From enobacon at gmail.com  Thu Jun  4 23:35:38 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Seven till Seven)
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 23:35:38 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Ingy on TestML - June meeting next Wed.
Message-ID: <200906042335.39050.enobacon@gmail.com>


  Wed. May 10th, 6:53pm at FreeGeek -- 1731 SE 10th Ave.

Topic:   TestML - generic testing meta language
Speaker: Ingy d?t Net 

See http://pdx.pm.org/kwiki/index.cgi?June2009Meeting for details. 

Plus: Rakudo shootout challenge ? benchmarking Perl 6.

As always, the meeting will be followed by social hour at the LuckyLab. 
-- 

        http://pdx.pm.org

From enobacon at gmail.com  Fri Jun  5 11:40:36 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 11:40:36 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Open Source Bridge - table space?
Message-ID: <200906051140.37007.enobacon@gmail.com>

Hi all,

Is anyone interested in having (creating, maintaining, etc) a pdx.pm 
exhibit table at Open Source Bridge Conference?

--Eric
-- 
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
--George Bernard Shaw
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From jaleto at gmail.com  Fri Jun  5 11:49:29 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 11:49:29 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Open Source Bridge - table space?
In-Reply-To: <200906051140.37007.enobacon@gmail.com>
References: <200906051140.37007.enobacon@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906051149w17ec215fg2e42dbe088dd5a2c@mail.gmail.com>

That sounds pretty cool. What exactly would be going on at said booth?



On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Eric Wilhelm<enobacon at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Is anyone interested in having (creating, maintaining, etc) a pdx.pm
> exhibit table at Open Source Bridge Conference?
>
> --Eric
> --
> The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man
> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress
> depends on the unreasonable man.
> --George Bernard Shaw
> ---------------------------------------------------
> ? ?http://scratchcomputing.com
> ---------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From enobacon at gmail.com  Fri Jun  5 11:54:20 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 11:54:20 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Rakudo shootout challenge
Message-ID: <200906051154.20189.enobacon@gmail.com>

Hi all,

I would like to propose a challenge:

  Before next Wednesday's meeting:
   1. Choose a program from the Computer Language Benchmarks Game.
   2. Download the Perl 5 implementation.
   3. Write a Perl 6 version.
      (3.5. Build a recent Rakudo.)
   4. Run them and present your findings.

Optionally, first rewrite the Perl 5 version to be faster or more 
idiomatic.  Do it "more than one way" in Perl 5 and/or 6 for extra 
bonus points.

We'll spend 15-20 minutes at the beginning of the meeting reviewing the 
various entries.  It might help if you mail your entries to the list 
before the meeting starts.

  http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/

Background:
  http://use.perl.org/~korpenkraxar/journal/39051

Ready... Go!

--Eric
-- 
"Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse."
--Murphy's Corollary
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From ben.hengst at gmail.com  Fri Jun  5 12:03:03 2009
From: ben.hengst at gmail.com (benh)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 12:03:03 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Open Source Bridge - table space?
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906051149w17ec215fg2e42dbe088dd5a2c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200906051140.37007.enobacon@gmail.com>
	<9aaadf9c0906051149w17ec215fg2e42dbe088dd5a2c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <85ddf48b0906051203y429333cdtdba6018251046c5f@mail.gmail.com>

Other then "perl != dead", the times that I've done the OSCON booth
it's mostly been folks wanting to talk about how they used to use perl
but now there job has them using something else.

On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Jonathan Leto<jaleto at gmail.com> wrote:
> That sounds pretty cool. What exactly would be going on at said booth?
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Eric Wilhelm<enobacon at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Is anyone interested in having (creating, maintaining, etc) a pdx.pm
>> exhibit table at Open Source Bridge Conference?
>>
>> --Eric
>> --
>> The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man
>> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress
>> depends on the unreasonable man.
>> --George Bernard Shaw
>> ---------------------------------------------------
>> ? ?http://scratchcomputing.com
>> ---------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
>> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Jonathan Leto
> jonathan at leto.net
> http://leto.net
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 
benh~

http://three.sentenc.es/

From enobacon at gmail.com  Fri Jun  5 12:07:01 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 12:07:01 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Open Source Bridge - table space?
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906051149w17ec215fg2e42dbe088dd5a2c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200906051140.37007.enobacon@gmail.com>
	<9aaadf9c0906051149w17ec215fg2e42dbe088dd5a2c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200906051207.01562.enobacon@gmail.com>

# from Jonathan Leto
# on Friday 05 June 2009 11:49:

>That sounds pretty cool. What exactly would be going on at said booth?

Here's everything I know about it:
  "We have a limited number of exhibit tables available for 
  user groups and open source projects to show off their work. 

  Any sponsor or registered attendee can request one to use. 
  To do this, email sponsorship at opensourcebridge.org with the
  subject "Table Space", and information on how much space you 
  need. The tables are 8' long, so you can share with another 
  group if you'd like.
  "

--Eric
-- 
The only thing that could save UNIX at this late date would be a new $30
shareware version that runs on an unexpanded Commodore 64.
--Don Lancaster (1991)
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From kevin at scaldeferri.com  Fri Jun  5 18:10:02 2009
From: kevin at scaldeferri.com (Kevin Scaldeferri)
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 18:10:02 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Rakudo shootout challenge
In-Reply-To: <200906051154.20189.enobacon@gmail.com>
References: <200906051154.20189.enobacon@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9004ECF1-EA96-4D85-860C-2FACF99CFA8A@scaldeferri.com>


On Jun 5, 2009, at 11:54 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote:

> Optionally, first rewrite the Perl 5 version to be faster or more
> idiomatic.


Note that a lot of the Perl entries could probably benefit from being  
parallelized.  That's really the game currently.  The languages that  
can effectively parallelize have recently moved up in the standings by  
a factor of 2-4.  Those that cannot, or have not, are being left behind.


-kevin

From enobacon at gmail.com  Wed Jun 10 00:04:02 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Seven till Seven)
Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 00:04:02 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Ingy on TestML - June meeting tonight
Message-ID: <200906100004.02766.enobacon@gmail.com>


  Wed. May 10th, 6:53pm at FreeGeek -- 1731 SE 10th Ave.

Topic:   TestML - generic testing meta language
Speaker: Ingy d?t Net 

See http://pdx.pm.org/kwiki/index.cgi?June2009Meeting for details. 


Plus: Rakudo shootout challenge ? benchmarking Perl 6.

   1. Choose a program from the Computer Language Benchmarks Game.
   2. Download the Perl 5 implementation.
   3. Write a Perl 6 version.
      (3.5. Build a recent Rakudo.)
   4. Run them and present your findings.

Optionally, first rewrite the Perl 5 version to be faster or more 
idiomatic.  Do it "more than one way" in Perl 5 and/or 6 for extra 
bonus points.

We'll spend 15-20 minutes at the beginning of the meeting reviewing the 
various entries.  Mail your entries to the list before the meeting!

  http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/


As always, the meeting will be followed by social hour at the LuckyLab. 
-- 

        http://pdx.pm.org

From enobacon at gmail.com  Wed Jun 10 11:13:45 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:13:45 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] projector for tonight's meeting?
Message-ID: <200906101113.45361.enobacon@gmail.com>

Hi all,

Tom won't be able to attend tonight, but was planning to bring the 
projector.

Can anyone provide a projector (or go to freegeek this afternoon and 
ensure that a working one would be available?)

Alternatively, Tom has offered to drop off his projector if he could 
pick it up late tonight or early tomorrow in SW.

