From raa at mailporter.net Fri Oct 1 13:02:59 2004 From: raa at mailporter.net (Roderick A. Anderson) Date: Fri Oct 1 13:03:20 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Emulate a file in memory? Message-ID: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> Is is possible, in Perl, to emulate a file in memory? Open it, read from, write to etc. then save to disk when closed? Here is what I'm trying to do. Create an application that stores data in a SQLite database stored in memory. When done or before using the data; encrypt/decrypt the whole thing, before/after a save-to/read-from disk. Of course a DataDumper like datastructure would work also but I'm a SQL/database kind of thinker. I'm thinking of a perl implementation of an eWallet kind of application. What are (are there any?) the correct terms in perl-speak for this? I looked eleven pages into a CPAN search and found a few modules that looked promising but not, to the best of my understaning, doing this. This is assuming it is/will-be pure perl and there is no external encryption/decruption program available. I'm giving up trying to explain this. I think I'm just making it worst. If it makes any kind of sense please point me in the right direction. Otherwise I'll dig deeper in the books. TIA, Rod -- --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From ewilhelm at sbcglobal.net Fri Oct 1 13:22:05 2004 From: ewilhelm at sbcglobal.net (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Fri Oct 1 13:21:49 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Emulate a file in memory? In-Reply-To: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> References: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> Message-ID: <200410011322.05699.ewilhelm@sbcglobal.net> # The following was supposedly scribed by # Roderick A. Anderson # on Friday 01 October 2004 01:02 pm: >Is is possible, in Perl, to emulate a file in memory? ?Open it, read >from, write to etc. then save to disk when closed? I was recently trying to find something like python's StringIO, which lets a string be a filehandle. However, I suspect that this is done in StringIO by creating a tempfile and opening it. That seemed to be the easiest way to handle it in Perl too. It might be possible to overload the <> operator, but I'm not sure about print(), read(), seek(), and etc. Furthermore, if you are using this magic filehandle with SQLite, it is likely performing these operations in C, so your perl overloads wouldn't work. I take it that you're trying to do this without a tempfile for security reasons? If that's the case, the simplest answer would be to use a tempfile with appropriate permissions. --Eric -- "I've often gotten the feeling that the only people who have learned from computer assisted instruction are the authors." --Ben Schneiderman From jeff at vpservices.com Fri Oct 1 13:22:37 2004 From: jeff at vpservices.com (Jeff Zucker) Date: Fri Oct 1 13:22:44 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Emulate a file in memory? In-Reply-To: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> References: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> Message-ID: <415DA06D.9030709@vpservices.com> Roderick A. Anderson wrote: > Here is what I'm trying to do. Create an application that stores data > in a SQLite database stored in memory. When done or before using the > data; encrypt/decrypt the whole thing, before/after a save-to/read-from > disk. Of course a DataDumper like datastructure would work also but > I'm a SQL/database kind of thinker. In that case, maybe you should use DBD::AnyData (formerly called DBD::RAM) which can create in-memory databases. Dump from SQLite into the in-memory database, manipulate it as desired, dump from the in-memory database back to SQLite, all using SQL. Then again, maybe I misunderstand what you want to accomplish or am just applying my hammer (I'm the author of DBD::AnyData) to that thing that looks like a nail to me. -- Jeff From tex at off.org Fri Oct 1 14:18:21 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Fri Oct 1 14:18:31 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Emulate a file in memory? In-Reply-To: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> References: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> Message-ID: <20041001191821.GJ21947@gblx.net> On Fri, Oct 01, 2004 at 11:02:59AM -0700, Roderick A. Anderson wrote: > Is is possible, in Perl, to emulate a file in memory? Open it, read > from, write to etc. then save to disk when closed? > > Here is what I'm trying to do. Create an application that stores data > in a SQLite database stored in memory. When done or before using the > data; encrypt/decrypt the whole thing, before/after a save-to/read-from > disk. Of course a DataDumper like datastructure would work also but > I'm a SQL/database kind of thinker. > One more idea: if you abstrace reading/writing to the database, you could encrypt/decrypt the data then. This seems like less brainpower than trying to encrypt/decrypt the whole thing. TMTOWTDI and all that. :-) Austin From ewilhelm at sbcglobal.net Fri Oct 1 14:37:43 2004 From: ewilhelm at sbcglobal.net (Eric Wilhelm) Date: Fri Oct 1 14:37:23 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Emulate a file in memory? In-Reply-To: <20041001183716.GE14670@dalsemi.com> References: <415D9BD3.9090109@mailporter.net> <200410011322.05699.ewilhelm@sbcglobal.net> <20041001183716.GE14670@dalsemi.com> Message-ID: <200410011437.43815.ewilhelm@sbcglobal.net> # The following was supposedly scribed by # Colin Kuskie # on Friday 01 October 2004 01:37 pm: >> I was recently trying to find something like python's StringIO, >> which lets a string be a filehandle. > >You mean like IO::String? > >http://search.cpan.org/~gaas/IO-String-1.05/ heh. Yeah, exactly like that except using the builtin <>, seek(HANDLE, $off, $whence), and such-like syntax. So, this isn't really what I was looking for, but it's manpage did clue me in on the fact that perl has native support for what I was wanting since 5.8! A look at my 5.8.3 perldoc -f open has all of the fun details. perl -e '$a = "foo bar baz"; open(A, "<", \$a) or die; seek(A, 0,0); read(A, $b, 7); print "$b\n"; seek(A, 1,0); read(A, $b, 2); print "$b!\n";' So, you've found my solution (and maybe the guts that implement this are magic enough to work with SQLite too.) If so, that might solve Rod's problem as well (provided that he has 5.8 or better.) Thanks, Eric -- "It is a mistake to allow any mechanical object to realize that you are in a hurry." --Ralph's Observation From dennis at giantfir.com Sun Oct 3 22:04:44 2004 From: dennis at giantfir.com (Dennis McNulty) Date: Sun Oct 3 22:04:26 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting In-Reply-To: <20040928182821.95384.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040928182821.95384.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4160BDCC.9060907@giantfir.com> I haven't been to a Mongers' meeting in a couple of years, but the long-running conflict with my singing group has just ended with their decision to move practices to Monday nights. Two weeks in a row of Monger meetings would be great for me, to more quickly get caught up on news about how the language and the users are evolving. Perhaps through many generations, our sub-species will develop sharper eyes and uniform-length fingers. - Dennis McNulty ==================================================================== publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com wrote: >--- Josh Heumann wrote: > > >>Also, how do people feel about having Ovid give his Interactive Testing presentation on our normal date, the 13th? The two presentations will go nicely together, but if people feel that having two meetings a month is too much, we can have him go next month. >> >> > >As an FYI: I've already told Josh that I'm happy to do it either way, so whatever works best for the Mongers is fine by me. I think the earlier date would mean the OO work is fresher in your mind, but I also realize that cramming two meetings together might not fit people's schedules. > >Cheers, >Ovid > >===== >Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/indexdecency.htm >Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 >Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ >_______________________________________________ >Pdx-pm-list mailing list >Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/archives/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20041003/51115322/attachment.htm From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Mon Oct 4 00:18:33 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Mon Oct 4 00:18:37 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting In-Reply-To: <4160BDCC.9060907@giantfir.com> References: <20040928182821.95384.