From georgepw1 at metaart.org Wed Nov 6 22:51:50 2002 From: georgepw1 at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Invitation to Oakland.pm Message-ID: <200211062051.50168.georgepw1@metaart.org> Hi everyone, My name is George Woolley. I've been a Perl user and advocate since 1994. I like to build web sites. And I enjoy writing Perl programs, especially CGIs and programs to support my web sites. If you want to know more about me, my personal site is at http://www.metaart.org/george/ I recently started this Perl Mongers group, that is, Oakland.pm. Perl Mongers has provided us with web space and a mailing list. You are invited to get involved. The website gives a good picture of what I'm up to. You are invited to visit it at http://oakland.pm.org. You are invited to subscribe to the mailing list and contribute your ideas. You are also invited to discuss all things Perl and whatever. [The website provides a link to the page where you can subscribe.] You are also invited to e-mail me directly if you wish. [My e-mail is georgepw in the domain metaart.org.] Best wishes, George to oakland@mail.pm.org From georgepw at metaart.org Mon Nov 11 01:32:55 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Seeking Perl Advocate in Africa Message-ID: <200211102332.55292.georgepw@metaart.org> I am a squire of the Oakland Perl Mongers. I strive to make the world a little better and to, someday, become a knight. I am on a quest. To fulfill the last part of this quest I seek contact with a Perl advocate in Africa. Perhaps you are that person or can direct me to such a one. I request your aid in this. George of Oakland Perl Mongers http://oakland.pm.org/ (Oakland Perl Mongers home) http://www.metaart.org/george/ (my personal home) http://www.metaart.org/maca/perl/perl_allover.html (about my quest) to oakland@mail.pm.org From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 12 12:20:16 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy Message-ID: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to go drink beer. With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass (yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? Belden From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 12 18:48:06 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy In-Reply-To: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> References: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211121648.06448.george@metaart.org> Belden, a meeting would be great! Critical mass. yes, sez me! too. In the interest of being specific I propose: Place: The Coffee Mill, 3363 Grand Ave, not far from the Grand Lake Theatre Time: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 at 7:30pm (ending by 9:30) For me, the website suggests numerous topics: * Participant Profiles --> introductions * Meetings --> brain storm on * Learning --> a short tutorial * Perl Quests --> reports on But all of this is in the interest of being specific. I'm open to other times, places, etc. Comments? Additions? Counter-proposals? Best wishes, George On Tuesday 12 November 2002 10:20 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to > go drink beer. > > With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass > (yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? > > Belden > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 12 19:58:38 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy References: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> <200211121648.06448.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD1B1CE.40304@iii.com> George, Coffee Mill is new to me - sounds like fun. I'll have to check to make sure I'm available that night: left my pda at home, been feeling crippled all day long. Aargh. Introductions and deciding on meetings, &c. sounds good. Will confirm day/time tomorrow. Belden George Woolley wrote: > Belden, a meeting would be great! > Critical mass. yes, sez me! too. > > In the interest of being specific I propose: > > Place: The Coffee Mill, 3363 Grand Ave, not far from the Grand Lake Theatre > Time: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 at 7:30pm (ending by 9:30) > > For me, the website suggests numerous topics: > * Participant Profiles --> introductions > * Meetings --> brain storm on > * Learning --> a short tutorial > * Perl Quests --> reports on > > But all of this is in the interest of being specific. > I'm open to other times, places, etc. > > Comments? Additions? > Counter-proposals? > > Best wishes, > George > > > > On Tuesday 12 November 2002 10:20 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > >>Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to >>go drink beer. >> >>With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass >>(yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? >> >>Belden >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Oakland mailing list >>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >> > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 12 20:55:22 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy In-Reply-To: <3DD1AE3E.7000508@iii.com> References: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> <200211121707.23319.george@metaart.org> <3DD1AE3E.7000508@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211121855.22622.george@metaart.org> Belden, Yeah, to bad about Belden, Inc. getting belden.com before you did. Oh, well! Sounds like you're getting a good opportunity to play with Perl. How did you get involved with Perl? Is there any subject you'd be willing to talk on briefly at a meeting? A tool you developed, a technique you like to use or whatever? Hm. How about Parse::RecDescent or POE (which you indicate you're trying to learn)? I'm glad you discovered Oakland.pm too. I'm not aware of any other Perl Mongers' groups in the East Bay besides Berkeley and Oakland. If at some point you wish to start an Emeryville.pm, I believe that's open. And Perl Mongers will supply web space and a mailing list. By the way, how did you find out about this group? (We're not on Perl Mongers' North America list yet.) Re having a participant profile, as you suggest, maybe later. Works for me. -- George On Tuesday 12 November 2002 5:43 pm, you wrote: > Hi George, > > Regarding a web presence, I haven't really seen the need > yet. Maybe if belden.com were available... > > As far as me - > > I've been programming in Perl for about 2 years now. My > current position involves writing tools to make life > better for the folks on the Helpdesk here at Innovative. > Standard stuff. I also get to fool around with our tables > that map Chinese characters. > > I'm currently trying to learn Parse::RecDescent and POE. > > As for listing me as a member with a profile, thanks for > asking, but for now I'll pass. Maybe in a month or three... > > Belden > > ps - I'm glad to have discovered Oakland.pm, as this saves > me the trouble of tracking down/starting Emeryville.pm > > George Woolley wrote: > > Belden, > > Thanks. This is great! > > > > I've responded to the meeting idea on the list. > > At the moment, I think it's basically you and me actually reading the > > posts. But since we've both declared that a critical mass has been > > reached, I thought it good to consider those who may be joining the list > > shortly. > > > > Anyway, I wondered: Could you say a bit about yourself? > > I also wondered Do you have a web presence? > > And would you feel comfortable with being listed as one of the > > participants? With a brief profile? > > > > Thanks again, > > George > > > > On Tuesday 12 November 2002 10:20 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > >>Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to > >>go drink beer. > >> > >>With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass > >>(yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? > >> > >>Belden > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>Oakland mailing list > >>Oakland@mail.pm.org > >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 12 21:06:02 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy In-Reply-To: <3DD1B1CE.40304@iii.com> References: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> <200211121648.06448.george@metaart.org> <3DD1B1CE.40304@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211121906.02377.george@metaart.org> Belden, OK, looking forward to hearing from you tomorrow. If we settle on the Coffee Mill and you wish directions, let me know. -- George On Tuesday 12 November 2002 5:58 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > George, Coffee Mill is new to me - sounds like fun. > > I'll have to check to make sure I'm available that > night: left my pda at home, been feeling crippled > all day long. Aargh. > > Introductions and deciding on meetings, &c. sounds good. > > Will confirm day/time tomorrow. > > Belden > > George Woolley wrote: > > Belden, a meeting would be great! > > Critical mass. yes, sez me! too. > > > > In the interest of being specific I propose: > > > > Place: The Coffee Mill, 3363 Grand Ave, not far from the Grand Lake > > Theatre Time: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 at 7:30pm (ending by 9:30) > > > > For me, the website suggests numerous topics: > > * Participant Profiles --> introductions > > * Meetings --> brain storm on > > * Learning --> a short tutorial > > * Perl Quests --> reports on > > > > But all of this is in the interest of being specific. > > I'm open to other times, places, etc. > > > > Comments? Additions? > > Counter-proposals? > > > > Best wishes, > > George > > > > On Tuesday 12 November 2002 10:20 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > >>Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to > >>go drink beer. > >> > >>With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass > >>(yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? > >> > >>Belden > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>Oakland mailing list > >>Oakland@mail.pm.org > >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From blyman at iii.com Wed Nov 13 11:21:38 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] howdy References: <3DD14660.7000504@iii.com> <200211121648.06448.george@metaart.org> <3DD1B1CE.40304@iii.com> <200211121906.02377.