Thanks,
Eric
-- 
"...the bourgeoisie were hated from both ends: by the proles, because
they had all the money, and by the intelligentsia, because of their
tendency to spend it on lawn ornaments."
--Neal Stephenson
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From ingy at ingy.net  Wed Jun 10 11:17:35 2009
From: ingy at ingy.net (Ingy dot Net)
Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:17:35 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] projector for tonight's meeting?
In-Reply-To: <200906101113.45361.enobacon@gmail.com>
References: <200906101113.45361.enobacon@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9eb4914f0906101117i5bb8521fqd97c2997a9f966d5@mail.gmail.com>

I'm bringing one

On Jun 10, 2009 11:14 AM, "Eric Wilhelm" <enobacon at gmail.com> wrote:

Hi all,

Tom won't be able to attend tonight, but was planning to bring the
projector.

Can anyone provide a projector (or go to freegeek this afternoon and
ensure that a working one would be available?)

Alternatively, Tom has offered to drop off his projector if he could
pick it up late tonight or early tomorrow in SW.

Thanks,
Eric
--
"...the bourgeoisie were hated from both ends: by the proles, because
they had all the money, and by the intelligentsia, because of their
tendency to spend it on lawn ornaments."
--Neal Stephenson
---------------------------------------------------
   http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Pdx-pm-list mailing list
Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090610/19899992/attachment.html>

From enobacon at gmail.com  Thu Jun 11 10:11:21 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 10:11:21 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Rakudo Shootout Fail
Message-ID: <200906111011.21950.enobacon@gmail.com>

Hi all,

It seems that everyone who looked at a shootout problem concluded that 
the problem statement was too opaque for them to implement in a 
reasonable amount of time.  While shootout problems are still valuable 
to implement in Perl 6, it would be easier and just as useful to 
implement some of the Project Euler problems in both Perl 5 and 6.

  http://projecteuler.net/

Ultimately, we just want to be able to compare rakudo to perl.  So, 
anything worth graphing is going to be useful.  Maybe we need a git 
repository for this?

--Eric
-- 
perl -e 'srand; print join(" ",sort({rand() < 0.5}
  qw(sometimes it is important to be consistent)));'
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From kevin at scaldeferri.com  Thu Jun 11 11:03:36 2009
From: kevin at scaldeferri.com (Kevin Scaldeferri)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:03:36 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Rakudo Shootout Fail
In-Reply-To: <200906111011.21950.enobacon@gmail.com>
References: <200906111011.21950.enobacon@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E382A621-D049-473E-8AA4-BF421F6198EE@scaldeferri.com>

In general, the usual approach to writing a shootout entry is simply  
to port an existing entry to the new language.  To a large extent,  
that's all the rules allow, as entries are supposed to do the task "in  
the same way".  You're generally not allowed to develop a new  
algorithm or anything like that.  So, I'd suggest that people treat it  
like any other Perl 5 -> Perl 6 porting task.  Once initial Perl 6  
entries exist, then work on optimizing or making them more Perl6-ish.


-kevin


On Jun 11, 2009, at 10:11 AM, Eric Wilhelm wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> It seems that everyone who looked at a shootout problem concluded that
> the problem statement was too opaque for them to implement in a
> reasonable amount of time.  While shootout problems are still valuable
> to implement in Perl 6, it would be easier and just as useful to
> implement some of the Project Euler problems in both Perl 5 and 6.
>
>  http://projecteuler.net/
>
> Ultimately, we just want to be able to compare rakudo to perl.  So,
> anything worth graphing is going to be useful.  Maybe we need a git
> repository for this?
>
> --Eric
> -- 
> perl -e 'srand; print join(" ",sort({rand() < 0.5}
>  qw(sometimes it is important to be consistent)));'
> ---------------------------------------------------
>    http://scratchcomputing.com
> ---------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list


From ingy at ingy.net  Thu Jun 11 14:36:23 2009
From: ingy at ingy.net (Ingy dot Net)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:36:23 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
Message-ID: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I've been using Google Groups for the TestML mailing list, but now I'm
realizing that Google Groups is not good for public mailing lists. I want to
change over to something else. Here are my constraints:

* I don't want to host my own mail server
* I want to use my testml.org domain - like discuss at lists.testml.org
* I want it to be free (as in beer)

Does anyone know of a decent public mailing list service that I can use?

Cheers, Ingy
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/849ed50c/attachment.html>

From sechrest at peak.org  Thu Jun 11 14:43:56 2009
From: sechrest at peak.org (John Sechrest)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:43:56 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>

What are thing things that are not working for you with google groups?

What are the features that you need?

How much setup work are you willing to do?




2009/6/11 Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net>

> Hi all,
>
> I've been using Google Groups for the TestML mailing list, but now I'm
> realizing that Google Groups is not good for public mailing lists. I want to
> change over to something else. Here are my constraints:
>
> * I don't want to host my own mail server
> * I want to use my testml.org domain - like discuss at lists.testml.org
> * I want it to be free (as in beer)
>
> Does anyone know of a decent public mailing list service that I can use?
>
> Cheers, Ingy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 
John Sechrest          .
Corvallis Benton        .
   Chamber Coalition      .
      420 NW 2nd                   .
             (541) 757-1507              . sechrest at corvallisedp.com
                                                                     .


       .
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/00ba4d91/attachment.html>

From ingy at ingy.net  Thu Jun 11 14:52:54 2009
From: ingy at ingy.net (Ingy dot Net)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:52:54 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:43 PM, John Sechrest <sechrest at peak.org> wrote:

> What are thing things that are not working for you with google groups?
>

I'm currently letting google apps handle the mail for testml.org and have a
group set up called discuss at testml.org.

I can't figure out how if/where the public signup page for the group/list
is.


>  What are the features that you need?
>
>

I just want a url where people can go and subscribe/unsubscribe. Something
like MailMan.


> How much setup work are you willing to do?
>

As long as I'm not hosting a mail server, I don't really care. Mail servers
are hateful suckers of one's soul.

Ingy


>
>
>
>
> 2009/6/11 Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I've been using Google Groups for the TestML mailing list, but now I'm
>> realizing that Google Groups is not good for public mailing lists. I want to
>> change over to something else. Here are my constraints:
>>
>> * I don't want to host my own mail server
>> * I want to use my testml.org domain - like discuss at lists.testml.org
>> * I want it to be free (as in beer)
>>
>> Does anyone know of a decent public mailing list service that I can use?
>>
>> Cheers, Ingy
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
>> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>>
>
>
>
> --
> John Sechrest          .
> Corvallis Benton        .
>    Chamber Coalition      .
>       420 NW 2nd                   .
>              (541) 757-1507              . sechrest at corvallisedp.com
>                                                                      .
>
>
>        .
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/6a491858/attachment.html>

From sechrest at peak.org  Thu Jun 11 14:56:33 2009
From: sechrest at peak.org (John Sechrest)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:56:33 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
	<9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <313372bc0906111456x4cf535ffsbfaac97998df2b85@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net> wrote:

>
>
>  On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:43 PM, John Sechrest <sechrest at peak.org> wrote:
>
>> What are thing things that are not working for you with google groups?
>>
>
> I'm currently letting google apps handle the mail for testml.org and have
> a group set up called discuss at testml.org.
>
> I can't figure out how if/where the public signup page for the group/list
> is.
>

http://googlegroups.com/group/listname

Is that what you mean?



>
>
>
>>  What are the features that you need?
>>
>>
>
> I just want a url where people can go and subscribe/unsubscribe. Something
> like MailMan.
>

google groups does this. But so does mail man and several other list
managers.



>
>
>
>>  How much setup work are you willing to do?
>>
>
> As long as I'm not hosting a mail server, I don't really care. Mail servers
> are hateful suckers of one's soul.
>
>

Yes, they are. Full time work and then some if you want to do it right.