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> <4160BDCC.9060907@giantfir.com> Message-ID: <33004.130.94.161.146.1096867113.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> So, are there any objections to having two meetings this month? Josh > I haven't been to a Mongers' meeting in a couple of years, but the > long-running conflict with my singing group has just ended with their > decision to move practices to Monday nights. > > Two weeks in a row of Monger meetings would be great for me, to more > quickly get caught up on news about how the language and the users are > evolving. Perhaps through many generations, our sub-species will develop > sharper eyes and uniform-length fingers. > > - Dennis McNulty > ==================================================================== > > publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com wrote: > >>--- Josh Heumann wrote: >> >> >>>Also, how do people feel about having Ovid give his Interactive >>> Testing presentation on our normal date, the 13th? The two >>> presentations will go nicely together, but if people feel that having >>> two meetings a month is too much, we can have him go next month. >>> >>> >> >>As an FYI: I've already told Josh that I'm happy to do it either way, >> so whatever works best for the Mongers is fine by me. I think the >> earlier date would mean the OO work is fresher in your mind, but I also >> realize that cramming two meetings together might not fit people's >> schedules. >> >>Cheers, >>Ovid >> >>===== >>Silence is Evil >> http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/indexdecency.htm Ovid >> http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web >> Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ >> _______________________________________________ >>Pdx-pm-list mailing list >>Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list >> >> >> From randall at sonofhans.net Mon Oct 4 11:19:20 2004 From: randall at sonofhans.net (Randall Hansen) Date: Mon Oct 4 11:19:28 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting In-Reply-To: <33004.130.94.161.146.1096867113.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <20040928182821.95384.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> <4160BDCC.9060907@giantfir.com> <33004.130.94.161.146.1096867113.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <25DA75B7-1621-11D9-B208-000A95D9E32C@sonofhans.net> On Oct 3, 2004, at 10:18 PM, Josh Heumann wrote: > So, are there any objections to having two meetings this month? not from me; i think it's a fine idea. 'course i'll be out of town for the first one... r From publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com Mon Oct 4 11:52:14 2004 From: publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com (publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com) Date: Mon Oct 4 11:52:18 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting In-Reply-To: <25DA75B7-1621-11D9-B208-000A95D9E32C@sonofhans.net> Message-ID: <20041004165214.69862.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> --- Randall Hansen wrote: > On Oct 3, 2004, at 10:18 PM, Josh Heumann wrote: > > So, are there any objections to having two meetings this month? > > not from me; i think it's a fine idea. 'course i'll be out of town for > the first one... Well, theoretically you can skip the first one if you know OO Perl. In reality, even those who know OO Perl should probably go. Learning OO Perl from someone who is familiar with more robust OO systems is valuable. It's also sort of a precursor to my testing presentation the following week (though to be fair, I have a plan that should make things relatively painless regardless of whether or not you know OO Perl.) Cheers, Ovid ===== Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/indexdecency.htm Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ From raa at mailporter.net Mon Oct 4 19:37:05 2004 From: raa at mailporter.net (Roderick A. Anderson) Date: Mon Oct 4 19:37:11 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Siesta mailing list software Message-ID: <4161ECB1.2000503@mailporter.net> I hate doing this but I'm just about fit to be tied. This makes the third time I've tried to install Siesta and though I still have a few more steps to do I'm really concerned about all the dependencies I'm fighting my way through. So my question is has anyone besides Simon got this installed? Well let me qualify that a bit -- a box running a recent Redhat based distribution. I think the first two times I ran afoul of sendmail and got ticked off and quite trying. This time I'm trying postfix but I've never had to beat it into submission, if needed, when trying to run programs like you do with sendmail. So I'm hoping for a little encouragement if not flat-out a list of watch-outs or gotchas and their solutions. TIA, Rod -- --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Tue Oct 5 12:51:08 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Tue Oct 5 12:51:34 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meetings Message-ID: <50224.130.94.162.208.1096998668.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> For those of you still unclear as to the schedule of things this month, here you go! October Meetings TOMORROW NIGHT: October 6th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave Intro to OO Perl Randal Schwartz presents "perldoc perlboot" live, with references to animals, procreation, death, and eating. Learn about Perl's object system from the ground up. Familiarity with references, Perl code, and death is helpful. Sense of humor mandatory. Note the date! Randal's going to be out of town on the second Wednesday, which is our normal meeting day, so we're having it a week early. A WEEK FROM TOMORROW October 13th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave Testing with Ovid We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. At this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might even learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! From john at dpo.org Tue Oct 5 20:06:20 2004 From: john at dpo.org (John Springer) Date: Wed Oct 6 08:33:02 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] need help with text-to-pdf Message-ID: I'm looking for someone who would be willing to volunteer to help me (for the Kerry Oregon campaign) create a pdf file that looks like a form with perl variables filled in. We use perl all the time, but I've never used text-to-pdf and I'm too overloaded to learn a new animal right now. Any volunteers please contact me directly -- John Springer Tech Dude Democratic Party of Oregon john@dpo.org Ph: 503-224-8200 Cell: 503-329-7909 Fax:503-224-5335 Save the planet: elect Democrats! From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Mon Oct 11 12:28:41 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Mon Oct 11 12:28:47 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 Message-ID: <32843.130.94.161.146.1097515721.