From cameronc at mindspring.com Mon Apr 5 17:09:34 2004 From: cameronc at mindspring.com (Cameron Childress) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: SDCFUG Wed 7th - Code Copyright & Licensing Message-ID: ~sdpm~ Since this is a general interest topic I thought some of you might enjoy attending the meeting... --- Time/Date: Wednesday, April 7th from 6:30 - 8:00PM. Location: Booz Allen Hamilton's Offices (map @ sdcfug.org) Suite 220 1615 Murray Canyon Rd (NOTE: parking available on street) Topic: ?Don?t Touch My Code!? Copyright for Fun and Profit Speaker: Rey Muradaz, JD, Muradaz & Associates RSVP: rsvp@sdcfug.org More Info: http://www.sdcfug.org --- About the Topic: There's often a lot of confusion surrounding copyright: What it is (and what it's not), when it comes into play, and what it can and can't do for you. This brief overview will help you understand how you can use copyright to protect the code you release 'into the wild', and the strengths and limitations of several different licensing approaches. As an added bonus, you'll receive sample licensing language for each of these approaches that you can include either within your code or as a ride-along in your zip file distributions. This topic always inspires a lively debate, so bring your Kevlar suits! --- About the Speaker: Rey Muradaz (rey@muradaz.com) is still attempting to short-circuit the reincarnation process by living several lives in the same lifetime. He has been, at various times and in no particular order, a dishwasher, a writer, a Wall St. analyst, a roast-beef-sandwich-maker, a workers' comp rep, a telemarketer (I was desperate), a legal advocate for Alzheimer's victims and their families, CTO of both a non-profit (still eking along) and a for-profit (sadly defunct) targeted at supporting senior citizens, and a proud husband and father. He finally abandoned his efforts to whip a small cadre of City of Los Angeles contractors into the premier FB-coding team in the land (Fusebox Rules!). He's now trying to do the same thing with a group of Noo Yawkers from across the country (fuhgeddaboutit!). In his spare time (?), he keeps abreast of the ins and outs of intellectual property law, and crafts reasonably-priced, bullet-proof licenses and contracts for software developers. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= http://WebSanDiego.org: a list for San Diego web folk of all kinds Next Meetup this week! Thursday 8 April http://webdesign.meetup.com/members/402 Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/websandiego/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: websandiego-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From joel at fentin.com Mon Apr 5 21:56:20 2004 From: joel at fentin.com (Joel Fentin) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: [Fwd: RE: Job offered] Message-ID: <40721C54.7040401@fentin.com> ~sdpm~ These jobs are unfilled. Take a look at the job board on the website. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: RE: Job offered Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 15:45:23 -0700 From: eQuest Solutions/Al Karaptian 310.937.3388 To: 'Joel Fentin' Joel, These positions are actually still available. My client has several openings for each. I appreciate you contacting me. Please keep them open and update if necessary. Thank You, Al Karaptian eQuest Solutions 310.937.3388 al@eQuestSolutions.com -----Original Message----- From: Joel Fentin [mailto:joel@fentin.com] Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 8:57 PM To: al@equestsolutions.com Subject: Job offered You placed three jobs on the "job offered" section of the San Diego Perl Mongers website last December. If any position is unfilled, I will leave the posting. If the jobs are no longer available, I will remove them. Please get back to me about this. -- Joel Fentin tel: 760-749-8863 FAX: 760-749-8864 email: joel@fentin.com Biz: http://fentin.com Personal: http://fentin.com/me/ -- Joel Fentin tel: 760-749-8863 FAX: 760-749-8864 email: joel@fentin.com Biz: http://fentin.com Personal: http://fentin.com/me/ ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From joe at artlung.com Mon Apr 12 18:05:00 2004 From: joe at artlung.com (Joe Crawford) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: LAMP Host Provides Mirrors of Apache, MySQL, PHP, CPAN Libraries Message-ID: ~sdpm~ Greetings WebSanDiegans (and others!): LAMP Host, provider of great developer-friendly web hosting, has set up mirrors of several prominent pieces of open source software. As our business relies on open source, we believe strongly in supporting developers, and