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD28A22.50202@iii.com> George, 7:30 on the 19th at the Coffee Mill sounds good. I mapquested a set of directions last night; see you Tuesday. Belden George Woolley wrote: > Belden, > OK, looking forward to hearing from you tomorrow. > > If we settle on the Coffee Mill and you wish directions, let me know. > > -- George > > On Tuesday 12 November 2002 5:58 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > >>George, Coffee Mill is new to me - sounds like fun. >> >>I'll have to check to make sure I'm available that >>night: left my pda at home, been feeling crippled >>all day long. Aargh. >> >>Introductions and deciding on meetings, &c. sounds good. >> >>Will confirm day/time tomorrow. >> >>Belden >> >>George Woolley wrote: >> >>>Belden, a meeting would be great! >>>Critical mass. yes, sez me! too. >>> >>>In the interest of being specific I propose: >>> >>> Place: The Coffee Mill, 3363 Grand Ave, not far from the Grand Lake >>>Theatre Time: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 at 7:30pm (ending by 9:30) >>> >>>For me, the website suggests numerous topics: >>> * Participant Profiles --> introductions >>> * Meetings --> brain storm on >>> * Learning --> a short tutorial >>> * Perl Quests --> reports on >>> >>>But all of this is in the interest of being specific. >>>I'm open to other times, places, etc. >>> >>>Comments? Additions? >>>Counter-proposals? >>> >>>Best wishes, >>>George >>> >>>On Tuesday 12 November 2002 10:20 am, Belden Lyman wrote: >>> >>>>Two's company, three's a crowd, four's an excuse to >>>>go drink beer. >>>> >>>>With the addition of me, this list has hit critical mass >>>>(yes, sez me!). George, how about arranging a meeting? >>>> >>>>Belden >>>> >>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>Oakland mailing list >>>>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>>>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >>>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Oakland mailing list >>>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>Oakland mailing list >>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >> > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > From blyman at iii.com Wed Nov 13 11:23:53 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] reply-to Message-ID: <3DD28AA9.4000404@iii.com> George - messages sent to oakland@mail.pm.org should have the Reply-To header set to oakland@mail.pm.org. Otherwise, replying to a message sent to the list just replies to the sender: not to the list. Give it a shot: hit reply, and you'll see that it's replying to my e-mail address, when really it should reply to the list. $0.02 Belden From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 15:23:37 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Test Message: Please Ignore Message-ID: <200211131323.37838.george@metaart.org> From blyman at iii.com Wed Nov 13 15:38:54 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Test Message: Please Ignore References: <200211131323.37838.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD2C66E.6040209@iii.com> Reply-to working nicely, thanks George Woolley wrote: > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > From georgepw at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 15:51:28 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 7:30 Tu 19th at Coffee Mill Message-ID: <200211131351.28955.georgepw@metaart.org> See website for a little more detail. http://oakland.pm.org/ From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 15:42:24 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] reply-to In-Reply-To: <3DD28AA9.4000404@iii.com> References: <3DD28AA9.4000404@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211131342.24621.george@metaart.org> Belden, You are correct. When I've wanted to reply directly to the list (which is usually) I've been changing the To address. Annoying. Anyway, I changed the option that I believe governs this. That seems to be appropriate for now. If it turns out to cause problems later, it can be changed back. Hm. Why might I have any concern at all about this change? Well here' s what the entry for administering this option says. "Where are replies to list messages directed? Poster is strongly recommended for most mailing lists." The choices were Poster, This List and Explicit Address, with Poster being the default. When I set the list up originally I accepted the default for this item (and almost all other items too). I did one test and it looks like the change was successful. If not, let me know. -- George On Wednesday 13 November 2002 9:23 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > George - messages sent to oakland@mail.pm.org should > have the Reply-To header set to oakland@mail.pm.org. > > Otherwise, replying to a message sent to the list just > replies to the sender: not to the list. > > Give it a shot: hit reply, and you'll see that it's > replying to my e-mail address, when really it should > reply to the list. > > $0.02 > > Belden > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 16:53:56 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Test Message: Please Ignore In-Reply-To: <3DD2C66E.6040209@iii.com> References: <200211131323.37838.george@metaart.org> <3DD2C66E.6040209@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211131453.56909.george@metaart.org> Belden, You're welcome. Makes sense to me. -- George On Wednesday 13 November 2002 1:38 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > Reply-to working nicely, thanks > > George Woolley wrote: > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From georgepw at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 18:13:08 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Instant Talks Message-ID: <200211131613.08848.georgepw@metaart.org> In an off-list discussion with Belden, I wrote: "Some groups have had success with 5 minute talks. But as short as you like works for me. In fact how about Instant Talks. Examples might be: * "Use strict!" " "Perl rocks!" Or a long instant talk might be: * "Beware equals in conditionals!' Really, as short as you want. Just the right facial expression and intonation might add to such a talk. I can also see merit in a kind of punk rock approach: no expression and speak in a monotone. But my neice, who is an accomplished musician, tells me this is not so easy." I'd like to try having a place in our meetings for very short talks, including "Instant Talks". Anyone have other names for Instant talks? e.g. "Hello World Talks". -- George From blyman at iii.com Wed Nov 13 18:37:38 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Instant Talks References: <200211131613.08848.georgepw@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD2F052.90305@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > I'd like to try having a place in our meetings for very short talks, > including "Instant Talks". > Anyone have other names for Instant talks? > e.g. "Hello World Talks". > "Lightning Talks" is a Perl-community phrase for these types of rapid lectures. Good-natured heckling is not unknown during lightning talks. Or we could coin a neologism; blurps sounds good to me. It gets across the idea of a blurb, maybe some blabbing, and a mental *burp*. Belden From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 19:26:12 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Instant Talks In-Reply-To: <3DD2F052.90305@iii.com> References: <200211131613.08848.