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> October 13th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave Testing with Ovid We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. At this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might even learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! From ptkwt at aracnet.com Mon Oct 11 15:19:49 2004 From: ptkwt at aracnet.com (Phil Tomson) Date: Mon Oct 11 15:19:52 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Ruby meeting invite Message-ID: If you came to last month's 'Ruby for Perl People' meeting, you might be interested in coming to tonight's PDX.rb meeting at FreeGeek. Michael Granger will give a presentation on his Arrow web application framework ( http://www.rubycrafters.com/projects/Arrow/ ). That's tonight @7PM at FreeGeek 1731 SE 10th Ave. Portland, OR Phil From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Wed Oct 13 12:46:25 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Wed Oct 13 12:46:30 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight Message-ID: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? October 13th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave Testing with Ovid We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. At this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might even learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! From dpool at hevanet.com Wed Oct 13 12:54:10 2004 From: dpool at hevanet.com (David Pool) Date: Wed Oct 13 12:56:17 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <416D6BC2.2090308@hevanet.com> Josh Heumann wrote: >So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been >suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do >people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? > Actually, OPB will be broadcasting the debates starting at 9:00PM. I'd personally rather keep the Perl Mongers meeting where it is and catch the debates afterwards. David From kellert at ohsu.edu Wed Oct 13 13:03:12 2004 From: kellert at ohsu.edu (Thomas J Keller) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:03:35 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> You know, we only have elections every four years. This one is without a doubt critical, and the debates seem have been substantive and widely viewed. I vote to move the meeting to another night. Tom K. Tom Keller, Ph.D. http://www.ohsu.edu/research/core kellert@ohsu.edu 503-494-2442 On Oct 13, 2004, at 10:46 AM, Josh Heumann wrote: > So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been > suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do > people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? > > October 13th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave > > Testing with Ovid > > We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. > However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. > At > this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually > write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see > how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might > even > learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. > > Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! > > > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 1340 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/archives/pdx-pm-list/attachments/20041013/7cd4c255/attachment.bin From david at kineticode.com Wed Oct 13 13:04:54 2004 From: david at kineticode.com (David Wheeler) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:04:57 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <416D6BC2.2090308@hevanet.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> <416D6BC2.2090308@hevanet.com> Message-ID: <62B8C4A2-1D42-11D9-83E7-000A95B9602E@kineticode.com> On Oct 13, 2004, at 10:54 AM, David Pool wrote: > Actually, OPB will be broadcasting the debates starting at 9:00PM. I'd > personally rather keep the Perl Mongers meeting where it is and catch > the debates afterwards. Bah, that cuts into Lucky Lab time! Regards, David From cdawson at webiphany.com Wed Oct 13 06:14:27 2004 From: cdawson at webiphany.com (Chris Dawson) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:14:35 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <416D0E13.7090905@webiphany.com> I would prefer that we move the meeting to another night as well. I just can't stand to miss the opportunity to watch mud wrasslin' between two grown men. Chris Josh Heumann wrote: >So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been >suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do >people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? > >October 13th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave > >Testing with Ovid > >We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. >However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. At >this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually >write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see >how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might even >learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. > >Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! > > >_______________________________________________ >Pdx-pm-list mailing list >Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > > From publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com Wed Oct 13 13:16:43 2004 From: publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com (publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:16:45 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> Message-ID: <20041013181643.78044.qmail@web60805.mail.yahoo.com> --- Thomas J Keller wrote: > You know, we only have elections every four years. This one is > without > a doubt critical, and the debates seem have been substantive and > widely > viewed. I vote to move the meeting to another night. Ordinarily, that's what I would think. Given that I'm the presenter, though, I thought it wouldn't be nice of me to suggest that. I'd much prefer to watch the debates, but I made a commitment so I'll stick with it if that's the consensus. However, if people want to move the meeting (or just have it as next month's regularly scheduled meeting), I'm perfectly fine with that. Politics is more important than Perl. Cheers, Ovid ===== Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/decency.html Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ From tex at off.org Wed Oct 13 13:32:12 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:32:15 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> Message-ID: <20041013183212.GX10530@gblx.net> On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 11:03:12AM -0700, Thomas J Keller wrote: > You know, we only have elections every four years. This one is > without a doubt critical, and the debates seem have been substantive > and widely viewed. I vote to move the meeting to another night. > I concur with the importance of the debates, but you haven't addressed the proposed alternative, which is to start the talks after the debate. For my part, starting at 8:00 would be just dandy. For that matter, we could bring in a boob tube and watch the debates before the talk. Austin From chromatic at wgz.org Wed Oct 13 13:32:53 2004 From: chromatic at wgz.org (chromatic) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:33:31 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <1097692373.8603.3.camel@localhost> On Wed, 2004-10-13 at 10:46, Josh Heumann wrote: > So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been > suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do > people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? Changing schedules twice in one month, with the second change on the day of the meeting, seems pretty confusing. -- c From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Wed Oct 13 13:35:04 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:35:07 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <20041013181643.78044.qmail@web60805.mail.yahoo.com> References: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> <20041013181643.78044.qmail@web60805.