I am still not understanding what you can't get out of google groups...


-- 
John Sechrest          .
Corvallis Benton        .
   Chamber Coalition      .
      420 NW 2nd                   .
             (541) 757-1507              . sechrest at corvallisedp.com
                                                                     .


       .
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/8013633a/attachment.html>

From bruce at drangle.com  Thu Jun 11 15:30:23 2009
From: bruce at drangle.com (Bruce Keeler)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:30:23 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>	<313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
	<9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A31857F.50607@drangle.com>

On 6/11/2009 2:52 PM, Ingy dot Net wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:43 PM, John Sechrest <sechrest at peak.org 
> <mailto:sechrest at peak.org>> wrote:
>
>     What are thing things that are not working for you with google groups?
>
>
> I'm currently letting google apps handle the mail for testml.org 
> <http://testml.org> and have a group set up called discuss at testml.org 
> <mailto:discuss at testml.org>.
>
> I can't figure out how if/where the public signup page for the 
> group/list is.
>
>      What are the features that you need?
>
>
> I just want a url where people can go and subscribe/unsubscribe. 
> Something like MailMan.
>
>     How much setup work are you willing to do?
>
>
> As long as I'm not hosting a mail server, I don't really care. Mail 
> servers are hateful suckers of one's soul.
>
> Ingy
I can probably help out there if you like.  I do a similar thing with a 
mailing list I control.  drangle.com is hosted at google apps, but I 
forward the list alias to a mailman instance on a server of mine to do 
the list exploding.

Bruce
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/5b74d2cd/attachment-0001.html>

From list at phaedrusdeinus.org  Thu Jun 11 15:37:49 2009
From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:37:49 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <313372bc0906111456x4cf535ffsbfaac97998df2b85@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
	<9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111456x4cf535ffsbfaac97998df2b85@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <03A595CF-C5F8-4FA2-8765-F81C30955405@phaedrusdeinus.org>

On Jun 11, 2009, at 2:56 PM, John Sechrest wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net> wrote:
> I can't figure out how if/where the public signup page for the group/ 
> list is.
>
> http://googlegroups.com/group/listname
>
> Is that what you mean?

That's "public" insofar as people can see it, but not insofar as non- 
google-account-having people can sign up (except by signing up for a  
google account).

As background, it's worth noting that google does allow non-google- 
account subscribers to mailing lists. The interface for it is, as far  
as i can tell, email-only (mailing listname- 
subscribe at googlegroups.com). It's also buggy (i recently re-subscribed  
to a single group, and was incorrectly resubscribed to all groups i  
had ever been subscribed to), and incomplete (email only means no  
access to google's "flag spam" tools, etc., nor, obviously, any group  
assets aside from the mailing list).

In short, google groups may well be great for google account holders,  
but non-holders are second-class citizens.


-johnnnnnn

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/d516c0c9/attachment.html>

From jaleto at gmail.com  Thu Jun 11 16:26:48 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:26:48 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906111626m3ce4bdb5o5d3a87ecc14b5907@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

The OSU Open Source Lab [1] gives free hosting to Open Source
projects, you might want to look into that.

Cheers,



[1] http://osuosl.org/services/hosting


2009/6/11 Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net>:
> Hi all,
>
> I've been using Google Groups for the TestML mailing list, but now I'm
> realizing that Google Groups is not good for public mailing lists. I want to
> change over to something else. Here are my constraints:
>
> * I don't want to host my own mail server
> * I want to use my testml.org domain - like discuss at lists.testml.org
> * I want it to be free (as in beer)
>
> Does anyone know of a decent public mailing list service that I can use?
>
> Cheers, Ingy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From sechrest at peak.org  Thu Jun 11 17:59:46 2009
From: sechrest at peak.org (John Sechrest)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:59:46 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Need to Change Mailing Lists
In-Reply-To: <03A595CF-C5F8-4FA2-8765-F81C30955405@phaedrusdeinus.org>
References: <9eb4914f0906111436m21762cb2nb75ec70d6834ba91@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111443s8deffb5oe529ff486544795c@mail.gmail.com>
	<9eb4914f0906111452r20da695tb9d60bb04bcd24a4@mail.gmail.com>
	<313372bc0906111456x4cf535ffsbfaac97998df2b85@mail.gmail.com>
	<03A595CF-C5F8-4FA2-8765-F81C30955405@phaedrusdeinus.org>
Message-ID: <313372bc0906111759qc1a87e2g43187d6b1e323b5c@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 3:37 PM, John Melesky <list at phaedrusdeinus.org>wrote:

> On Jun 11, 2009, at 2:56 PM, John Sechrest wrote:
>
> On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Ingy dot Net <ingy at ingy.net> wrote:
>
>> I can't figure out how if/where the public signup page for the group/list
>> is.
>>
>
> http://googlegroups.com/group/listname
>
> Is that what you mean?
>
>
> That's "public" insofar as people can see it, but not insofar as
> non-google-account-having people can sign up (except by signing up for a
> google account).
>

Google requires a mapping of email + password, but this is not a  gmail
account.

You have to get a password  + email  mapping for mailman too, it just looks
different.

So I am not sure on the difference here.



> As background, it's worth noting that google does allow non-google-account
> subscribers to mailing lists. The interface for it is, as far as i can tell,
> email-only (mailing listname-subscribe at googlegroups.com). It's also buggy
> (i recently re-subscribed to a single group, and was incorrectly
> resubscribed to all groups i had ever been subscribed to), and incomplete
> (email only means no access to google's "flag spam" tools, etc., nor,
> obviously, any group assets aside from the mailing list).
>
> In short, google groups may well be great for google account holders, but
> non-holders are second-class citizens.
>

I have not seen the bugs you talk about.





-- 
John Sechrest          .
Corvallis Benton        .
   Chamber Coalition      .
      420 NW 2nd                   .
             (541) 757-1507              . sechrest at corvallisedp.com
                                                                     .


       .
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/ccc3e070/attachment.html>

From l_iesa at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 11 16:34:06 2009
From: l_iesa at yahoo.com (Lisa Kachold)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:34:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Phoenix LUG HackFest: New Location at the Foundation for
	Blind Children - 2nd Saturday Noon Every Month
Message-ID: <20579.52413.qm@web112403.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

PLUG Hackfests are 3 hour linux security labs from Noon to 15:00 on

the second Saturday of every month. ?[Come prepared to learn about a

security tool and then start using it.]

Ethical, legal, social and historic aspects of computer security and

linux testing are covered as we safely investigate the strange world

of computer insecurity from our powerful Penguin perspectives in fine

OSI vantage layer up and down style. ?Don't learn to hack; hack to

learn!



Network and other facilities generously provided by the Foundation for

Blind Children.

http://www.seeitourway.org/contactUs.html



The Foundation for Blind Children is located at 1224 Northern in Phoenix.

http://www.google.com/maps?q=1224+Northern,+Phoenix,+AZ%22

The entrance is via the North Door, (just follow the Desert Penguins

signs). Much thanks to Charles for all his assistance while at UAT and

now for volunteering his time and setting up the Foundation and PLUG

in symbiosis to make this training event a success.



Our June agenda is a loose lab for setting up equipment, answering

questions, and evaluating various computer security news items that

affect Linux, play with new tools together, while getting used to our

new facilities. ?Feel free to bring your Notebooks, since initially we

will have only 3 desktops available for research. ?Wireless is

available on our own isolated network, so we can be assured of

controlled festing and demonstrations.



All festers will sign our acceptable use agreement at the door which

protects the school and fellow festers while also establishing general

guidelines for contests and challenges during lab events.