these mirrors are a great way to support the developer community here in San Diego and the larger Southern California area. Apache Source downloads for httpd and other Apache software projects, and the Apache 2.0 manual. Entry Point: http://apache.lamphost.net/ Source Code: http://apache.lamphost.net/dist/ 2.0 Manual: http://apache.lamphost.net/manual/ MySQL Full site and source: http://mysql.lamphost.net/ PHP Full site and source: http://php.lamphost.net/ CPAN Libraries (Comprehensive Perl Archive Network) Full site and source: http://cpan.lamphost.net/ If anyone has any questions, feel free to contact me with the contact info below. Joe -- Joe Crawford LAMP Host joecrawford@lamphost.net http://www.lamphost.net/ phone: 619-516-4550 fax: 928-752-6311 address: P.O. Box 4661 San Diego California 92164-4661 ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From rkleeman at energoncube.net Mon Apr 19 12:50:06 2004 From: rkleeman at energoncube.net (Bob Kleemann) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: Meeting tommorow! Message-ID: <20040419175006.GA2037@energoncube.net> ~sdpm~ Hey folks, Just a reminder that there is a meeting tommorow evening. Same time and same place as always, Callahan's in Mira Mesa at 7PM. Let me know as soon as you can so I can make properly sized reservations. Also let me know if you need directions or other assistance getting there. Also, I just noticed that Larry Wall has put up Apocalypse 12 on Perl.com. If you're interested in the direction that Perl is heading, then you may want to check it out. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From Dirk at finches.com Mon Apr 19 11:47:58 2004 From: Dirk at finches.com (Dirk2) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: SQL-Ledger Message-ID: <1082393278.4366.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> ~sdpm~ PERL Mongers, Does anyone have an opinion on SQL-Ledger? -Dirk ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From rkleeman at energoncube.net Mon Apr 19 19:06:07 2004 From: rkleeman at energoncube.net (Bob Kleemann) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: SQL-Ledger In-Reply-To: <1082393278.4366.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1082393278.4366.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20040420000607.GH2037@energoncube.net> ~sdpm~ Perl Mongers, I think he is referring to this: http://www.sql-ledger.org/ I've not heard about it before myself... On Mon, Apr 19, 2004 at 04:47:58PM +0000, Dirk2 wrote: > ~sdpm~ > PERL Mongers, > > Does anyone have an opinion on SQL-Ledger? > > -Dirk > > > ~sdpm~ > > The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org > > List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org > > If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, > you can send mail to with the following > command in the body of your email message: > > unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list > > If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, > (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the > list itself) send email to . > This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need > to contact a human. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From rkleeman at energoncube.net Mon Apr 19 19:41:30 2004 From: rkleeman at energoncube.net (Bob Kleemann) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: LISA '04: 18th Large Installation System Administration Conference (fwd) Message-ID: <20040420004130.GI2037@energoncube.net> ~sdpm~ In case anyone is interested... ----- Forwarded message from Alex Walker ----- From: Alex Walker Subject: LISA '04: 18th Large Installation System Administration Conference To: undisclosed-recipients: ; X-Spam-Bayes-Status: Learned as HAM -------------------------------------------------------------------- LISA '04: 18th Large Installation System Administration Conference "System Administration Reality--Automation, Configuration, and Users" November 14-19, 2004, Atlanta, Georgia, USA http://www.usenix.org/lisa04/cfpb -------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear Colleague I am writing on behalf of the program committee to remind you that the LISA '04 Call for Participation deadline is quickly approaching. Please submit your ideas by April 20, 2004. We invite you to contribute papers and proposals for the technical session's refereed papers track, invited talks, panels, Guru Is In sessions, and Work-in-Progress reports. The Call for Participation with submission guidelines and sample topics can be found on the USENIX Web site at http://www.usenix.org/lisa04/cfpb The annual