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <33014.130.94.161.146.1097692504.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Given the trend, and to get you all warmed up for voting when your mail-in ballots make it to your doorsteps, it's votin' time. http://pdx.pm.org/ The poll is on the right side of the page. Polls close around 5, so vote early. And no hacking the system, you code pirates. Josh > --- Thomas J Keller wrote: >> You know, we only have elections every four years. This one is >> without >> a doubt critical, and the debates seem have been substantive and >> widely >> viewed. I vote to move the meeting to another night. > > Ordinarily, that's what I would think. Given that I'm the presenter, > though, I thought it wouldn't be nice of me to suggest that. I'd much > prefer to watch the debates, but I made a commitment so I'll stick with > it if that's the consensus. However, if people want to move the > meeting (or just have it as next month's regularly scheduled meeting), > I'm perfectly fine with that. Politics is more important than Perl. > > Cheers, > Ovid > > ===== > Silence is Evil > http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/decency.html Ovid > http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web > Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list From tex at off.org Wed Oct 13 13:37:05 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:37:09 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33014.130.94.161.146.1097692504.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> <20041013181643.78044.qmail@web60805.mail.yahoo.com> <33014.130.94.161.146.1097692504.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <20041013183705.GA31625@gblx.net> On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 11:35:04AM -0700, Josh Heumann wrote: > Given the trend, and to get you all warmed up for voting when your mail-in > ballots make it to your doorsteps, it's votin' time. > > http://pdx.pm.org/ > > The poll is on the right side of the page. Polls close around 5, so vote > early. And no hacking the system, you code pirates. > Server error! The server encountered an internal error and was unable to complete your request. Error message: Premature end of script headers: ppp.cgi If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster Error 500 pdx.pm.org Wed 13 Oct 2004 11:37:22 AM PDT Apache/2.0.40 (Red Hat Linux) From publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com Wed Oct 13 13:43:41 2004 From: publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com (publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:43:43 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <20041013183212.GX10530@gblx.net> Message-ID: <20041013184341.15528.qmail@web60803.mail.yahoo.com> --- Austin Schutz wrote: > I concur with the importance of the debates, but you haven't > addressed the proposed alternative, which is to start the talks after > the debate. I can't do that. I have friends in from St. Louis and I'm supposed to get together with them after the meeting. Cheers, Ovid ===== Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/decency.html Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ From mikeraz at patch.com Wed Oct 13 13:46:39 2004 From: mikeraz at patch.com (Michael Rasmussen) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:46:41 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Message-ID: <20041013184639.GB32119@patch.com> On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 10:46:25AM -0700, Josh Heumann wrote: > So, the meeting tonight kind of conflicts with the debate. It's been > suggested that we move the start of the meeting back to 8pm. What do > people (specifically Ovid, who's giving the talk) feel about this? Part of the value of the debate is discussing it with the people in your life. I was conflicted about this meeting because it would make me miss watching the debate with my wife and talking it over with her. The option of having Ovid present next month supports both events. -- Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon Be appropriate && Follow your curiosity http://meme.patch.com/memes/BicycleRiding Get Fixed: http://www.dampfixie.org The fortune cookie says: Thrashing is just virtual crashing. From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Wed Oct 13 13:47:53 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:47:56 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <20041013183705.GA31625@gblx.net> References: <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> <20041013181643.78044.qmail@web60805.mail.yahoo.com> <33014.130.94.161.146.1097692504.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> <20041013183705.GA31625@gblx.net> Message-ID: <33201.130.94.161.146.1097693273.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Poll fixed, removed the option for moving the talk back tonight because Ovid can't make it. Josh > On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 11:35:04AM -0700, Josh Heumann wrote: >> Given the trend, and to get you all warmed up for voting when your >> mail-in ballots make it to your doorsteps, it's votin' time. >> >> http://pdx.pm.org/ >> >> The poll is on the right side of the page. Polls close around 5, so >> vote early. And no hacking the system, you code pirates. >> > > Server error! > > The server encountered an internal error and was unable to complete > your request. > > Error message: > Premature end of script headers: ppp.cgi > > If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster > > Error 500 > > pdx.pm.org > Wed 13 Oct 2004 11:37:22 AM PDT > Apache/2.0.40 (Red Hat Linux) From dpool at hevanet.com Wed Oct 13 13:52:49 2004 From: dpool at hevanet.com (David Pool) Date: Wed Oct 13 13:55:01 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <20041013183212.GX10530@gblx.net> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> <25A37D9E-1D42-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> <20041013183212.GX10530@gblx.net> Message-ID: <416D7981.6050600@hevanet.com> Austin Schutz wrote: >On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 11:03:12AM -0700, Thomas J Keller wrote: > > >>You know, we only have elections every four years. This one is >>without a doubt critical, and the debates seem have been substantive >>and widely viewed. I vote to move the meeting to another night. >> >> >> > > I concur with the importance of the debates, but you haven't >addressed the proposed alternative, which is to start the talks after the >debate. > Or conversly to watch the debates after the talks on channel 10 OPB at 9pm. d From merlyn at stonehenge.com Wed Oct 13 14:37:50 2004 From: merlyn at stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Date: Wed Oct 13 14:39:59 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <1097692373.8603.3.camel@localhost> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> <1097692373.8603.3.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <86oej6v27l.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> >>>>> "chromatic" == chromatic writes: chromatic> Changing schedules twice in one month, with the second change on the day chromatic> of the meeting, seems pretty confusing. I'm confused, and I'm not even going to be there. :) -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training! From pdxpm at punch.net Wed Oct 13 18:31:46 2004 From: pdxpm at punch.net (Tom Heady) Date: Wed Oct 13 18:32:28 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <86oej6v27l.