Join us for a special Presentation NEXT Month (July) on

FreeIPA, an integrated security information management solution by

Presenter: Steven D Kaplan, MSCS, BSEE, CISSP of Waxman Associates, LLC



PLUG HackFests have an ongoing call for presentations.

"There's no place like 127.0.0.1" - Anon
wiki.obnosis.com 
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090611/d3e54be4/attachment.html>

From enobacon at gmail.com  Mon Jun 15 17:00:58 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (The Dread Parrot)
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:00:58 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Fwd: Are you ready for YAPC|10 it starts June 22 - only 7
	days away.
Message-ID: <200906151700.58862.enobacon@gmail.com>



----------  Forwarded Message:  ----------
From: Robert Blackwell

YAPC|10 is Monday June 22 - Wednesday June 24.  That is only 7 days
 away.

There are many pre and post events planed too.

So I ask ....

Are you ready for YAPC|10?

http://yapc10.org/yn2009/wiki?node=AreYouReadyForYAPC


Hope to see you at YAPC|10.

Robert
-------------------------------------------------------

-- 

        http://pdx.pm.org

From enobacon at gmail.com  Mon Jun 15 17:01:15 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (The Dread Parrot)
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:01:15 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Fwd: YAPC|10 Courses
Message-ID: <200906151701.15368.enobacon@gmail.com>



----------  Forwarded Message:  ----------
From: Robert Blackwell

We still have some seats available for courses:


http://yapc10.org/yn2009/courses.html



Sun June 21

 From Zero to Perl (Paul Grassie) $100.00
Special fast-paced course for programmers new to the Perl programming
language.

Introduction to Moose, a Modern OO System for Perl (Dave Rolsky)
 $120.00 Learn how to use Moose, a powerful, declarative, and
 extensible OO system for Perl.

Thu June 25

Better Programming Through Testing (Michael G Schwern) $123.00
Learn how testing and other best practices fit together to make you a
better, faster and bolder programmer.

Introduction to RDBMS and SQL for the Totally Ignorant (Joe Celko)
 $150.00 Light introductions to RDBMS & SQL for programmers who know
 only file systems and procedural coding.

Fri June 26

The New Stuff in SQL You Don't Know About (Joe Celko) $170.00
A look at features in Standard SQL that have been added after the core
SQL-92 Standard.
-------------------------------------------------------

-- 

        http://pdx.pm.org

From ingy at ingy.net  Wed Jun 17 15:14:07 2009
From: ingy at ingy.net (Ingy dot Net)
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 15:14:07 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] The TestML Mailing List
Message-ID: <9eb4914f0906171514v664619c1kf397e419b2b1f235@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings,

Ingy here... You are getting this email because I want you involved in the
TestML discussion mailing list. Some of you already are on the list, so
sorry for any redundancy.

TestML is a generic software testing framework that transcends programming
languages and their test frameworks. It is something that I've been thinking
about for 3-4 years and hacking on for a couple months. The spec is at
http://testml.org and the code is under http://github.com/ingydotnet/(testml-*).

I have been frustrated with the mailing list options available to me. I
started with Google Groups and have decided to stick with it for now. Google
Apps handles all the email, even though I so far find Groups to be somewhat
hateful.

The "mailing list" address is discuss at testml.org. I don't have any _good_
way for you to subscribe or unsubscribe, but I do have _a_ way. Send an
email from the address you want to use for this, and I will personally
subscribe/unsubscribe you. Send the email either to ingy at ingy.net or to
discuss at testml.org (it actually allows mail from non-subscribers).

Hopefully I'll get this ironed out, but at least now I can continue the
TestML discussion and make progress. If you have experience with Groups
combined with Apps under a custom domain name (like testml.org) please help
me out.

I really look forward to discussing TestML with all of you.

Cheers, Ingy
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090617/938a9c00/attachment.html>

From kevin at scaldeferri.com  Fri Jun 19 16:26:15 2009
From: kevin at scaldeferri.com (Kevin Scaldeferri)
Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:26:15 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Summer Coders Social -- Tomorrow!
Message-ID: <9D4EC0CD-3447-46B5-B584-60C4B7E89546@scaldeferri.com>

For some reason this has been somewhat poorly publicized, but the  
Summer Coders Social is happening tomorrow, noon-5 at Laurelhurst.   
Rain or shine, so far as I know.

http://calagator.org/events/1250457265




From gorthx at gmail.com  Fri Jun 19 17:17:32 2009
From: gorthx at gmail.com (gabrielle)
Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:17:32 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Summer Coders Social -- Tomorrow!
In-Reply-To: <9D4EC0CD-3447-46B5-B584-60C4B7E89546@scaldeferri.com>
References: <9D4EC0CD-3447-46B5-B584-60C4B7E89546@scaldeferri.com>
Message-ID: <48bb92b0906191717u3f619a0bta9fd6cafc9f87e2a@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jun 19, 2009 at 4:26 PM, Kevin Scaldeferri <kevin at scaldeferri.com>wrote:

> For some reason this has been somewhat poorly publicized, but the Summer
> Coders Social is happening tomorrow, noon-5 at Laurelhurst.  Rain or shine,
> so far as I know.
>
> http://calagator.org/events/1250457265
>

Sam K. just sent out a note that it's been postponed due to rain. :(
http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2806106

gabrielle
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090619/4f18db53/attachment.html>

From schwern at pobox.com  Sun Jun 21 14:36:42 2009
From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern)
Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 17:36:42 -0400
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
Message-ID: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>

After 18 months, 5.10.1 is almost ready to go.  Pumpking Dave Mitchel has
identified a list of bugs he'd like to have triaged.  Him and Nick Clark have
been all but begging people to look at them.

I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs, and pick
off any we feel we can make progress on. Progress includes any of:

1: Verifying that the bug is still present in blead/perl-maint
2: Writing a test that will pass once the bug is fixed
3: Using that test to run a bisect to find when the bug was introduced
4: Actually fixing the bug

This would let people play with git, get to know the perl bug tracker, get
some experience squashing perl bugs, writing tests for perl bugs (its
remarkably similar to using Test::More now) and maybe even learn some C.  Also
it would help 5.10.1 finally get out the door!

Also, we can test the 5.10.1 branch both by trying it out on every wacky
computer and compiler we can get our hands on.  Old unixen, weird compilers...
Windows (seriously).

chromatic and I have experience squashing perl bugs and can help the rest get
in on that.  I know we have some C programmers in the group who can help teach
the rest of us.  And I'm sure you guys have access to a lot of machines.

So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky Lab early. :)


-- 
A: Yes.
> Q: Are you sure?
>> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
>>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?

From gorthx at gmail.com  Sun Jun 21 14:44:42 2009
From: gorthx at gmail.com (gabrielle)
Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 14:44:42 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <48bb92b0906211444h1af7cc7k5f27029ce96c3de1@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jun 21, 2009 at 2:36 PM, Michael G Schwern <schwern at pobox.com>wrote:

> I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs, and
> pick
> off any we feel we can make progress on.


+1

So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky Lab
> early. :)


Oh look, beer!

gabrielle
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090621/7bb972e9/attachment.html>

From ben.hengst at gmail.com  Sun Jun 21 16:27:38 2009
From: ben.hengst at gmail.com (benh)
Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:27:38 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <48bb92b0906211444h1af7cc7k5f27029ce96c3de1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<48bb92b0906211444h1af7cc7k5f27029ce96c3de1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <85ddf48b0906211627x3d9f9638n99e870442cd81231@mail.gmail.com>

sounds like a plan.