LISA conference is the meeting place of choice for system, network, security, and other computing administrators. Administrators of all specialties and levels of expertise meet at LISA to exchange ideas, sharpen skills, learn new techniques, debate current issues, and meet colleagues and friends. People representing every work assignment from the full-time position at a large site to the part-time one at a small shop come to LISA from over 30 countries, bringing divergent backgrounds and experience levels to the conference dedicated to them. System and network administrators from environments as diverse as academia, large corporations and small businesses, government organizations, and research sites find LISA to be The Place to go for training, education, networking, and interacting with their peers. The conference's diverse group of participants is matched by an equally broad spectrum of activities: * Training sessions for both beginners and experienced attendees cover many administrative topics ranging from basic administrative procedures to using cutting-edge technologies. * Technical sessions present the latest developments and ideas related to system and network administration. * Invited talks and panels discuss important and timely topics and often spark lively debates and conversation. * Work-in-progress reports (WiPs) provide brief peeks at next year's innovations. GET INVOLVED! * Submit an extended abstract for a refereed paper. * Suggest an invited talk speaker or a panel discussion topic. * Share your experience by leading a Guru Is In session. * Propose a tutorial topic. * Organize or suggest a Birds-of-a-Feather (BoF) session. * Email an idea to the chair. ------------------------------------------------------------ IMPORTANT DATES Submissions due: April 20, 2004 Notification to authors: May 2004 Final papers due: September 7, 2004 Submission guidelines and more information can be found at http://www.usenix.org/lisa04/cfpb ------------------------------------------------------------- We look forward to hearing from you! On behalf of the LISA '04 Program Committee, Lee Damon, University of Washington lisa04chair@usenix.org ----- End forwarded message ----- ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From tkil-sdpm at scrye.com Wed Apr 21 01:58:11 2004 From: tkil-sdpm at scrye.com (Tkil) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: links from tonight (gps, etc) Message-ID: <16518.7043.686271.38801@brand.scrye.com> ~sdpm~ Here's the "maps created by people wandering around with GPS": http://www.waag.org/realtime/ I don't remember what the other link was, that I was supposed to supply later. Sorry about that. And the actual command line I used to remove a particular element from a (rigorously-formatted) XML document was really: perl -lnwe 'print unless m!!' Abusing the range operator for fun and profit! t. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From tkil-sdpm at scrye.com Fri Apr 23 16:15:46 2004 From: tkil-sdpm at scrye.com (Tkil) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: qr//e? Message-ID: <16521.34690.732980.722994@brand.scrye.com> ~sdpm~ Fellow mongers: Can anyone think why /e might be a bad idea to suggest for addition to the qr// operator? I found myself doing something like this, the other day: my @days = qw( Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat ); my $days_re = qr/join '|', @days/e; And I was startled to discover that qr doesn't have a /e flag. Granted, it has only ever been in the substitution part of s///, but this seems pretty straightforward. There are obvious workarounds: my $days_re = do { my $tmp = join '|', @days; qr/$tmp/ }; Or, in this particular case, something almost as ugly: my $days_re = do { local $" = '|'; qr/@days/ }; Still, it seems that /e might be entirely useful on qr//. Anyone have examples or counter-examples that come to mind? t. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From chris_radcliff at mac.com Fri Apr 23 16:54:20 2004 From: chris_radcliff at mac.com (Chris Radcliff) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: qr//e? In-Reply-To: <16521.34690.732980.722994@brand.scrye.com> References: <16521.34690.732980.722994@brand.scrye.com> Message-ID: ~sdpm~ I couldn't articulate why it's a Good Idea, but /e only applies to the right side of a substitution. In your case, are you hoping to re-evaluate the join() each time you use the compiled expression (e.g. if @days were to change for some reason)? If so, it's not likely to work the way you think it will, at least in the first of the two "ugly" cases. (Not sure about the second case. Will