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> References: <33286.130.94.161.146.1097689585.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com><1097692373.8603.3.camel@localhost> <86oej6v27l.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> Message-ID: <2418.208.20.213.2.1097710306.squirrel@mail.snapmedical.com> So is the meeting on or off? Tom >>>>>> "chromatic" == chromatic writes: > > chromatic> Changing schedules twice in one month, with the second change > on the day > chromatic> of the meeting, seems pretty confusing. > > I'm confused, and I'm not even going to be there. :) > > -- > Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 > 0095 > > Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. > See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl > training! > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > From publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com Wed Oct 13 18:45:11 2004 From: publiustemp-pdxpm at yahoo.com (publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com) Date: Wed Oct 13 18:45:13 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <2418.208.20.213.2.1097710306.squirrel@mail.snapmedical.com> Message-ID: <20041013234511.65624.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tom Heady wrote: > So is the meeting on or off? Well, the voting is supposed to continue until 5 PM, but looking at the votes now, I'm pretty sure the meeting is off as only one person voted to have the meeting today. Still, it's Josh's call. Cheers, Ovid ===== Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/decency.html Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ From kellert at ohsu.edu Wed Oct 13 19:09:07 2004 From: kellert at ohsu.edu (Thomas J Keller) Date: Wed Oct 13 19:09:34 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] vote Message-ID: <4454E496-1D75-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> Looks like we need at least one more person to vote to distinguish between later this month or the regularly scheduled time next month. Come on you undecideds vote! TK From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Wed Oct 13 19:20:29 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Wed Oct 13 19:20:32 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] vote In-Reply-To: <4454E496-1D75-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> References: <4454E496-1D75-11D9-AB08-0003930405E2@ohsu.edu> Message-ID: <33093.130.94.161.146.1097713229.squirrel@joshheumann.com> > Looks like we need at least one more person to vote to distinguish > between later this month or the regularly scheduled time next month. > Come on you undecideds vote! Well, the one thing that is clear is that we aren't having a meeting tonight. As for when we're having it, that's for the votes to decide. Any suggestions? We could have it next Wednesday, or as next month's meeting. Either one is fine with me... Josh From dennis at giantfir.com Wed Oct 13 19:31:27 2004 From: dennis at giantfir.com (Dennis McNulty) Date: Wed Oct 13 19:30:44 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] October Meeting #2 tonight In-Reply-To: <20041013234511.65624.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041013234511.65624.qmail@web60808.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <416DC8DF.6080509@giantfir.com> Better late than never for voting. I work for an outfit with the world's most paranoid IT staff, so I can't view PDXPM messages until I get home. I 'll raise my hand for plan A, 4 weeks late for Ovid's talk. - Dennis McNulty ================================================================ publiustemp-pdxpm@yahoo.com wrote: >--- Tom Heady wrote: > > > >>So is the meeting on or off? >> >> > >Well, the voting is supposed to continue until 5 PM, but looking at the >votes now, I'm pretty sure the meeting is off as only one person voted >to have the meeting today. > >Still, it's Josh's call. > >Cheers, >Ovid > >===== >Silence is Evil http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/philosophy/decency.html >Ovid http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=17000 >Web Programming with Perl http://users.easystreet.com/ovid/cgi_course/ >_______________________________________________ >Pdx-pm-list mailing list >Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > > > > From mikeraz at patch.com Mon Oct 18 13:59:17 2004 From: mikeraz at patch.com (Michael Rasmussen) Date: Mon Oct 18 13:59:21 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Single purpose apps Message-ID: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> This bit from a /. interview with Rob Pike 8) One tool for one job? - by sczimme Given the nature of current operating systems and applications, do you think the idea of "one tool doing one job well" has been abandoned? If so, do you think a return to this model would help bring some innovation back to software development? (It's easier to toss a small, single-purpose app and start over than it is to toss a large, feature-laden app and start over.) Pike: Those days are dead and gone and the eulogy was delivered by Perl. The next question is a goodie too: 9) Emacs or Vi? - by Neil Blender Pike: N... you'll have to visit and read the answer. http://interviews.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/10/18/1153211&mode=nocomment -- Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon Be appropriate && Follow your curiosity http://meme.patch.com/memes/BicycleRiding Get Fixed: http://www.dampfixie.org The fortune cookie says: Blessed is he who expects nothing, for he shall never be disappointed. -- Alexander Pope From almeria at earthlink.net Mon Oct 18 19:07:04 2004 From: almeria at earthlink.net (Rafael Almeria) Date: Mon Oct 18 19:07:03 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Single purpose apps In-Reply-To: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> References: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> Message-ID: > Pike: > Those days are dead and gone and the eulogy was delivered by Perl. Odd that in the previous question he didn't mention Perl as a language that he used. From darthsmily at verizon.net Wed Oct 20 02:09:46 2004 From: darthsmily at verizon.net (darthsmily) Date: Wed Oct 20 02:07:01 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Single purpose apps In-Reply-To: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> References: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> Message-ID: <41760F3A.7020203@verizon.net> "Those days are dead and gone and the eulogy was delivered by Perl." in one line..with a great many leaning matchsticks. I actually disagree with him,One day they will arise like a zombie process.... Bwahahaha. sorry, got a little Holloweenie.... heh. All work and no sleep make darthsmily go something something... Michael Rasmussen wrote: >This bit from a /. interview with Rob Pike > > >8) One tool for one job? - by sczimme >Given the nature of current operating systems and applications, do you >think the idea of "one tool doing one job well" has been abandoned? If >so, do you think a return to this model would help bring some innovation >back to software development? > >(It's easier to toss a small, single-purpose app and start over than it >is to toss a large, feature-laden app and start over.) > >Pike: >Those days are dead and gone and the eulogy was delivered by Perl. > >The next question is a goodie too: > >9) Emacs or Vi? - by Neil Blender > >Pike: > >N... you'll have to visit and read the answer. > >http://interviews.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/10/18/1153211&mode=nocomment > > > From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Wed Oct 20 11:17:48 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Wed Oct 20 11:17:57 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] [Fwd: [pm_groups] Pre-announcement: Dutch Perl Workshop] Message-ID: <43144.130.94.160.138.1098289068.