SPUG: Meetings at Amazon

Brian Ingerson ingy at ttul.org
Tue Sep 28 17:06:29 CDT 2004

Ken's proposal seems no different than using a personal cell phone
inside the Amazon building. In fact we could even get internet through a
cell phone if someone has that technology and is willing to oblige.

Cheers, Brian

On 24/09/04 16:37 -0700, Ken Meyer wrote:
> CJ --
> Thanks for the thoughtful reply.  A couple of points:
> 1) First, David answered a message that I addressed to you as if it had been
> personally addressed to him.  Now you are, in at least part of this mail,
> answering a message I addressed to Andy as if I had addressed you.  There's
> not a thing bad or impolite about anyone on this list contributing his or
> her opinion to any discussion, and your comments in this case specifically
> are very valuable.  However, in cases where someone may be pointing out some
> sort of alleged misstatement made in another post, please don't take it
> personally unless you are on the "To-list" -- everyone.
> 2) I think there's still some disconnect about my suggestion for the use of
> WiFi.  The whole idea was to have NO need whatsoever for a connection to ANY
> Amazon wire or wireless network.  The intent is to remain ENTIRELY
> INDEPENDENT of Amazon's resources while still providing a connection to the
> public Internet for the benefit of accessing presentations, downloading Perl
> files, whatever.
> Andy says that, even so, it might be frowned on by Amazon; though I really
> can't see why, I think that's fine and I had already suggested that someone
> should do the inquiry that you apparently have been doing.
> Of course this is all moot if the conference room is electromagnetically
> shielded, on purpose or for practical purposes, or if there is no active
> node that springs up, even with 12 dB of antenna gain, etc.  I would scan
> the entire horizon for AP's before giving up; an SWN node on South Cap Hill
> might well not be the only available resource.
> Keep up the good work.
> Ken Meyer
> -----Original Message-----
> From: CJ Collier [mailto:cjcollier at colliertech.org]
> Sent: Friday, September 24, 2004 1:28 PM
> To: kmeyer at blarg.net
> Cc: Andrew Sweger; carswell at gmail.com; spug-list at pm.org
> Subject: RE: SPUG: Meetings at Amazon
> Heya Ken,
> > [# My suggestion in my previous posting, and as shown excerpted below,
> > indicates that I did in fact suggest inquiry with management about the use
> > of WiFi, and that it might be prudent to have a direct employee of some
> > seniority do it (to minimize the potential for just being "blown-off").
> > Here it is:
> Thanks for the suggestion.  I think I'll be an okay contact for this.
> I've contacted one of our security engineers here, and I'll keep you
> posted on the results of my enquiry.  Doubtful we'll be "blown-off" as
> this move is pretty high profile.
> > [# "...so they were able to see outside without having access to the
> > school's internal network.  Perhaps you could investigate that
> possibility,
> > even via some person who is not a new employee such as you apparently
> are."
> The short and sweet is that Amazon does not provide this network
> functionality, and will not start providing it just because a group that
> happens to meet here would benefit.
> I will concede that it's not just an idea that we don't have time to
> implement correctly;  It's an interesting idea that we don't have time
> to implement correctly.
> > [# I know that the length of my messages may invite a cursory read, but
> > before you take specific exception to their content, you would be
> > well-advised to review them thoroughly.
> Rest assured I did.  I did not reply to the items which would take too
> much time to explain why they could not be addressed, nor the points
> that were off-topic.  And I will continue that trend.
> > [# Now, in addition, my "Whoa there..." comment was actually directed at
> CJ;
> > as a result of his observation:
> > [# I interpret this comment as suggesting a connection between SPUG's use
> of
> > WiFi and Amazon's intranet, i.e. that we would attach an AP to the Amazon
> > internal network.  If I misinterpreted this statement, then the point is
> > "inoperative" in a "no-fault mode".  David responded to me off-line,
> > apparently feeling that the remarks were directed at him and perceiving
> the
> > context incorrectly. OK, stuff happens.
> Whether you intend it to be or not, a wireless connection beamed in
> Amazon's window coupled with a connection to Amazon's network is a
> security concern.  I would prefer to minimize these, and thus recommend
> not going down this path.
> Note also that there are no active Seattle Wireless nodes on the south
> side of Capitol hill.  There is no line of site from our meeting room to
> anyone with an antenna capable of making the link.  Before this is even
> feasible, we would need to provide a link on the south side of Cap Hill.
> > [# Now, this grumpiness is unfortunate, given that I have simply been
> trying
> > to brainstorm a solution that would improve the quality of meetings
> > potentially held at Amazon.  In point of fact, I'm surprised that a
> computer
> > is apparently not permanently installed in every conference room there,
> and
> > which could be used under the proper conditions and restrictions.
> Thank you for your brainstorming; it is greatly appreciated.  After
> submitting an idea, please listen to comments by folks who would be able
> to implement such ideas.
> > [# I suggest that David and CJ spend their discretionary time inquiring
> > discretely about the possibilities, and if at all possible, do so without
> > generating an edict that would be difficult to overturn.  If problems are
> > encountered, I would be happy to try to engage Jeff himself, unabashedly
> > playing the "Hi, from a fellow Princeton alumnus" card, which is in fact
> the
> > case.
> > "]
> I have been inquiring about these subjects.  Discretely.  I have not
> been posting these discussions to the list.  I will keep you updated as
> I hear back from security.
> C.J.
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