qr// create a closure with the local $"?) If not, why not just do this: my $days = join '|', @days; my $days_re = qr/$days/; ...which seems to do the same as your do block. Remember that qr *will* evaluate variables unless you're using /Q$things/E, so you don't need any modifiers to get this behavior. Cheers, ~chris (off the top of me 'ead) On Apr 23, 2004, at 2:15 PM, Tkil wrote: > ~sdpm~ > > Fellow mongers: > > Can anyone think why /e might be a bad idea to suggest for addition to > the qr// operator? > > I found myself doing something like this, the other day: > > my @days = qw( Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat ); > my $days_re = qr/join '|', @days/e; > > And I was startled to discover that qr doesn't have a /e flag. > Granted, it has only ever been in the substitution part of s///, but > this seems pretty straightforward. There are obvious workarounds: > > my $days_re = do { my $tmp = join '|', @days; qr/$tmp/ }; > > Or, in this particular case, something almost as ugly: > > my $days_re = do { local $" = '|'; qr/@days/ }; > > Still, it seems that /e might be entirely useful on qr//. Anyone have > examples or counter-examples that come to mind? > > t. > ~sdpm~ ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From tkil-sdpm at scrye.com Fri Apr 23 17:06:31 2004 From: tkil-sdpm at scrye.com (Tkil) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: qr//e? In-Reply-To: References: <16521.34690.732980.722994@brand.scrye.com> Message-ID: <16521.37735.418870.305657@brand.scrye.com> ~sdpm~ >>>>> "Chris" == Chris Radcliff writes: Chris> I couldn't articulate why it's a Good Idea, but /e only applies Chris> to the right side of a substitution. Right; I'm proposing a change to the language. Chris> In your case, are you hoping to re-evaluate the join() each Chris> time you use the compiled expression (e.g. if @days were to Chris> change for some reason)? No. I want the /e to take place exactly once: eval the contents of the qr//, then apply qr to that result (returning the compiled regex object.) Maybe some bastard hybrid of "/oe" is really what I'm looking for... I really intend for these two statements to have the same result: my $re = qr/EXPR/e; my $re = do { my $tmp = eval { EXPR } ; qr/$tmp/ }; Chris> If not, why not just do this: Chris> my $days = join '|', @days; Chris> my $days_re = qr/$days/; Because this leaves $days in scope for no good reason (that's why I used the "do" block in the first place). The "do BLOCK" approach has exactly the semantics I want; I just wanted it to be shorter and sweeter. I suppose I should have simply asked if people thought that /e was a worthwhile shorthand, or if (as your response seems to indicate) it would confuse people into think it applied every time the qr object was used. Chris> Cheers, Chris> ~chris (off the top of me 'ead) Thanks for the feedback, anyway! :) t. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. From tkil-sdpm at scrye.com Mon Apr 26 13:52:48 2004 From: tkil-sdpm at scrye.com (Tkil) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:20:55 2004 Subject: qr//e? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <16525.23168.380382.596296@brand.scrye.com> ~sdpm~ All in a quest for for a shorter way to say: my $re = do { my $tmp = EXPR; qr/$tmp/ }; >>>>> "Alan" == Alan Stewart writes: Alan> how about: Alan> my $re = qr/@{[join '|', @days]}/; Alan> from the Perl Cookbook on how to interpolate code, do anything Alan> you want inside the @{[ ]} Heh. I was looking for syntactic sugar, not syntactic sliced onions. :) I started a thread on perlmonks regarding this question, and there has been some good discussion. (And yes, the interpolate trick was mentioned -- the only thing I'd add is a "scalar" call, as that's the context I'd most likely want the expression in, not a list to get squished with $".) If anyone is curious: http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=347761 Thanks for the feedback here, too. I've basically decided that /e is a bit too cute. What I really want is the ability to apply qr// to any expression, not just a double- quoted (or regex-double-quoted) expression. In the same way that the functionality of \Q and \E is available outside double-quotes as quotemeta, I would like qr to be available without double-quoting. On the other paw, there are a fleet of workarounds, so it's not a big deal. t. ~sdpm~ The posting address is: san-diego-pm-list@hfb.pm.org List requests should be sent to: majordomo@hfb.pm.org If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe san-diego-pm-list If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human.