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [pm_groups] Pre-announcement: Dutch Perl Workshop From: Mark Overmeer Date: Wed, October 20, 2004 8:41 am To: pm_groups@pm.org Hi Mongers, Just to allocate a date in your schedule: the second Dutch Perl Workshop will take place on Friday 25 Feb 2005 (the day before FOSDEM). At least 80% of the talks will be in Dutch. The real, public announcement will follow in a few weeks on the Amsterdam.pm list. -- MarkOv ------------------------------------------------------------------------ drs Mark A.C.J. Overmeer MARKOV Solutions Mark@Overmeer.net solutions@overmeer.net http://Mark.Overmeer.net http://solutions.overmeer.net -- Request pm.org Technical Support via support@pm.org pm_groups mailing list pm_groups@mail.pm.org http://www.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pm_groups From dpool at hevanet.com Wed Oct 20 16:47:34 2004 From: dpool at hevanet.com (David Pool) Date: Wed Oct 20 16:50:35 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Prisoner's Dilemma Contest Message-ID: <4176DCF6.7060301@hevanet.com> A friend of mine, Jamie McCarthy is running a prisoner's dilemma contest using Perl. The details are here: http://dilemma.mccarthy.vg/article.pl?sid=04/10/17/1846214 Jamie is actually one of the guys who codes Slashcode. In fact, the Prisoner's Dilemma is run as a Slash Plug-in I'm pretty sure. He lays out the process of writing the Perl to create an entry into the tournament. Prisoner's Dilemma is to Game Theory what rat mazes were to behavioral psychology. Interesting stuff, I hope some of you consider putting together an entry. David Pool Naked Ape Consulting www.naked-ape.com From randall at sonofhans.net Wed Oct 20 18:22:39 2004 From: randall at sonofhans.net (Randall Hansen) Date: Wed Oct 20 18:22:53 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] filewise (not linewise) in-place editing? Message-ID: folks ~ i've just needed to munge a group of files to change and concatenate data on several lines into one line. usually i do something like: perl -pi -e 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ... this wouldn't work, since -p reads input files linewise. i wrote a little script to solve my problem, it resets $/ and sucks the whole file into a variable, munges it, and writes it. is there a way to do this in a one-liner, similar to the above*? thanks, r and not including "./munge_in_place.pl 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ..." ;) From ken at cgi101.com Thu Oct 21 03:20:59 2004 From: ken at cgi101.com (Ken Brush) Date: Thu Oct 21 03:19:03 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] filewise (not linewise) in-place editing? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200410210121.00116.ken@cgi101.com> On Wednesday 20 October 2004 16:22, Randall Hansen wrote: > folks ~ > > i've just needed to munge a group of files to change and concatenate > data on several lines into one line. usually i do something like: > > perl -pi -e 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ... > > this wouldn't work, since -p reads input files linewise. > > i wrote a little script to solve my problem, it resets $/ and sucks the > whole file into a variable, munges it, and writes it. is there a way > to do this in a one-liner, similar to the above*? You mean like this? perl -pi -e 's/zope/foo/g;s/\n/ /' perf.txt or did you mean something more complex? -Ken From ben.prew at gmail.com Thu Oct 21 10:10:52 2004 From: ben.prew at gmail.com (Ben Prew) Date: Thu Oct 21 10:10:55 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] filewise (not linewise) in-place editing? In-Reply-To: <200410210121.00116.ken@cgi101.com> References: <200410210121.00116.ken@cgi101.com> Message-ID: <24f4b2e804102108105f9d0761@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 21 Oct 2004 01:20:59 -0700, Ken Brush wrote: > On Wednesday 20 October 2004 16:22, Randall Hansen wrote: > > folks ~ > > > > i've just needed to munge a group of files to change and concatenate > > data on several lines into one line. usually i do something like: > > > > perl -pi -e 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ... > > > > this wouldn't work, since -p reads input files linewise. > > > > i wrote a little script to solve my problem, it resets $/ and sucks the > > whole file into a variable, munges it, and writes it. is there a way > > to do this in a one-liner, similar to the above*? > > > You mean like this? > > perl -pi -e 's/zope/foo/g;s/\n/ /' perf.txt > > or did you mean something more complex? > > -Ken I got the impression from Randall that he was looking to combine the lines together and then attempt to execute the replacement operator (s//). Given the case mentioned above, I would probably do something like: perl -0e 'my $line = <>;$line =~ s/\n//g; $line =~ s/The quick/The not so quick/; print $line;' words or: perl -0pi -e 's/\n//g; s/The quick/The not so quick/' words (if you want to do in-place editing) where words contains something like: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. In this case, the -0 operator allows you to specify the line-ending operator (using an octal number), and if you leave it blank it defaults to null. But, you have to remember to strip the \n characters after reading the line. In either case, I hope that helps. > > > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- Ben Prew ben.prew@gmail.com From schwern at pobox.com Mon Oct 18 10:59:58 2004 From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern) Date: Thu Oct 21 17:23:26 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> Message-ID: <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> On Fri, Sep 24, 2004 at 03:11:14PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote: > That's too bad. ExtUtils::MakeMaker makes a makefile that correctly > mangles a "#! ... perl" into whatever is needed on that system. > So that says that Module::Build is a step backwards. Don't believe everything you read on the Internet! See Module::Build::fix_shebang_line(). He probably didn't tell M::B where to find the scripts. Unlike MakeMaker it doesn't have a default (which, to me, is the real step backwards). script_files An optional parameter specifying a set of files that should be installed as executable perl scripts when the module is installed. May be given as an array reference of the files, or as a hash reference whose keys are the files (and whose values will currently be ignored). The default is to install no script files - in other words, there is no default location where Module::Build will look for script files to install. -- Michael G Schwern schwern@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ Death was thought to be fatal. -- Craig A. Berry in From schwern at pobox.com Mon Oct 18 14:45:10 2004 From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern) Date: Thu Oct 21 17:24:49 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Single purpose apps In-Reply-To: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> References: <20041018185916.GA32735@patch.com> Message-ID: <20041018194510.GA363@windhund.local> On Mon, Oct 18, 2004 at 11:59:17AM -0700, Michael Rasmussen wrote: > 8) One tool for one job? - by sczimme > Given the nature of current operating systems and applications, do you > think the idea of "one tool doing one job well" has been abandoned? If > so, do you think a return to this model would help bring some innovation > back to software development? > > (It's easier to toss a small, single-purpose app and start over than it > is to toss a large, feature-laden app and start over.) > > Pike: > Those days are dead and gone and the eulogy was delivered by Perl. The irony of that being that Perl is often used to write small, single-purpose apps. Or, if you want to look at it in a more modern way, single-purpose modules which I'm feeling are replacing the niche of small apps. Regardless, I'm still not really sure what Pike means by that. -- Michael G Schwern schwern@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ Good tidings, my native American Indian friend! America will soon again be yours! Please accept 5th Avenue as an initial return! From schwern at pobox.com Wed Oct 20 19:13:17 2004 From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern) Date: Thu Oct 21 17:25:44 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] filewise (not linewise) in-place editing? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041021001317.GA11702@windhund.local> On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 04:22:39PM -0700, Randall Hansen wrote: > i've just needed to munge a group of files to change and concatenate > data on several lines into one line. usually i do something like: > > perl -pi -e 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ... > > this wouldn't work, since -p reads input files linewise. > > i wrote a little script to solve my problem, it resets $/ and sucks the > whole file into a variable, munges it, and writes it. is there a way > to do this in a one-liner, similar to the above*? perl -0777 -pi -e 's/foo/bar/g' file1 ... -- Michael G Schwern schwern@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ It's Tobacco time! From randall at sonofhans.net Thu Oct 21 17:33:26 2004 From: randall at sonofhans.net (Randall Hansen) Date: Thu Oct 21 17:33:36 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] filewise (not linewise) in-place editing? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <39578F18-23B1-11D9-B874-000A95D9E32C@sonofhans.net> On Oct 20, 2004, at 4:22 PM, Randall Hansen wrote: > i wrote a little script to solve my problem, it resets $/ and sucks > the whole file into a variable, munges it, and writes it. is there a > way to do this in a one-liner, similar to the above*? thanks to everyone who replied. the perl -0 trick is a new one to me, and just what i needed. r From merlyn at stonehenge.com Thu Oct 21 18:21:54 2004 From: merlyn at stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Date: Thu Oct 21 18:21:58 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> Message-ID: <861xfrslm5.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> >>>>> "Michael" == Michael G Schwern writes: Michael> He probably didn't tell M::B where to find the scripts. Unlike MakeMaker it Michael> doesn't have a default (which, to me, is the real step backwards). Seconded. -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training! From tex at off.org Thu Oct 21 21:48:25 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Thu Oct 21 21:48:28 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> Message-ID: <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> On Mon, Oct 18, 2004 at 11:59:58AM -0400, Michael G Schwern wrote: > On Fri, Sep 24, 2004 at 03:11:14PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote: > > That's too bad. ExtUtils::MakeMaker makes a makefile that correctly > > mangles a "#! ... perl" into whatever is needed on that system. > > So that says that Module::Build is a step backwards. > > Don't believe everything you read on the Internet! > See Module::Build::fix_shebang_line(). > > He probably didn't tell M::B where to find the scripts. Unlike MakeMaker it > doesn't have a default (which, to me, is the real step backwards). Actually I did tell it where to find the scripts. Here's the root of my problem: tex@peace:~/tmp> perldoc Module::Build | grep -i shebang tex@peace:~/tmp> No, I didn't take the time to root around the source code to look for interesting subs. But I probably should. I'd like to contribute something to such a critical part of Perl, and docs are always helpful. Austin From david at kineticode.com Thu Oct 21 23:36:46 2004 From: david at kineticode.com (David Wheeler) Date: Thu Oct 21 23:36:47 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> Message-ID: On Oct 21, 2004, at 7:48 PM, Austin Schutz wrote: > tex@peace:~/tmp> perldoc Module::Build | grep -i shebang > tex@peace:~/tmp> > > No, I didn't take the time to root around the source code to look for > interesting subs. But I probably should. I'd like to contribute > something > to such a critical part of Perl, and docs are always helpful. Try perldoc Module::Build | grep -i script Regards, David From tex at off.org Fri Oct 22 02:23:58 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Fri Oct 22 02:24:06 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> Message-ID: <20041022072358.GQ17425@gblx.net> On Thu, Oct 21, 2004 at 09:36:46PM -0700, David Wheeler wrote: > On Oct 21, 2004, at 7:48 PM, Austin Schutz wrote: > > >tex@peace:~/tmp> perldoc Module::Build | grep -i shebang > >tex@peace:~/tmp> > > > > No, I didn't take the time to root around the source code to look for > >interesting subs. But I probably should. I'd like to contribute > >something > >to such a critical part of Perl, and docs are always helpful. > > Try > > perldoc Module::Build | grep -i script > > Regards, > > David I'm not sure if you are intentionally flaming me or you're just inadvertantly insulting my intelligence, however neither sentiment is very appreciated. I did end up making it work, after perusing the code. It is necessary to have the top line of your script begin with #! in order for the replacement to be done. Furthermore the install script isn't smart enough to automatically know which files it has installed, so if you make changes (as for testing) to the script in question you have to uninstall the just installed version in order to see changes made. That _is_ documented, but is unintuitive behavior that I initially missed. Austin From johnl at johnlabovitz.com Fri Oct 22 10:13:47 2004 From: johnl at johnlabovitz.com (John Labovitz) Date: Fri Oct 22 10:13:50 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Fwd: talks on Linux, Google Message-ID: Not specifically Perl-related, but I thought others here might be interested in these two talks. Unfortunately, I will be out of town. Begin forwarded message: > From: John Sechrest > Date: October 21, 2004 9:38:43 PM PDT > To: lug@peak.org, sao-corvallis@peak.org > Subject: [sao] Monday, Monday.... Important info > > > This monday Oct 25th, there are two things going on that > are very interesting. > > > First we have > > http://eecs.oregonstate.edu/graduate/colloquium/ > > the OSU ECE colloquium featuring: > > * Greg Kroah-Hartman > * Linux Kernel maintainer > * IBM > * Portland, OR > > * Monday > * October 25 > * 4:00 - 4:50 PM > * Covell 216 > > > Secondly, we have: > http://groups.engr.oregonstate.edu/acm/index.php/Main/GoogleSpeaker > > Google: A Computer Scientist's Playground > > * Orkut Buyukkokten, Software Engineer > * 6:30pm - 8:00pm > * Monday, October 25, 2004 > * Owen 102 > > Search is one of the most important applications used on the > internet, but it also poses some of the most interesting challenges > in computer science. Providing high-quality search requires > understanding across a wide range of computer science disciplines, > from lower-level systems issues like computer architecture and > distributed systems to applied areas like information retrieval, > machine learning, data mining, and user interface design. In this > talk I'll describe some of the challenges in these areas, discuss > some of the interesting applications related to search that Google > has developed over the past few years, and I'll highlight some of the > behind-the-scenes pieces of infrastructure that we've built in order > to operate Google's services. Along the way, I'll share some > interesting observations derived from Google's web data. > > > ------ > > I think that both of these are worth