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD2F052.90305@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211131726.12578.george@metaart.org> On Wednesday 13 November 2002 4:37 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > I'd like to try having a place in our meetings for very short talks, > > including "Instant Talks". > > Anyone have other names for Instant talks? > > e.g. "Hello World Talks". > > "Lightning Talks" is a Perl-community phrase for these > types of rapid lectures. Good-natured heckling is not > unknown during lightning talks. > > Or we could coin a neologism; blurps sounds good to me. > It gets across the idea of a blurb, maybe some blabbing, > and a mental *burp*. > > Belden Yeah, I've read about "Lightning Talks", though I've never heard one. Given that it's already in use in the community, how about we use that as the agenda item. Given that it's fun to make up names and perhaps will encourage us not to feel restricted, how about we continue to make up names within the category. What name fits your talk well. Is it a blurp? Or what? -- George From georgepw at metaart.org Wed Nov 13 20:26:56 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions Message-ID: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> 1) re blurps; Is blurps the singular or the plural? If it's singular, what's the plural? 2) Is there a desire for a tutorial? on what? See under http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn for some possibilities. If there is such a desire, how long, max? -- George From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 14 10:30:11 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Instant Talks References: <200211131613.08848.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD2F052.90305@iii.com> <200211131726.12578.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD3CF93.1010609@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > > What name fits your talk well. > Is it a blurp? Or what? > I'll let the audience (you?) categorize it... From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 14 10:47:49 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions References: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD3D3B5.1040408@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > 1) re blurps; Is blurps the singular or the plural? > If it's singular, what's the plural? You know, I think this is a real shortcoming of "blurps" as a word (which, by the way, sounds plural to me)... nobody has any idea what it means. Of course, this could be a bonus, if you squint your eyes and turn your head sideways. > 2) Is there a desire for a tutorial? on what? > See under http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn for > some possibilities. If there is such a desire, how > long, max? Are we talking an online or in-person tutorial? For online tutorials, I advocate 0 pages, max. For in-person tutorials, I'll sit still as long as it takes for someone to teach me something; they'll probably get tired of talking well before then, though :) Belden From georgepw at metaart.org Thu Nov 14 11:11:50 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions In-Reply-To: <3DD3D3B5.1040408@iii.com> References: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD3D3B5.1040408@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211140911.50239.georgepw@metaart.org> Belden, On Thursday 14 November 2002 8:47 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > 1) re blurps; Is blurps the singular or the plural? > > If it's singular, what's the plural? > > You know, I think this is a real shortcoming of "blurps" > as a word (which, by the way, sounds plural to me)... > nobody has any idea what it means. Of course, this could > be a bonus, if you squint your eyes and turn your head > sideways. > Ok. blurp, blurps. I got it. > > 2) Is there a desire for a tutorial? on what? > > See under http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn for > > > > some possibilities. If there is such a desire, how > > long, max? > > Are we talking an online or in-person tutorial? > For online tutorials, I advocate 0 pages, max. > For in-person tutorials, I'll sit still as long as it > takes for someone to teach me something; they'll > probably get tired of talking well before then, though :) > > Belden > I was thinking in-person at the meeting. Does anything on the list at http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn interest you? -- George From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 14 11:46:13 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions References: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD3D3B5.1040408@iii.com> <200211140911.50239.georgepw@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD3E165.4010601@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: >>>2) Is there a desire for a tutorial? on what? >>> See under http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn for >>> >>> >> > some possibilities. If there is such a desire, how >> > long, max? >> >>Are we talking an online or in-person tutorial? >>For online tutorials, I advocate 0 pages, max. >>For in-person tutorials, I'll sit still as long as it >>takes for someone to teach me something; they'll >>probably get tired of talking well before then, though :) >> >> > I was thinking in-person at the meeting. > Does anything on the list at http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn > interest you? > Sure, any of the first 5 looks interesting. How to choose, how to choose... % perl -e '@r=qw/one_liners regexes hashes unix_filtering perl_filtering/;print $/,q/show me /,$r[int rand@r-1],$/' show me one_liners How apt :) Belden From george at metaart.org Thu Nov 14 15:39:00 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions In-Reply-To: <3DD3E165.4010601@iii.com> References: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> <200211140911.50239.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD3E165.4010601@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211141339.00482.george@metaart.org> On Thursday 14 November 2002 9:46 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > ... > > Does anything on the list at http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn > > interest you? > > Sure, any of the first 5 looks interesting. How to choose, > how to choose... > > % perl -e '@r=qw/one_liners regexes hashes unix_filtering > perl_filtering/;print $/,q/show me /,$r[int rand@r-1],$/' > > show me one_liners > > How apt :) > > Belden > Very nice one liner. And it works. But when I ran it I got show me unix_filtering That works well for me. Hey, we can do some one liner Lightning talks. Someone can do a deeper talk on one liners later. Maybe you. It sounds like UNIX filtering would work for you. Let me know if I'm wrong. -- George From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 14 16:30:00 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] 1st Meeting: 2 questions References: <200211131826.56383.georgepw@metaart.org> <200211140911.50239.georgepw@metaart.org> <3DD3E165.4010601@iii.com> <200211141339.00482.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD423E8.4010701@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > On Thursday 14 November 2002 9:46 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > >>George Woolley wrote: >> >>>... >>>Does anything on the list at http://oakland.pm.org/index.html#learn >>>interest you? >>> >>Sure, any of the first 5 looks interesting. How to choose, >>how to choose... >> >> % perl -e '@r=qw/one_liners regexes hashes unix_filtering >> perl_filtering/;print $/,q/show me /,$r[int rand@r-1],$/' >> >> show me one_liners >> >>How apt :) >> >>Belden >> >> > Very nice one liner. And it works. *whew* ! > But when I ran it I got > show me unix_filtering > > That works well for me. Unix filtering sounds good to me also. My point in sending you the one-liner was to let you randomly choose from the subset of topics that looked interesting to me. Of course, if you want to talk about one liners, run it until it tells you to talk about one liners. :) > > Hey, we can do some one liner Lightning talks. > Someone can do a deeper talk on one liners later. > Maybe you. > Okay, that sounds like fun; I'll keep track of the one-liners that I use over the next few weeks and see what I come up with that looks interesting. > It sounds like UNIX filtering would work for you. > Let me know if I'm wrong. > Not wrong, Unix filtering sounds great! Belden From georgepw at metaart.org Fri Nov 15 10:17:48 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Regular Meetings Message-ID: <200211150817.48361.georgepw@metaart.org> How about regular meetings each month time: 2nd Tuesday of each month 7:30-9:30 (max) next date: Tuesday, December 10 advantages: good day of the week, no known conflicts with related meetings Any thoughts? We can discuss this at our first meeting this Tuesday. From george at metaart.org Sun Nov 17 00:11:09 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] sf.pm Acknowledgement Message-ID: <200211162211.09391.george@metaart.org> Quinn Weaver, President of the San Francisco Perl Mongers has: 1) added Oakland.pm to their list of Bay Area Perl groups 2) invited me to announce our group on the sf.pm mailing list He says quite a few people come to sf.pm meetings from the East Bay. And he himself currently lives in Oakland. Anyway, I appreciate the former. And I think the later is quite gracious, as well as being very useful and most timely. So please be aware that sf.pm is treating us very well. And also, that we are making progress. -- George From george at metaart.org Sun Nov 17 00:24:59 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Linux/Unix? Message-ID: <200211162224.59488.george@metaart.org> Belden, It would be interesting and useful to know how much you have done with Linux/Unix. What OS do you use at home, on what platform? And at work? If Unix/Linux, what flavor? -- George From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 18 10:57:10 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Linux/Unix? References: <200211162224.59488.