2009/6/21 gabrielle <gorthx at gmail.com>:
> On Sun, Jun 21, 2009 at 2:36 PM, Michael G Schwern <schwern at pobox.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs, and
>> pick
>> off any we feel we can make progress on.
>
> +1
>
>> So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky Lab
>> early. :)
>
> Oh look, beer!
>
> gabrielle
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 
benh~

http://three.sentenc.es/

From brian.kurle at ieee.org  Sun Jun 21 16:45:05 2009
From: brian.kurle at ieee.org (Brian Kurle)
Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:45:05 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>

Are you proposing this for next month's meeting, or possibly something  
sooner (why wait a month)?

On Jun 21, 2009, at 2:36 PM, Michael G Schwern <schwern at pobox.com>  
wrote:

> After 18 months, 5.10.1 is almost ready to go.  Pumpking Dave  
> Mitchel has
> identified a list of bugs he'd like to have triaged.  Him and Nick  
> Clark have
> been all but begging people to look at them.
>
> I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs,  
> and pick
> off any we feel we can make progress on. Progress includes any of:
>
> 1: Verifying that the bug is still present in blead/perl-maint
> 2: Writing a test that will pass once the bug is fixed
> 3: Using that test to run a bisect to find when the bug was introduced
> 4: Actually fixing the bug
>
> This would let people play with git, get to know the perl bug  
> tracker, get
> some experience squashing perl bugs, writing tests for perl bugs (its
> remarkably similar to using Test::More now) and maybe even learn  
> some C.  Also
> it would help 5.10.1 finally get out the door!
>
> Also, we can test the 5.10.1 branch both by trying it out on every  
> wacky
> computer and compiler we can get our hands on.  Old unixen, weird  
> compilers...
> Windows (seriously).
>
> chromatic and I have experience squashing perl bugs and can help the  
> rest get
> in on that.  I know we have some C programmers in the group who can  
> help teach
> the rest of us.  And I'm sure you guys have access to a lot of  
> machines.
>
> So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky  
> Lab early. :)
>
>
> -- 
> A: Yes.
>> Q: Are you sure?
>>> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
>>>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>

From enobacon at gmail.com  Sun Jun 21 21:30:56 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 21:30:56 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
Message-ID: <200906212130.57262.enobacon@gmail.com>

# from Brian Kurle
# on Sunday 21 June 2009 16:45:

>Are you proposing this for next month's meeting, or possibly something
> ? sooner (why wait a month)?

Rumblings on p5p claim that 5.10.1 would be ready before the next 
meeting, so certainly a bug triage session before the next meeting 
would make sense.  And maybe then someone can give a talk about how to 
hack the Perl core at the July meeting?

--Eric
-- 
hobgoblin n 1: (folklore) a small grotesque supernatural creature that
          makes trouble for human beings
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From jaleto at gmail.com  Mon Jun 22 00:11:20 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:11:20 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906220011y26737b6vdb511e0b4a127ff8@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

I am all for some kind of "Perl code sprint" that happens as much as
once a week, where a few people get together with a common goal and
get some stuff done.

There was a great talk at OSBridge about "Effective Codesprinting" by
the Calagator peeps, they spread a lot of useful knowledge that I
would like to put into practice.

Would anybody be up for it?

Duke


> Are you proposing this for next month's meeting, or possibly something
> sooner (why wait a month)?
>
> On Jun 21, 2009, at 2:36 PM, Michael G Schwern <schwern at pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> After 18 months, 5.10.1 is almost ready to go. ?Pumpking Dave Mitchel has
>> identified a list of bugs he'd like to have triaged. ?Him and Nick Clark
>> have
>> been all but begging people to look at them.
>>
>> I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs, and
>> pick
>> off any we feel we can make progress on. Progress includes any of:
>>
>> 1: Verifying that the bug is still present in blead/perl-maint
>> 2: Writing a test that will pass once the bug is fixed
>> 3: Using that test to run a bisect to find when the bug was introduced
>> 4: Actually fixing the bug
>>
>> This would let people play with git, get to know the perl bug tracker, get
>> some experience squashing perl bugs, writing tests for perl bugs (its
>> remarkably similar to using Test::More now) and maybe even learn some C.
>> ?Also
>> it would help 5.10.1 finally get out the door!
>>
>> Also, we can test the 5.10.1 branch both by trying it out on every wacky
>> computer and compiler we can get our hands on. ?Old unixen, weird
>> compilers...
>> Windows (seriously).
>>
>> chromatic and I have experience squashing perl bugs and can help the rest
>> get
>> in on that. ?I know we have some C programmers in the group who can help
>> teach
>> the rest of us. ?And I'm sure you guys have access to a lot of machines.
>>
>> So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky Lab
>> early. :)
>>
>>
>> --
>> A: Yes.
>>>
>>> Q: Are you sure?
>>>>
>>>> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
>>>>>
>>>>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
>> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From david at kineticode.com  Mon Jun 22 08:58:34 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 08:58:34 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906220011y26737b6vdb511e0b4a127ff8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<9aaadf9c0906220011y26737b6vdb511e0b4a127ff8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0E007F13-1BC4-4B3A-94FF-2E7E27B5A4BF@kineticode.com>

On Jun 22, 2009, at 12:11 AM, Jonathan Leto wrote:

> Howdy,
>
> I am all for some kind of "Perl code sprint" that happens as much as
> once a week, where a few people get together with a common goal and
> get some stuff done.
>
> There was a great talk at OSBridge about "Effective Codesprinting" by
> the Calagator peeps, they spread a lot of useful knowledge that I
> would like to put into practice.
>
> Would anybody be up for it?

+1

David


From triddle at gmail.com  Mon Jun 22 10:05:04 2009
From: triddle at gmail.com (Tyler Riddle)
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 10:05:04 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906220011y26737b6vdb511e0b4a127ff8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<9aaadf9c0906220011y26737b6vdb511e0b4a127ff8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f7203f150906221005q53f37eacwea8a590561c6c2b6@mail.gmail.com>

I'm new and have been a lurker for a while but I'm competent enough in
C (I think) to help out and would love to work on some perlguts.

+1 me too

Tyler

On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 12:11 AM, Jonathan Leto<jaleto at gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy,
>
> I am all for some kind of "Perl code sprint" that happens as much as
> once a week, where a few people get together with a common goal and
> get some stuff done.
>
> There was a great talk at OSBridge about "Effective Codesprinting" by
> the Calagator peeps, they spread a lot of useful knowledge that I
> would like to put into practice.
>
> Would anybody be up for it?
>
> Duke
>
>
>> Are you proposing this for next month's meeting, or possibly something
>> sooner (why wait a month)?
>>
>> On Jun 21, 2009, at 2:36 PM, Michael G Schwern <schwern at pobox.com> wrote:
>>
>>> After 18 months, 5.10.1 is almost ready to go. ?Pumpking Dave Mitchel has
>>> identified a list of bugs he'd like to have triaged. ?Him and Nick Clark
>>> have
>>> been all but begging people to look at them.
>>>
>>> I propose for next meeting we would look through that list of bugs, and
>>> pick
>>> off any we feel we can make progress on. Progress includes any of:
>>>
>>> 1: Verifying that the bug is still present in blead/perl-maint
>>> 2: Writing a test that will pass once the bug is fixed
>>> 3: Using that test to run a bisect to find when the bug was introduced
>>> 4: Actually fixing the bug
>>>
>>> This would let people play with git, get to know the perl bug tracker, get
>>> some experience squashing perl bugs, writing tests for perl bugs (its
>>> remarkably similar to using Test::More now) and maybe even learn some C.
>>> ?Also
>>> it would help 5.10.1 finally get out the door!
>>>
>>> Also, we can test the 5.10.1 branch both by trying it out on every wacky
>>> computer and compiler we can get our hands on. ?Old unixen, weird
>>> compilers...
>>> Windows (seriously).
>>>
>>> chromatic and I have experience squashing perl bugs and can help the rest
>>> get
>>> in on that. ?I know we have some C programmers in the group who can help
>>> teach
>>> the rest of us. ?And I'm sure you guys have access to a lot of machines.
>>>
>>> So a nice hands-on meeting, which means we can head off to the Lucky Lab
>>> early. :)
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> A: Yes.
>>>>
>>>> Q: Are you sure?
>>>>>
>>>>> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
>>> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
>>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
>> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Jonathan Leto
> jonathan at leto.net
> http://leto.net
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 
Red Hat's vision for Unix is findgrepsedtee and a package manager that lies.