attending. I hope > that the short notice does not prevent anyone for attending. > > > > > -- > John Sechrest . Helping people use > . computers and the Internet > . more effectively > . > . Internet: sechrest@peak.org > . > . > http://www.peak.org/~sechrest > > -- John Labovitz Consulting, LLC http://mac.johnlabovitz.com johnl@johnlabovitz.com AIM/iChat: jslabovitz +1 503.949.3492 From ben.prew at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 11:08:01 2004 From: ben.prew at gmail.com (Ben Prew) Date: Fri Oct 22 11:08:06 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <20041022072358.GQ17425@gblx.net> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> <20041022072358.GQ17425@gblx.net> Message-ID: <24f4b2e80410220908435f06ad@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 00:23:58 -0700, Austin Schutz wrote: > > > > Try > > > > perldoc Module::Build | grep -i script > > > > Regards, > > > > David > > I'm not sure if you are intentionally flaming me or you're just > inadvertantly insulting my intelligence, however neither sentiment is very > appreciated. > > I did end up making it work, after perusing the code. It is necessary > to have the top line of your script begin with #! in order for the replacement > to be done. Furthermore the install script isn't smart enough to automatically > know which files it has installed, so if you make changes (as for testing) > to the script in question you have to uninstall the just installed version in > order to see changes made. That _is_ documented, but is unintuitive behavior > that I initially missed. perhaps he meant: perldoc -m Module::Build |grep -i shebang Although I can't imagine it would have been very useful. In either case, I think its about time Perl started allowing people to install modules under Windows without downloading your own c compiler and make program. (And don't try to tell me Activestate does it, bleh). The best thing I have seen so far is PAR (par.perl.org), but it still requires that the maintainer build the par file under the target platforms (so the XS code can be correctly stored or generated, I'm not sure which) Good luck and I'd like to know how it turns out. > > Austin > > > _______________________________________________ > Pdx-pm-list mailing list > Pdx-pm-list@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-pm-list > -- Ben Prew ben.prew@gmail.com From perl-pm at joshheumann.com Fri Oct 22 12:18:11 2004 From: perl-pm at joshheumann.com (Josh Heumann) Date: Fri Oct 22 12:18:14 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] November Meeting Message-ID: <33456.130.94.161.146.1098465491.squirrel@www.joshheumann.com> Ovid's talk has been moved to November: November 10th, 2004 6:30pm at Free Geek, 1741 SE 10th Ave Testing with Ovid We hear a lot about testing, including testimonials, talks, rants, etc. However, the biggest obstacle to testing is taking those first steps. At this meeting, Ovid (that's me) will sit down at his laptop and actually write a module, from scratch, using test driven development. You'll see how tests work, how they're applied in the real world and you might even learn a thing or two even if you're already comfortable with testing. Afterwards, as always, beer at the Lucky Lab! From tex at off.org Fri Oct 22 13:00:27 2004 From: tex at off.org (Austin Schutz) Date: Fri Oct 22 13:00:35 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <24f4b2e80410220908435f06ad@mail.gmail.com> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> <20041022072358.GQ17425@gblx.net> <24f4b2e80410220908435f06ad@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041022180027.GS17425@gblx.net> > perhaps he meant: > > perldoc -m Module::Build |grep -i shebang > > Although I can't imagine it would have been very useful. In either > case, I think its about time Perl started allowing people to install > modules under Windows without downloading your own c compiler and make > program. (And don't try to tell me Activestate does it, bleh). The > best thing I have seen so far is PAR (par.perl.org), but it still > requires that the maintainer build the par file under the target > platforms (so the XS code can be correctly stored or generated, I'm > not sure which) > > Good luck and I'd like to know how it turns out. > In my case I've made it work by using M::B for perl libraries, autoconf for everything else - which in this case is a hodgepodge of sh, expect, and perl scripts. This works reasonably well, and is the same approach taken by some other packages such as ImageMagick. But then, my target is specifically unix systems, so I don't have to worry about the windows case. Austin From david at kineticode.com Fri Oct 22 13:06:06 2004 From: david at kineticode.com (David Wheeler) Date: Fri Oct 22 13:06:08 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Module::*, installing more than just modules? In-Reply-To: <20041022180027.GS17425@gblx.net> References: <20040924213621.GD21947@gblx.net> <863c17wc59.fsf@blue.stonehenge.com> <20041018155958.GA13046@windhund.local> <20041022024825.GP17425@gblx.net> <20041022072358.GQ17425@gblx.net> <24f4b2e80410220908435f06ad@mail.gmail.com> <20041022180027.GS17425@gblx.net> Message-ID: <0B85AB11-2455-11D9-BB7B-000A95B9602E@kineticode.com> On Oct 22, 2004, at 11:00 AM, Austin Schutz wrote: > In my case I've made it work by using M::B for perl libraries, > autoconf for everything else - which in this case is a hodgepodge of > sh, > expect, and perl scripts. This works reasonably well, and is the same > approach taken by some other packages such as ImageMagick. > But then, my target is specifically unix systems, so I don't have > to worry about the windows case. I strongly recommend that you subscribe to the Module::Build mail list and post your comments there. Ken is very responsive, and has a high priority on making M::B do the right thing. http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=45731 Regards, David From raa at mailporter.net Fri Oct 22 20:12:28 2004 From: raa at mailporter.net (Roderick A. Anderson) Date: Fri Oct 22 20:12:34 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Windows Timezone offset Message-ID: <4179AFFC.70709@mailporter.net> Anyone know how to determine the timezone offset (for use in e-mail Date: header) in Windows? Perl knows since localtime and gmtime return two different (string/scalar) values but I could not determine where it came from. %ENV doesn't have it and a search of the perldoc.com site didn't give me anything useful. Have a great week-end, Rod -- --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From schwern at pobox.com Fri Oct 22 20:35:33 2004 From: schwern at pobox.com (Michael G Schwern) Date: Fri Oct 22 20:35:50 2004 Subject: [Pdx-pm] Windows Timezone offset In-Reply-To: <4179AFFC.70709@mailporter.net> References: <4179AFFC.70709@mailporter.net> Message-ID: <20041023013533.GC19910@windhund.local> On Fri, Oct 22, 2004 at 06:12:28PM -0700, Roderick A. Anderson wrote: > Anyone know how to determine the timezone offset (for use in e-mail > Date: header) in Windows? > > Perl knows since localtime and gmtime return two different > (string/scalar) values but I could not determine where it came from. > %ENV doesn't have it and a search of the perldoc.com site didn't give me > anything useful. Perl just calls the localtime() and gmtime() C functions and leaves them to do the magic. But since you have localtime and gmtime you can calcuate the offset easily. use Time::Local; # Convert localtime to # of seconds since epoch my $localtime = timelocal(localtime); # Get # of seconds different from GMT my $offset = $localtime - time; # Convert from seconds to hours. print $offset/(60 * 60); -- Michael G Schwern schwern@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ Do not try comedy at home! Milk & Cheese are advanced experts! Attempts at comedy can be dangerously unfunny!