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD91BE6.2050605@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > > It would be interesting and useful to know > how much you have done with Linux/Unix. > Interesting, I can understand. Useful, how? > > What OS do you use at home, on what platform? > No fancy hardware: Intel, KMD chipsets. No fancy OSes either: /Windows (?!XP)/ and various Linux distros: some SuSE, more Slackware, even more RH. I've also monkeyed with the Big Names in Unix: AIX, Digital, and Solaris. From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 18 13:48:31 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Linux/Unix? In-Reply-To: <3DD91BE6.2050605@iii.com> References: <200211162224.59488.george@metaart.org> <3DD91BE6.2050605@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211181148.31737.george@metaart.org> Belden, Thanks for the info. And how is this info useful to me? An interesting question. (1) Well, I've found it's useful in presenting stuff like "filtering with UNIX utilities" to know the relevant background of the people I'm talking to. I'm getting a little head start for the meeting tomorrow. (2) Also there's another person on the mailing list who from time to time has problems in a Linux environment that might be solved using Perl. In helping him, it's good to know a bit about his environment because (a) sometimes the capability is already easily available there (b) then one has the option of using the environment to advantage in the suggested solution. I'd like to get him to ask his questions on the list. Now, that I know you have background in Linux, I can be more convincing in my suggestion that he do so. ============================== | Aside to Arden: Are you listening? | Note that Belden has background in both Perl and Linux. | Please consider asking questions | about your data munging needs on this list. Thanks. ============================== For me, that's useful. (3) I've found that knowing about people's backgrounds often turns out to be useful. Of course, a particular piece of information may never be used, or at least not in a specific identifiable way. But, even then, it's almost always interesting to me. -- George On Monday 18 November 2002 8:57 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > It would be interesting and useful to know > > how much you have done with Linux/Unix. > > Interesting, I can understand. Useful, how? > > > What OS do you use at home, on what platform? > > No fancy hardware: Intel, KMD chipsets. No fancy > OSes either: /Windows (?!XP)/ and various Linux > distros: some SuSE, more Slackware, even more RH. > > > I've also monkeyed with the Big Names in Unix: > AIX, Digital, and Solaris. From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 18 14:13:34 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] new members Message-ID: <3DD949EE.4040406@iii.com> I see that we have some new members, visible and invisible, on the list. In case you don't know - we're having our "First Ever Meeting, Ever" (or somesuch title, I suppose) tomorrow in Oakland. Details at http://oakland.pm.org - look up in the top-right corner of the page, to the right of the "Perl Mongers" gif. Belden -- perl -we 'warn "no I aint!\n" if $belden->isa(qw/perl_guru/)' Can't call method "isa" on an undefined value at -e line 1. ...Oh, great, now I'm an undefined value, eh?! From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 18 18:58:24 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] One-liners In-Reply-To: <3DD949EE.4040406@iii.com> References: <3DD949EE.4040406@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211181658.24937.george@metaart.org> Belden, You seem to have a knack for humorous one-liners. Hm, in a different context that would be redundant. Could you save them up? You could give them as "one-liners" when we have Lightning Talks. Maybe we'll have a separate web page for them too. -- George On Monday 18 November 2002 12:13 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: >... > Details at http://oakland.pm.org - look up in the top-right > corner of the page, to the right of the "Perl Mongers" gif. > > Belden From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 18 20:15:12 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] One-liners References: <3DD949EE.4040406@iii.com> <200211181658.24937.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DD99EB0.6020101@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > Belden, > You seem to have a knack for humorous one-liners. > Could you save them up? > I prefer to harvest them later :) perl -MIO::Socket -e'print$/;($s=IO::Socket::INET->new\ (PeerAddr=>"mail.pm.org:80"))||die(q/no socket/,$/);print\ $s "GET /pipermail/oakland.mbox/oakland.mbox\n";while(<$s>\ ){/^\s*>/||push@data,$_}$_=join q//,@data;print$1,$/,$/\ while /(perl -.*?)(?=\n\n)/gs' Of course, this will include everyone's one-liners, not just mine. (So far, however, the archives only contain one-liners from me.) > > You could give them as "one-liners" when we have Lightning Talks. > I'll describe this tomorrow via e-mail precisely so I don't have to try to explain it to anyone in person! Belden From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 18 23:17:37 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] One-liners In-Reply-To: <3DD99EB0.6020101@iii.com> References: <3DD949EE.4040406@iii.com> <200211181658.24937.george@metaart.org> <3DD99EB0.6020101@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211182117.37498.george@metaart.org> Belden, Works for me. -- George On Monday 18 November 2002 6:15 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: >... > > Could you save them up? > I prefer to harvest them later :) >... > Belden From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 21 18:52:57 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Oakland.pm - First meeting Message-ID: <3DDD7FE9.6030805@iii.com> Oakland.pm had our first meeting this past Tuesday, 19 November, along Grand Avenue in Oakland. When I say "along Grand Avenue", I mean just that: we met out on the street, and stood out there for about 45 minutes before deciding it would just be us 3. Attending were George Wooley (founder of Oakland.pm), Ken from Walnut Creek (sorry, Ken, I don't know your last name!), and me. We stood outside the Coffee Mill, waiting for you (yes, you!), and eventually meandered into a Starbuck's. George had a pretty lengthy to-do list for this first meeting, and we might've gotten to some of the agenda items were it not for never really pulling it out to begin with. (Ugh, I wrote that and have no clue what it means.) George was trying to pick a day/time of the month where there are no conflicting meetings. He's accounting for other area Perlmonger groups (sf.pm, Ber.pm, SanQuentin.pm) plus various Linux groups. We decided that the next meeting will take place on Tuesday, 10 December, starting at 7:30pm and going to about 9:30pm. So, with a next meeting time/date decided on, we figured that we'd meet on the second Tuesday of each month. Still, we need a better spot than an ad-hoc "hey, this place looks warm" location. Ideas, anyone? Belden From blyman at iii.com Thu Nov 21 18:54:29 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] announcement? Message-ID: <3DDD8045.10308@iii.com> George, I'm wondering whether/when you'll announce Oakland.pm to the world? You'd mentioned posting something on the other local Perlmonger lists - is that still in the works? Belden From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 22 02:04:28 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] State of the pm Message-ID: <200211220004.28091.george@metaart.org> State of the pm ============ This covers a lot, but by no means everything. Meetings ----------- First Meeting: Belden has posted about the trials and tribulations of our first meeting. >>> Thanks, Belden, for writing up and posting that. Well, we did meet. That's good. And there were three people (Belden, Ken and me=George) there. That's good. >>> Thanks Belden and Ken for coming and putting up with the problems. >>> Ken, if you see this, we'd love to know your last name. >>> And have you on the list. We learned a lot about each other. We learned some about other groups from Ken who has been to them all. And we did settle on a time for the next meeting, and a tenative time for future meetings in general. >>> Shall we say that 2nd Tuesday is settled? So there was progress at the meeting. Hey, and Belden even gave a lightning talk! But obviously we have to find a place to meet. Next Meeting: I've decided to have the next meeting at my place. I expect in time we'll find a better place, but I do have enough chairs and a room where I've held meetings before. See the website for the