From schwern at pobox.com  Wed Jun 24 07:28:58 2009
From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 10:28:58 -0400
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
Message-ID: <4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>

Brian Kurle wrote:
> Are you proposing this for next month's meeting, or possibly something
> sooner (why wait a month)?

For purely selfish reasons, I won't be back in town until the first of July.
But I won't cry if it goes ahead before I get back.

I told myself I won't cry. *sniff*


-- 
<Schwern> What we learned was if you get confused, grab someone and swing
          them around a few times
        -- Life's lessons from square dancing

From igal at pragmaticraft.com  Wed Jun 24 09:09:30 2009
From: igal at pragmaticraft.com (Igal Koshevoy)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:09:30 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
Message-ID: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>

I need to be able to query an installed CPAN package and find out what
files it contains. I had code that worked fine with Perl 5.8, but it
doesn't work with 5.10. Any ideas? Is there another way that I should be
doing this?

>From http://gist.github.com/135351

    # From shell, install a silly package:
    cpan Acme::please
     
    # From Perl, get the lists of file in this package:
    use Acme::please; # Silly way to check that package is installed
    use Data::Dumper;
    require ExtUtils::Installed;
    $packlists = ExtUtils::Installed->new;
    p Dumper([$packlists->files('Acme::please')]);
     
    # Perl 5.8 returns an array:
    $VAR1 = [
              '/usr/local/man/man3/Acme::please.3pm',
              '/usr/local/share/perl/5.8.8/Acme/please.pm'
            ];
     
    # Perl 5.10 raises an exception at the `$packlists->files` call:
    Acme::please is not installed

Thanks!

-igal

From david at kineticode.com  Wed Jun 24 09:46:51 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:46:51 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>

On Jun 24, 2009, at 7:28 AM, Michael G Schwern wrote:

> For purely selfish reasons, I won't be back in town until the first  
> of July.
> But I won't cry if it goes ahead before I get back.
>
> I told myself I won't cry. *sniff*

I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?

Best,

David

From erik at hollensbe.org  Wed Jun 24 10:51:18 2009
From: erik at hollensbe.org (Erik Hollensbe)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 10:51:18 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
In-Reply-To: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>
References: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>
Message-ID: <1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop>

On Wed, 2009-06-24 at 09:09 -0700, Igal Koshevoy wrote:
> I need to be able to query an installed CPAN package and find out what
> files it contains. I had code that worked fine with Perl 5.8, but it
> doesn't work with 5.10. Any ideas? Is there another way that I should be
> doing this?

I know this doesn't answer your question, but is there some reason you
can't use the old fashioned idiom:

perl -MAcme::please -e1 

and check $?

You could even write a module to do it. :)

-Erik


From list at phaedrusdeinus.org  Wed Jun 24 10:55:58 2009
From: list at phaedrusdeinus.org (John Melesky)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 10:55:58 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] ICFP Contest this weekend
Message-ID: <DCE96799-9447-41BC-98E3-97A6CCBC27DC@phaedrusdeinus.org>

The ICFP programming contest[1] is this weekend (starting Friday,  
about 11am our time).

For those who aren't aware, the ICFP contest has been going on for  
over ten years. It's a general programming contest (read: use whatever  
language you want, functional or otherwise), intended for teams, and  
it lasts 3 days. Winners get bragging rights, and "prize money to help  
defray the costs of travel to the conference for the winners as well  
as small cash prizes" (the conference itself[2] is in Edinburgh, UK,  
in late August/early September).

Past contests have involved building virtual machines (e.g., in 2006  
to run a VM image that you then had to hack, in 2007 to do image  
processing on alien "dna"), writing simple AIs for small agents (e.g.,  
last year involved a Mars rover avoiding aliens and rocks, 2005  
involved robots robbing banks and cop robots stopping them), thinking  
about datatypes (e.g. in 2007, lots of string processing was  
necessary, but the default string types for most languages weren't  
suited to the tasks), and generally a lot of fun, geeky humor.

I encourage anyone who likes programming enough to be on this list to  
at least check it out, and, ideally, to participate. Form a team with  
your friends or coworkers. It tends to be lots of fun, especially if  
it's not the sort of programming task you normally work on.

-johnnnnnn

[1] http://www.icfpcontest.org/
[2] http://www.icfpconference.org/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20090624/90eefd18/attachment.html>

From igal at pragmaticraft.com  Wed Jun 24 10:57:09 2009
From: igal at pragmaticraft.com (Igal Koshevoy)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 10:57:09 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
In-Reply-To: <1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop>
References: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>
	<1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop>
Message-ID: <4A4268F5.1000500@pragmaticraft.com>

Erik Hollensbe wrote:
> On Wed, 2009-06-24 at 09:09 -0700, Igal Koshevoy wrote:
>   
>> I need to be able to query an installed CPAN package and find out what
>> files it contains. I had code that worked fine with Perl 5.8, but it
>> doesn't work with 5.10. Any ideas? Is there another way that I should be
>> doing this?
>>     
>
> I know this doesn't answer your question, but is there some reason you
> can't use the old fashioned idiom:
>
> perl -MAcme::please -e1 
>
> and check $?
>
> You could even write a module to do it. :)
My goal is to get a list of files that are part of that module.

Here's an example of how weird the situation is:

    use Data::Dumper;
    require CPAN;
    require ExtUtils::Installed;
    $module = "Acme::please";
    require CPAN;
    print Dumper($CPAN::META->has_inst($module));
    $packlists = ExtUtils::Installed->new;
    print Dumper($packlists->files($module));

The `$CPAN::META->has_inst` tells me that the package is installed. The
`$packlists->files` tells me it's not. :/

-igal

From erik at hollensbe.org  Wed Jun 24 11:12:24 2009
From: erik at hollensbe.org (Erik Hollensbe)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 11:12:24 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
In-Reply-To: <4A4268F5.1000500@pragmaticraft.com>
References: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>
	<1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop>
	<4A4268F5.1000500@pragmaticraft.com>
Message-ID: <1245867144.4941.6.camel@erikh-desktop>

On Wed, 2009-06-24 at 10:57 -0700, Igal Koshevoy wrote:
> Erik Hollensbe wrote:
> > On Wed, 2009-06-24 at 09:09 -0700, Igal Koshevoy wrote:
> >   
> >> I need to be able to query an installed CPAN package and find out what
> >> files it contains. I had code that worked fine with Perl 5.8, but it
> >> doesn't work with 5.10. Any ideas? Is there another way that I should be
> >> doing this?
> The `$CPAN::META->has_inst` tells me that the package is installed. The
> `$packlists->files` tells me it's not. :/

Igal,

This is working for me on 5.10.0, ubuntu 9.04:

use strict;
use warnings;

use ExtUtils::Installed;
use Data::Dumper;

my $pl = ExtUtils::Installed->new;
print Dumper [$pl->files("ack")];

It could not, however, find the packlist for Data::Dumper. Perhaps
because it's a part of the stdlib, but I suspect you already know this.

