30 -0400 (EDT) > > From: Daniel R. Allen > > To: kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > Subject: Re: [kw-pm] [kwlug disc.] from the LUG book contact at o'reilly > > > > On Sat, 26 Jul 2003, Simon Law wrote: > > > > > On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 10:32:51AM -0400, Daniel R. Allen wrote: > > > > I expect we might have a different result if we published an unfavourable > > > > review on slashdot. > > > > > > Yeah, but I'd rather have the reputation of being an honest > > > reviewer, than one that could be bought by free (and potentially bad) > > > books. > > > > Absolutely. I didn't mean to give the impression that I was suggesting > > otherwise. One's reputation for integrity and honesty, and that of our > > group, is worth more than free books. > > > > My sentence above ought to have a slightly rueful smiley after it. When I > > wrote it, I meant to gently tease Lloyd, who was a good enough sport to > > write the negative review for the O'Reilly XML book which, frankly, > > deserved a negative review. > > > > As for Robert's question, "what if it was an absolute dog of a book", I > > would say there is nothing dishonourable about only publishing the review > > locally, and not on Slashdot. My comment was only about *where* the > > review was published, not at all about watering down the contents. > > > > If somebody in the group wanted to publish a really negative oreilly > > review on slashdot (for a book they got for review), I'd suggest we > > discuss it as a group and come to a general agreement. Sure, there might > > be a book so bad we need to warn the world. But this is a hypothetical > > case, and I don't think it's necessarily worth hashing over until that > > really awful book comes up! > > > > Cheers, > > -Daniel > > > > > Simon > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kw-pm mailing list > > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm > > > > dcarr@sdf.lonestar.org > SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org > > _______________________________________________ > kw-pm mailing list > kw-pm@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kw-pm >