topics, directions, etc. >>> More topics? Future Meetings: I've got a list of places to consider, but I haven't started checking them out. Listings and Announcements ----------------------------------- Berkeley.pm List: I have requested that we be added to Berkeley's List of Related Groups. I have subscribed to their mailing list. I'd like to post something about us there, when I figure out what's appropriate. Monterey.pm Earlier, I communicated back and forth with the group leader of the Monterey.pm Monterey.pm is not yet formed. Nor do they have a list of related groups. They do not have a mailing list. I will communicate from time to time with the group leader about the basics of what goes on with us. San Francisco.pm List and Announcement: I requested we be added to San Francisco's List of Related Groups, and we are on it! I have not yet announced on the San Francisco List. I wanted to have the place settled for at least our next meeting before doing so. (Oh, and now we have a place for our next meeting.) I have subscribed to their mailing list. Silicon Valley.pm List Their list includes regular meeting time. I'll request we be added when the time is settled. I have subscribed to their mailing list. Sonoma.pm Announcement: The group leader said he would announce the formation of our group to his group via email. He's been very helpful. I tried to subscribe to their mailing list, but my request is being held for some reason. They don't have a list of related groups. ----- Ecovillage List: I plan to request them to list our meetings when we have a regular time and place. Linux Mafia List: I'll request a listing there when we have a regular place and time. I believe we'll then also show up on their Calendar which a lot of people use. Perl Mongers North American List: I've requested we be added to this list and followed up, but as yet we aren't on it. Perl Mongers does list our mailing list. (And they gave us web space and a mailing list too!) O'Reilly User Group Program: I learned about this from the Sonoma group leader. And I received an invitation for us to join from the contact for it at O'Reilly. But I think it would good to wait until we're a bit more established. There are some nice benefits, and I assume we get listed somewhere. Search Engine Listings: Try +Oakland +"Perl Mongers". I just tried on the 5 top search engines per my last evaluation. Here's how we came out: 1st on Google 6th on Excite (What's their problem?) 1st on AOL Search Teoma was not functioning. (Yuk!) 1st on Alta Vista Very good, though not surprising given the search. Still, not long ago we didn't show up at all. People -------- Well, we have * Belden: at first meeting, very active on mailing list * me * Ken: at first meeting. said he will join the mailing list. (I did give him a call, which he hasn't returned. And he hasn't joined the mailing list as yet. I hope he does!) * Dan P: had a conflict for first meeting. on mailing list, says he'll be at the next meeting. has major perl experience. >>> Dan, we'd love to hear from you on the list. * Arden: might come if we had day meetings. on mailing list. doesn't know Perl. is interested in learning. has textual problems, Perl would be most useful for. In addition: * I have a list of individuals to contact and leads to follow up. * The Listings above will help. >>> Anyone reading this, you are invited to get involved! Mailing List -------------- Well, it's up and functioning. I'm not aware of anyone posting but Belden and me. >>> Thanks, Belden. >>> If anyone else reads this, we'd love to hear from you. The communication through the mailing list works well as far as I'm concerned. Having looked at the archive some, I've changed my posts a little where I think it will make them easier to read in the archive without sacrificing the immediate communication. Doubtless we will learn some lessons here. >>> If anyone has any suggestions they think important, let me know. Belden made one earler, which was implemented. Website ---------- Well, it's also up. I keep improving it. Well, I think their improvements. >>> Comments, suggestions, anyone? Three of the most recent changes are: * added some detail for Local Related Groups * updated to show the next meeting * added directions to the next meeting. (Arg!) >>> Someone who owns a car, please check the directions. Please! At Last -------- Well, I think that covers the main things. >>> Let me know what's missing, etc. Sorry, if there are typos. It's late and I'm tired. -- George From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 22 02:08:22 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Oakland.pm - First meeting In-Reply-To: <3DDD7FE9.6030805@iii.com> References: <3DDD7FE9.6030805@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211220008.22444.george@metaart.org> Belden, Thanks for writing up what happened at the first meeting. -- George On Thursday 21 November 2002 4:52 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > Oakland.pm had our first meeting this past Tuesday, > 19 November, along Grand Avenue in Oakland. > > When I say "along Grand Avenue", I mean just that: we > met out on the street, and stood out there for about > 45 minutes before deciding it would just be us 3. > > Attending were George Wooley (founder of Oakland.pm), > Ken from Walnut Creek (sorry, Ken, I don't know your > last name!), and me. We stood outside the Coffee Mill, > waiting for you (yes, you!), and eventually meandered > into a Starbuck's. > > George had a pretty lengthy to-do list for this first > meeting, and we might've gotten to some of the agenda > items were it not for never really pulling it out to > begin with. (Ugh, I wrote that and have no clue what > it means.) > > George was trying to pick a day/time of the month > where there are no conflicting meetings. He's > accounting for other area Perlmonger groups (sf.pm, > Ber.pm, SanQuentin.pm) plus various Linux groups. > We decided that the next meeting will take place on > Tuesday, 10 December, starting at 7:30pm and going to > about 9:30pm. > > So, with a next meeting time/date decided on, we > figured that we'd meet on the second Tuesday of > each month. > > Still, we need a better spot than an ad-hoc "hey, this > place looks warm" location. Ideas, anyone? > > Belden From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 22 02:20:34 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] announcement? In-Reply-To: <3DDD8045.10308@iii.com> References: <3DDD8045.10308@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211220020.34305.george@metaart.org> Belden, The short answers for your two questions are: * Different times for different groups. * Yes! The long answer to both is in the State of the pm post I just made. It includes a section on Listings and Announcements. Let me know if you still have questions after looking at that. -- George On Thursday 21 November 2002 4:54 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > George, > > I'm wondering whether/when you'll announce Oakland.pm to > the world? You'd mentioned posting something on the other > local Perlmonger lists - is that still in the works? > > Belden From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 22 02:46:39 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:22 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Mongers North American List, we're on Message-ID: <200211220046.39165.george@metaart.org> All, I just checked. We've been added to the North American List. This gives us just a bit more credibility and exposure. Yay! Thanks to Perl Mongers and to Wayne Walker and Leon Brocard. -- George From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 22 21:39:19 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Future Meetings Message-ID: <200211221939.19714.george@metaart.org> Belden, Dan, Ken, Arden, and anyone else out there, Next Meeting: Our next meeting is set up for Tuesday, December 10th at my place. See the website for more detail. Future Meetings: In announcing and listing our group in various places I'd like to feel free to say: we meet at 7:30pm-9:30pm the 2nd Tuesday of each month at various locations. Any comments? Problems? Objections? I'd appreciate feedback on this. -- George From wwalker at broadq.com Sun Nov 24 17:34:47 2002 From: wwalker at broadq.com (Wayne Walker) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] testing, please ignore Message-ID: <20021124173447.N27270@broadq.com> Testing, Please ignore. -- Wayne Walker www.broadq.com :) Bringing digital video and audio to the living room And the "Wizard of Bill" says "Please ignore the crash behind the Windows." From cajun at cajuninc.com Sun Nov 24 21:32:38 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Hello Message-ID: <1038195158.8380.109.camel@moe> I joined the Oakland.pm list yesterday. My name is Mike Lewis. Currently, I work as a Network Engineer / Systems Administrator for a small company in Emeryville. I also have my own consulting business where I do computer and network support for a handful of small clients. I have no formal programming training although I have worked as a programmer. I've been 'tinkering' with Perl for about 3 years