HTH.

-Erik


From igal at pragmaticraft.com  Wed Jun 24 11:37:06 2009
From: igal at pragmaticraft.com (Igal Koshevoy)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 11:37:06 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
In-Reply-To: <1245867144.4941.6.camel@erikh-desktop>
References: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>	
	<1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop>	
	<4A4268F5.1000500@pragmaticraft.com>
	<1245867144.4941.6.camel@erikh-desktop>
Message-ID: <4A427252.5000809@pragmaticraft.com>

I believe that I've found the underlying issue.

I use GNU Stow, a very useful tool written in Perl that provides a handy
way of installing things into paths like /usr/local/stow/git-1.6.3.3 and
then manages symlinks into /usr/local. It makes it easy to install
different versions of software outside my OS's package manager and
switch between them. For additional details about GNU Stow, please read
<http://www.linux.com/archive/feature/127393>.

My trouble was that my "/usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0" hierarchy was
empty, since this was being run on a freshly installed OS without any
other modules installed, so Stow decided to replace it with a symlink to
my Git's instance of this directory because Git actually had content for
this directory. This relinking is usually a reasonable thing, but was
the wrong thing to do in this case, but shouldn't have been fatal.

Unfortunately, there's something in ExtUtils::Installed that really,
really doesn't this sort of thing. It refused to traverse the symlinked
directory and didn't see the .packlist files within. Once I uninstalled
Acme::please, unstowed Git, installed Acme::please, and stowed Git, all
was well again.

If I have time, I'll try to find out what in specific is going wrong
with ExtUtils::Installed handling of symlinked directories.

Anyway, I suppose that my particular problem is resolved for now. Thanks
to Ben, Eric and Eric for pitching in to help.

-igal

From jaleto at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 12:00:56 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 12:00:56 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Is the ExtUtils::Installed in Perl 5.10 broken?
In-Reply-To: <4A427252.5000809@pragmaticraft.com>
References: <4A424FBA.8060904@pragmaticraft.com>
	<1245865878.4941.3.camel@erikh-desktop> 
	<4A4268F5.1000500@pragmaticraft.com>
	<1245867144.4941.6.camel@erikh-desktop> 
	<4A427252.5000809@pragmaticraft.com>
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906241200u74519ecfr7ed1004734d629e4@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

Adding a quick bug to it's RT queue
(http://rt.cpan.org/Public/Dist/Display.html?Name=ExtUtils-Install)
will benefit anyone else having this problem and perhaps get it fixed
in a future release.

Cheers,



On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 11:37 AM, Igal Koshevoy<igal at pragmaticraft.com> wrote:
> I believe that I've found the underlying issue.
>
> I use GNU Stow, a very useful tool written in Perl that provides a handy
> way of installing things into paths like /usr/local/stow/git-1.6.3.3 and
> then manages symlinks into /usr/local. It makes it easy to install
> different versions of software outside my OS's package manager and
> switch between them. For additional details about GNU Stow, please read
> <http://www.linux.com/archive/feature/127393>.
>
> My trouble was that my "/usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0" hierarchy was
> empty, since this was being run on a freshly installed OS without any
> other modules installed, so Stow decided to replace it with a symlink to
> my Git's instance of this directory because Git actually had content for
> this directory. This relinking is usually a reasonable thing, but was
> the wrong thing to do in this case, but shouldn't have been fatal.
>
> Unfortunately, there's something in ExtUtils::Installed that really,
> really doesn't this sort of thing. It refused to traverse the symlinked
> directory and didn't see the .packlist files within. Once I uninstalled
> Acme::please, unstowed Git, installed Acme::please, and stowed Git, all
> was well again.
>
> If I have time, I'll try to find out what in specific is going wrong
> with ExtUtils::Installed handling of symlinked directories.
>
> Anyway, I suppose that my particular problem is resolved for now. Thanks
> to Ben, Eric and Eric for pitching in to help.
>
> -igal
> _______________________________________________
> Pdx-pm-list mailing list
> Pdx-pm-list at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list
>



-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From brian.kurle at ieee.org  Wed Jun 24 15:25:51 2009
From: brian.kurle at ieee.org (Brian Kurle)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 15:25:51 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <BA939CA2-55F4-4E7E-B60D-27213EBC1D94@ieee.org>

+/-1?   (I'm tentative at best with a possible out of town gig  
occurring before then)

On Jun 24, 2009, at 9:46 AM, David E. Wheeler wrote:

> On Jun 24, 2009, at 7:28 AM, Michael G Schwern wrote:
>
>> For purely selfish reasons, I won't be back in town until the first  
>> of July.
>> But I won't cry if it goes ahead before I get back.
>>
>> I told myself I won't cry. *sniff*
>
> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?
>
> Best,
>
> David
>


From gorthx at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 13:11:46 2009
From: gorthx at gmail.com (gabrielle)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 13:11:46 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <48bb92b0906251311i2543e155j7faf8cfc8505d680@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 9:46 AM, David E. Wheeler<david at kineticode.com> wrote:
> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?

I am!

gabrielle

From david at kineticode.com  Thu Jun 25 13:39:53 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 13:39:53 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <48bb92b0906251311i2543e155j7faf8cfc8505d680@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
	<48bb92b0906251311i2543e155j7faf8cfc8505d680@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8E1288DD-39B4-4016-800B-568A7102204A@kineticode.com>

On Jun 25, 2009, at 1:11 PM, gabrielle wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 9:46 AM, David E.  
> Wheeler<david at kineticode.com> wrote:
>> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?
>
> I am!

Great, that's two of us! Anyone else? Maybe someone who knows C or  
something?

Best,

David


From kevin at scaldeferri.com  Thu Jun 25 14:30:10 2009
From: kevin at scaldeferri.com (Kevin Scaldeferri)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:30:10 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <8E1288DD-39B4-4016-800B-568A7102204A@kineticode.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
	<48bb92b0906251311i2543e155j7faf8cfc8505d680@mail.gmail.com>
	<8E1288DD-39B4-4016-800B-568A7102204A@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <A6D14252-7721-4438-A3FD-C6D464CD2548@scaldeferri.com>


On Jun 25, 2009, at 1:39 PM, David E. Wheeler wrote:

> On Jun 25, 2009, at 1:11 PM, gabrielle wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 9:46 AM, David E. Wheeler<david at kineticode.com 
>> > wrote:
>>> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?
>>
>> I am!
>
> Great, that's two of us! Anyone else? Maybe someone who knows C or  
> something?
>

I'm a maybe at this point, but I've hacked more C recently than I'd  
like to admit.  I've never dove into the Perl core, though.


-kevin

From jaleto at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 15:52:38 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 15:52:38 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org> 
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906251552l485488cai421628a38e1a8903@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?

I will be there with bells on.

I have recently added a few tests to the perl debugger, so I am
naively familiar with how to add tests to perl.

I could also give a "git crashcourse" for those that need it.

Duke


-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From david at kineticode.com  Thu Jun 25 16:15:25 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:15:25 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906251552l485488cai421628a38e1a8903@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
	<9aaadf9c0906251552l485488cai421628a38e1a8903@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D61471B1-5E7C-410F-AA96-C6CE870FE70D@kineticode.com>

On Jun 25, 2009, at 3:52 PM, Jonathan Leto wrote:

>> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?
>
> I will be there with bells on.
>
> I have recently added a few tests to the perl debugger, so I am
> naively familiar with how to add tests to perl.
>
> I could also give a "git crashcourse" for those that need it.