now. I did attend an "Introduction to Perl" class at UCB Extension a couple of years ago. I still consider myself very much a beginner at Perl. At home, I run 100% Linux. At work, I run Linux and unfortunately have to support Windows so I run Windows at work as well. My interest in Perl is how I can use Perl to make my life as System Admin simpler, whether that is analyzing log files, or massaging a database file. Thanks George for starting Oakland.pm. I'm looking forward to the next meeting of Oakland.pm and meeting each of the members. Thanks, Mike From georgepw at metaart.org Sun Nov 24 23:15:53 2002 From: georgepw at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Report on Participation Message-ID: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> Hi, All, We are a very small group, but we're definitely growing. Here's the number of people who've participated in various ways. People at Our First Meeting: 3 ... Thanks to Belden and Ken for putting up with the chaos. People Who've Posted on the Mailing List: 3 ... Thanks to Belden for his many many posts. ... Thanks to Mike for introducing himself on the list today. People Actually Subscribed To the Mailing List: 7 (excludes tests and duplicates) People Participating in any of the above Ways: 8 (I know the numbers aren't the point but, ...) I've exchanged personal emails or talked on the phone with everyone participating in any of the above ways. It's been most enjoyable and interesting. A Request Hey, if you haven't, how about posting to the mailing list? You could * introduce yourself * ask a question about Perl * make a suggestion about the group * do something else Hey, I'd be pleased if someone posted something like: "This is a post." If you like that idea feel free to change the wording. I promise to smile. :-) -- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 01:00:27 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Report on Participation In-Reply-To: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038207627.8378.114.camel@moe> Hi George. It's interesting to see the numbers of folks both in the meeting and on the list. I'm sure the numbers will grow on both of them. I would be very interested in hearing what others in the group hope to gain from Oakland.pm. What sort of backgrounds they have, etc. I'm excited to be getting in on the 'ground floor' of Oakland.pm. I'm hoping we can all benefit from each others experiences and knowledge. Mike On Sun, 2002-11-24 at 21:15, George Woolley wrote: > Hi, All, > We are a very small group, but we're definitely growing. > > Here's the number of people who've participated > in various ways. > > People at Our First Meeting: 3 > ... Thanks to Belden and Ken for putting up with the chaos. > People Who've Posted on the Mailing List: 3 > ... Thanks to Belden for his many many posts. > ... Thanks to Mike for introducing himself on the list today. > People Actually Subscribed To the Mailing List: 7 > (excludes tests and duplicates) > People Participating in any of the above Ways: 8 > > (I know the numbers aren't the point but, ...) > > I've exchanged personal emails or talked on the phone > with everyone participating in any of the above ways. > It's been most enjoyable and interesting. > > A Request > Hey, if you haven't, how about posting to the mailing list? > You could > * introduce yourself > * ask a question about Perl > * make a suggestion about the group > * do something else > Hey, I'd be pleased if someone posted something like: > "This is a post." > If you like that idea feel free to change the wording. > I promise to smile. :-) > -- George > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 02:01:29 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Report on Participation In-Reply-To: <1038207627.8378.114.camel@moe> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <1038207627.8378.114.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211250001.29178.george@metaart.org> Mike, We certainly are small. But when we started in late October, there was just me. We've grown a lot since then, and even since the first meeting. In response to your second paragraph: It's my wish and intention for us together to create a place where we can together: * learn more Perl * have fun * engage in Perl Quests As to my background, etc., for the short version see my "profile" under Participant Profiles on our website. For the long version, see my personal website. There's a link to it in my "profile". Any other responses to this paragraph? It is fun to be in at the beginning of Oakland.pm. Like you, I wish and intend that "we can all benefit from each others experiences and knowledge". We'll create that. Best wishes, George On Sunday 24 November 2002 11:00 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > Hi George. It's interesting to see the numbers of folks both in the > meeting and on the list. I'm sure the numbers will grow on both of them. > > I would be very interested in hearing what others in the group hope to > gain from Oakland.pm. What sort of backgrounds they have, etc. > > I'm excited to be getting in on the 'ground floor' of Oakland.pm. I'm > hoping we can all benefit from each others experiences and knowledge. > > Mike > > On Sun, 2002-11-24 at 21:15, George Woolley wrote: > > Hi, All, > > We are a very small group, but we're definitely growing. > > > > Here's the number of people who've participated > > in various ways. > > > > People at Our First Meeting: 3 > > ... Thanks to Belden and Ken for putting up with the chaos. > > People Who've Posted on the Mailing List: 3 > > ... Thanks to Belden for his many many posts. > > ... Thanks to Mike for introducing himself on the list today. > > People Actually Subscribed To the Mailing List: 7 > > (excludes tests and duplicates) > > People Participating in any of the above Ways: 8 > > > > (I know the numbers aren't the point but, ...) > > > > I've exchanged personal emails or talked on the phone > > with everyone participating in any of the above ways. > > It's been most enjoyable and interesting. > > > > A Request > > Hey, if you haven't, how about posting to the mailing list? > > You could > > * introduce yourself > > * ask a question about Perl > > * make a suggestion about the group > > * do something else > > Hey, I'd be pleased if someone posted something like: > > "This is a post." > > If you like that idea feel free to change the wording. > > I promise to smile. :-) > > -- George From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 25 12:34:06 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Report on Participation References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <1038207627.8378.114.camel@moe> Message-ID: <3DE26D1E.4000304@iii.com> First, George, thanks for the stats. It's good to know in such concrete terms that our membership is going up-up-up! Next, hi to Mike and all the other good folks out there in wonderland that are tuning in! Whether you're a first-time listener or a long-time caller (no such thing here; we're too new), we're glad you could join our little show today. Too much radio over the weekend, sorry. M. Lewis wrote: > > I'm excited to be getting in on the 'ground floor' of Oakland.pm. I'm > hoping we can all benefit from each others experiences and knowledge. > Well said. There are some pretty well-established monger groups out there (notably London.pm); it's neat to be the new kids in town. > > I would be very interested in hearing what others in the group hope to > gain from Oakland.pm. What sort of backgrounds they have, etc. > Mike > Ok - My name is Belden Lyman. I found out about Oakland.pm by reading the London.pm lists. I've been learning Perl for about 2 years now; my company, Innovative Interfaces (located in Emeryville, btw), sent me to a UC Extension Perl class a few years ago. I've been hooked ever since. Currently, I'm a Special Projects Engineer. I get to use Perl for a wide range of things: creating Chinese mapping tables; writing various telnet-based network agents; breaking/fixing/creating staff utilities. I forget most of what I've done, which is why I have to use perldoc so often. My big thing lately has been using pod to document my modules. Yeah, I know: you're blown away. ("This guy can type =pod\n=head1\n=cut\n?! Whoa!") Oh, and I live in Oakland, not too far from the Parkway. Belden From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 16:15:51 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Report on Participation In-Reply-To: <3DE26D1E.4000304@iii.com> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <1038207627.8378.114.camel@moe> <3DE26D1E.4000304@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211251415.51473.george@metaart.org> Belden, Glad you are back from your weekend of radio. You're welcome for the stats. We are small and flying "up-up-up". Thanks for responding to Mike's background question. That's 3 backgrounds on the mailing list. Anyone else? Best wishes -- George On Monday 25 November 2002 10:34 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > First, George, thanks for the stats. It's good to know in > such concrete terms that our membership is going up-up-up! > > Next, hi to Mike and all the other good folks out there in > wonderland that are tuning in! Whether you're a first-time > listener or a long-time caller (no such thing here; we're > too new), we're glad you could join our little show today. > > Too much radio over the weekend, sorry. > > M. Lewis wrote: > > I'm excited to be getting in on the 'ground floor' of Oakland.pm. I'm > > hoping we can all benefit from each others experiences and knowledge. > > Well said. There are some pretty well-established monger > groups out there (notably London.pm); it's neat to be the new > kids in town. > > > I would be very interested in hearing what others in the group hope to > > gain from Oakland.pm. What sort of backgrounds they have, etc. > > Mike > > Ok - > > My name is Belden Lyman. I found out about Oakland.pm by reading > the London.pm lists. I've been learning Perl for about 2 years now; > my company, Innovative Interfaces (located in Emeryville, btw), sent > me to a UC Extension Perl class a few years ago. I've been hooked > ever since. > > Currently, I'm a Special Projects Engineer. I get to use Perl for > a wide range of things: creating Chinese mapping tables; writing > various telnet-based network agents; breaking/fixing/creating staff > utilities. I forget most of what I've done, which is why I have to > use perldoc so often. > > My big thing lately has been using pod to document my modules. Yeah, > I know: you're blown away. ("This guy can type =pod\n=head1\n=cut\n?! > Whoa!") > > Oh, and I live in Oakland, not too far from the Parkway. > > Belden > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 16:51:39 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages Message-ID: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites around the world containing them? For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org The October 18 post looks like this to me: PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! where the ...s are the language characters of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. For example: Brasilia.pm at http://brasilia.pm.org For example: Malaga.pm at http://malaga.pm.org For example: Montreal.pm at http://montreal.pm.org -- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 17:02:38 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (cajun@cajuninc.com) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038265358.3de2ac0e9668e@rattler.cajuninc.com> If there is a Russian site that you'd like translated, let me know. My g/f can do that. Mike Quoting George Woolley : > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > around the world containing them? > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > where the ...s are the language characters > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > For example: Brasilia.pm at http://brasilia.pm.org > For example: Malaga.pm at http://malaga.pm.org > For example: Montreal.pm at http://montreal.pm.org > > -- George > > > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 25 17:33:02 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DE2B32E.3000206@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > around the world containing them? > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to French and Portuguese. > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > where the ...s are the language characters > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. I looked at the other websites and can follow them, mostly. George, why do you ask? From extasia at mindspring.com Mon Nov 25 17:45:31 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] (fwd) [sf-perl] Learning to Write CGI Applications with Perl #5 Message-ID: <20021125154531.B29233@new.gerasimov.net> ----- Forwarded message from David Nix ----- Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 09:33:25 -0800 Subject: [sf-perl] Learning to Write CGI Applications with Perl #5 From: David Nix To: , , Reply-To: sfpug@sf.pm.org Hello Folks, It's not to late to start Learning to write CGI apps with Perl! We held our first meeting last week and had a good turnout (three Daves and a Bob)! The topics this week are taint checking, PostgreSQL (or it's runted cousin MySQL), and web forms. Come join us if you can. -cheers, Dave Lets meet at the same place, in Berkeley, at the Valley Life Sciences Building (VLSB) room 2063 (see the links below in how to get to campus and then get to VLSB) at 8PM on Tuesday the 26th of November. VLSB is the large white concrete science building on the West side of campus (near Bart). It has a bunch of science gargoyles on the outside of the building. Inside is the science library and a replica of Tyrannosaurus Rex. If you can't get to room 2063 (there might be some lockdown issues). Meet at the T-Rex. http://ib.berkeley.edu/vlsb/VLSBmap.html (Campus map Valley Life Sciences) http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/museum/bayarea.html How to get to the Berkeley Campus (the museum is in the Valley Life Sciences building) http://www.cnr.berkeley.edu/consbio/symposium/directions.html (Another link on how to get to Valley Life Sciences) -- David Austin Nix, PhD University of California, Berkeley Department of Molecular and Cell Biology 371 LSA #3200 Berkeley, CA 94720-3200 510-642-6799 (lab) 510-643-0062 (fax) Nix@uclink.berkeley.edu -- ---------------------------------------- Old posts ---------------------------------------- Hello Folks, It's a go! Thanks for all the responses to my initial query about getting a group of folks together to teach ourselves how to write CGI applications with Perl. Making a web interface for ones Perl program is awesome and can really expand its usefulness to everyone. Moreover, being able to extract and use data from the web seems like an essential tool for any programmer (especially in bioinformatics!). For our initial session, lets meet next Tuesday (November 12th) on the University of California Berkeley Campus, at 8PM, in LSA (Life Sciences Addition- adjacent to the Eucalyptus Grove on the West End of Campus, near the Downtown Berkeley Bart Station. I'll send details later as to which room, how to get there, and how to get past the key card access.) We can change or alternate locations with SF if folks want. The book that was suggested to me is described below. It contains 14 real chapters, most of which are quite relevant, some of which not so depending on your interest. To not loose momentum I suggest covering three chapters per session, one session every other week for a total of 5 sessions over 10 weeks. We might want to skip some chapters (like click tracking, counters) and focus more time on others (like forms, mod_perl, databases, dynamic images, web e-mail etc). Here's a list of the chapters from the publishers website http://perlcgi-book.com/ 1. Perl, CGI, and This Book. 2. What You Should Know. 3. Using Your Environment. 4. Introduction to Web Forms. 5. Working with Cookies. 6. Access Counters. 7. Web Based File Uploading. 8. Tracking Clicks. 9. Using mod_perl. 10. Web-Based E-mail. 11. Introduction to DBI and Databases on the Web. 12. Tied Variables. 13. Embedding Perl in HTML with Mason. 14. Document Management via the Web. 15. Dynamically Manipulating Images. 16. RSS and XML. If you want to get involved with this experiment. (Don't feel intimidated, my knowledge of Perl, HTML, and computer stuff in general is very much that of a beginner. I've been working with Perl for only 3 months! So you won't be the only one asking na?ve questions! That's what this group is for. If you are a Perl master, your input would be greatly appreciated and most helpful!) Do the following: 1) Come to the 8pm Tuesday Nov 12 meeting at Cal (I'll work on getting a room and send details later) 2) Obtain "Writing CGI Applications with Perl," Meltzer and Michalski 2001 3) Work through Chapters 1-3 (Intro stuff, getting a web server running on your machine (Apache), security issues, etc. There aren't any exercises but I think these will be the hardest chapters since a lot of the configuration stuff is platform specific and isn't covered in the book. Have I left anything out? Spread the word! See you on the 12th. Cheers, Dave Hello Folks, I'd would like to get together a group of folks to meet say every other week to teach ourselves to write CGI scripts with Perl. I'm very much a beginning Perl programmer who would like to put some bioinformatics programs I've written on the web. I looked into books and a good one is "Writing CGI Applications with Perl," Meltzer and Michalski 2001 (see the review below). There are 14 or so chapters, with exercises, so one a week, two a session should get us through. $40 from Amazon http://s1.amazon.com/exec/varzea/ts/exchange-glance/Y01Y4306597Y5307062/qid= 1035839025/sr=1-2/102-6664323-9696144 Also, if you are familiar with this type of thing, I'd also appreciate having someone mentor the class so if we get jammed we'd have someone to call to help us out! :) You certainly don't have to attend but maybe be willing to take a call/ Email or two when all hell breaks loose! Any mentors? Anyone interested? I'd like to start ASAP. -cheers, Dave -- -- ==== Want to unsubscribe from this