Jonathan++

David

From merlyn at stonehenge.com  Thu Jun 25 16:21:53 2009
From: merlyn at stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:21:53 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com> (David E.
	Wheeler's message of "Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:46:51 -0700")
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <86ocsbx5ke.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com>

>>>>> "David" == David E Wheeler <david at kineticode.com> writes:

David> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?

There's a PLUG meeting that night, so I'd have to choose one or the other.

-- 
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<merlyn at stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion

From jaleto at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 16:42:36 2009
From: jaleto at gmail.com (Jonathan Leto)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:42:36 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] 5.10.1 code sprint
Message-ID: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

I think we should all have a short plan for what we want to accomplish
at the code sprint. Small, focused goals are best.

I think if everyone learns how to

a) get a copy of the perl git repo
b) keep it in sync
c) run the perl test suite, including running a single test at a time
d) submit a small documentation patch

then we will have a great start. If we get to fixing real internals
bugs at our first sprint then that is awesome-sauce with unicorn
sprinkles.

Some useful links for our recently planned code sprint:

Unresolved RT tickets that are blocking 5.10.1 :
http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Public/Search/Simple.html?Query=MemberOf=66092%20AND%20Status!=%27resolved

Using the Perl git repo:
http://perl5.git.perl.org/perl.git/blob/HEAD:/pod/perlrepository.pod
(short and sweet)

How to hack the Perl internals:
http://perl5.git.perl.org/perl.git/blob/HEAD:/pod/perlhack.pod (kinda
scary)

If you checkout perl from git below, then you can read the above with
"perldoc pod/perlrepository.pod" instead of reading POD source.

Also, I highly recommend everyone clone the perl5 git repo before the
sprint, it is somewhere around 100-150Mb :

$ git clone git://perl5.git.perl.org/perl.git

Note that cloning over http is *considerably* slower. Not fun.

If you have more suggestions, let us know.

Duke



-- 

Jonathan Leto
jonathan at leto.net
http://leto.net

From david at kineticode.com  Thu Jun 25 16:46:44 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:46:44 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for next meeting: Getting 5.10.1 released
In-Reply-To: <86ocsbx5ke.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com>
References: <4A3EA7EA.2010006@pobox.com>
	<55B9FBCC-350D-4C5B-95A6-D1FBBEA16B20@ieee.org>
	<4A42382A.7060406@pobox.com>
	<4267CD4C-B9B2-4395-8026-140E6FC1D5E8@kineticode.com>
	<86ocsbx5ke.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com>
Message-ID: <64393A9D-E6D1-436A-85A9-446F530BCB8C@kineticode.com>

On Jun 25, 2009, at 4:21 PM, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:

> David> I suggest Thursday, July 2, 6:52pm at the Lucky Lab. Who's in?
>
> There's a PLUG meeting that night, so I'd have to choose one or the  
> other.

Or meet us after the PLUG.

D

From enobacon at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 17:31:02 2009
From: enobacon at gmail.com (Eric Wilhelm)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 17:31:02 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] Suggestion for July 8th meeting - modules and CPAN plumbing
Message-ID: <200906251731.03079.enobacon@gmail.com>

Hi all,

We're just under two weeks from the July meeting and the only suggestion 
thus far has been hijacked into a (sounds like fun) code sprint.

So here's another suggestion:  how modules work and stuff about the 
CPAN.

Here's a suggested agenda:

  * configuring your CPAN/CPANPLUS client
  * what makes a module
  * what happens when you install a module (where does stuff go?)
  * what happens when you load a module
  * how to make a distribution
  * how distributions get on the CPAN (PAUSE)
  * how distributions get found by the CPAN client
  * what a distribution contains, metadata

Some of this is fairly basic and other parts are lesser known.  I think 
it would be interesting to have multiple speakers (if there are 8, you 
each only need 5 minutes of material), but it would take some 
preparation to get all of the slides ready to go in a coherent 40min 
run.

Does that sound interesting and useful?  Did I miss anything or is any 
of it too basic?  Igal will talk about .packlists ;-) Other volunteers?

--Eric
-- 
"But as to modern architecture, let us drop it and let us take
modernistic out and shoot it at sunrise."
--F.L. Wright
---------------------------------------------------
    http://scratchcomputing.com
---------------------------------------------------

From david at kineticode.com  Fri Jun 26 08:55:41 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:55:41 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] 5.10.1 code sprint
In-Reply-To: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <36637970-205A-46A6-B9A2-1A527D25E338@kineticode.com>

On Jun 25, 2009, at 4:42 PM, Jonathan Leto wrote:

> Howdy,
>
> I think we should all have a short plan for what we want to accomplish
> at the code sprint. Small, focused goals are best.

Thanks for this, Duke, big help. I'm cloning the Perl source now.

Best,

David


From nick at ccl4.org  Fri Jun 26 09:16:21 2009
From: nick at ccl4.org (Nicholas Clark)
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 17:16:21 +0100
Subject: [Pdx-pm] 5.10.1 code sprint
In-Reply-To: <36637970-205A-46A6-B9A2-1A527D25E338@kineticode.com>
References: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>
	<36637970-205A-46A6-B9A2-1A527D25E338@kineticode.com>
Message-ID: <20090626161621.GT33745@plum.flirble.org>

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 08:55:41AM -0700, David E. Wheeler wrote:
> On Jun 25, 2009, at 4:42 PM, Jonathan Leto wrote:
> 
> >Howdy,
> >
> >I think we should all have a short plan for what we want to accomplish
> >at the code sprint. Small, focused goals are best.
> 
> Thanks for this, Duke, big help. I'm cloning the Perl source now.

You might also want to clone the source (ahead of time), tar up the fresh new
clone directory, and place the (compressed) tarball on a USB stick

a: It makes it very easy at the meeting to give anyone a copy who didn't
   download it in advance
b: It's rather strange realising that you have the entire copy of the history
   of the Perl core in your pocket.

Nicholas Clark

From chromatic at wgz.org  Fri Jun 26 12:33:59 2009
From: chromatic at wgz.org (chromatic)
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 12:33:59 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] 5.10.1 code sprint
In-Reply-To: <20090626161621.GT33745@plum.flirble.org>
References: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>
	<36637970-205A-46A6-B9A2-1A527D25E338@kineticode.com>
	<20090626161621.GT33745@plum.flirble.org>
Message-ID: <200906261234.00105.chromatic@wgz.org>

On Friday 26 June 2009 09:16:21 Nicholas Clark wrote:

> b: It's rather strange realising that you have the entire copy of the
> history of the Perl core in your pocket.

Sadly, running it through the washer is not a workable refactoring technique.

-- c

From david at kineticode.com  Fri Jun 26 16:21:09 2009
From: david at kineticode.com (David E. Wheeler)
Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:21:09 -0700
Subject: [Pdx-pm] 5.10.1 code sprint
In-Reply-To: <200906261234.00105.chromatic@wgz.org>
References: <9aaadf9c0906251642q5378d4dbk942b8ece147c0dab@mail.gmail.com>
	<36637970-205A-46A6-B9A2-1A527D25E338@kineticode.com>
	<20090626161621.GT33745@plum.flirble.org>
	<200906261234.00105.chromatic@wgz.org>
Message-ID: <7E37E916-B335-47E7-9053-F7C9971622E4@kineticode.com>

On Jun 26, 2009, at 12:33 PM, chromatic wrote:

>> b: It's rather strange realising that you have the entire copy of the
>> history of the Perl core in your pocket.
>
> Sadly, running it through the washer is not a workable refactoring  
> technique.

chromatic, you are welcome to come with dirty pants. Depending on the  
dirt, of course. Let's keep it clean here.

Best,

David