list? ==== Send mail with body "unsubscribe" to sfpug-request@sf.pm.org ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021125/f45591ea/attachment.bin From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 18:00:45 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <1038265358.3de2ac0e9668e@rattler.cajuninc.com> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <1038265358.3de2ac0e9668e@rattler.cajuninc.com> Message-ID: <200211251600.45071.george@metaart.org> Mike, Thanks. That might be interesting. Unfortunately, I"m not sure there is a Russian site. Perl Mongers lists a Shadrinsk.pm, but when I click the link to their site I get an error message. I've just emailed the contact. Anyway, thanks for the offer. --- George On Monday 25 November 2002 3:02 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > If there is a Russian site that you'd like translated, let me know. My g/f > can do that. > > Mike > > Quoting George Woolley : > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > around the world containing them? > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > where the ...s are the language characters > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > For example: Brasilia.pm at http://brasilia.pm.org > > For example: Malaga.pm at http://malaga.pm.org > > For example: Montreal.pm at http://montreal.pm.org > > > > -- George > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From blyman at iii.com Mon Nov 25 19:20:10 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me Message-ID: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> Perl, quite simply, can bite me. Just a moment ago, it did. (Ouch! Still smarts some.) I "uncovered a bug in perl", viz: % perl # perl in interactive mode for my $login (qw(blyman root daemon nobody)) { my $pwent = getpwnam( $login ); print $pwent ? "+ $login\n" : "- $login\n"; } __END__ + blyman - root <-- huh?! + daemon + nobody Coffee/beer/drink_of_your_choice is on me to the first person (except you, George [0] ) who can tell us why this isn't a bug in Perl. Here's a clue: this was my first time to use getpwnam(). Belden [0] - "except you, George" because this is a clever ruse to get someone else to post something on this list. Yes, I get subtlety points today. From extasia at mindspring.com Mon Nov 25 19:32:45 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com>; from blyman@iii.com on Mon, Nov 25, 2002 at 05:20:10PM -0800 References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> Message-ID: <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> Belden, At 2002/11/25/17:20 -0800 Belden Lyman wrote: > % perl > # perl in interactive mode > for my $login (qw(blyman root daemon nobody)) { > my $pwent = getpwnam( $login ); > print $pwent ? "+ $login\n" : "- $login\n"; > } > __END__ > + blyman > - root <-- huh?! > + daemon > + nobody > > Coffee/beer/drink_of_your_choice is on me to the first > person (except you, George [0] ) who can tell us why > this isn't a bug in Perl. Your doing the: $uid = getpwnam($name); invocation. root's uid is zero, which is false. You probably should test for defined() rather than truth. Did I win? :-) David -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021125/5423ab3b/attachment.bin From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 19:36:43 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (cajun@cajuninc.com) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <1038274603.3de2d02b98518@rattler.cajuninc.com> Rats.... David beat me to it.... Quoting David Alban : > Belden, > > At 2002/11/25/17:20 -0800 Belden Lyman wrote: > > % perl > > # perl in interactive mode > > for my $login (qw(blyman root daemon nobody)) { > > my $pwent = getpwnam( $login ); > > print $pwent ? "+ $login\n" : "- $login\n"; > > } > > __END__ > > + blyman > > - root <-- huh?! > > + daemon > > + nobody > > > > Coffee/beer/drink_of_your_choice is on me to the first > > person (except you, George [0] ) who can tell us why > > this isn't a bug in Perl. > > Your doing the: > > $uid = getpwnam($name); > > invocation. root's uid is zero, which is false. > > You probably should test for defined() rather than truth. > > Did I win? :-) > > David > -- > Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. > *** > Join us at sig-beer-west! > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html > Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From extasia at mindspring.com Mon Nov 25 19:39:41 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <1038274603.3de2d02b98518@rattler.cajuninc.com>; from cajun@cajuninc.com on Mon, Nov 25, 2002 at 05:36:43PM -0800 References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> <1038274603.3de2d02b98518@rattler.cajuninc.com> Message-ID: <20021125173941.F30199@new.gerasimov.net> At 2002/11/25/17:36 -0800 cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > Rats.... David beat me to it.... Hey, maybe we can have a little mini-sig-beer. :-) -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021125/e119f391/attachment.bin From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 19:40:37 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <3DE2B32E.3000206@iii.com> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <3DE2B32E.3000206@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> Belden, Kool! Why do I ask? Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, and all of which have to do with future contacts with PM groups around the world. (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all over" Quest, with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. I'd like to involve others in our group and I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I ignored because of my limited knowlege of different languages. (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors (or some such) to other Perl groups, many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French ambassador. He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every day. He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. He's definitely interested. Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: other Bay Area PM -- Ken US South -- Mike Corsica -- Arden France -- Arden Russia -- Mike Taiwan -- Belden Central America -- George South America -- Belden Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or country. (Or not to be one at all) I like that there are lots of areas not covered, so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. It's kool to know various languages, but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas which speak primarily English. Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, which includes the wonderful London.pm. Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. Best wishes, George P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > around the world containing them? > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > French and Portuguese. > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > where the ...s are the language characters > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > mostly. > > George, why do you ask? > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 19:48:50 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (cajun@cajuninc.com) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <3DE2B32E.3000206@iii.com> <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038275330.3de2d3026469d@rattler.cajuninc.com> George, you should edit your listing a bit. Russian - Mike's g/f Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f Mike Quoting George Woolley : > Belden, > Kool! > > Why do I ask? > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > and all of which have to do with future contacts > with PM groups around the world. > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all over" > Quest, > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > I'd like to involve others in our group and > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I ignored > because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French ambassador. > He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every day. > He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. > He's definitely interested. > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > US South -- Mike > > Corsica -- Arden > France -- Arden > Russia -- Mike > Taiwan -- Belden > > Central America -- George > South America -- Belden > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or country. > (Or not to be one at all) > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > It's kool to know various languages, > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > which speak primarily English. > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > Best wishes, > George > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > George Woolley wrote: > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > > around the world containing them? > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > > where the ...s are the language characters > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > mostly. > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 19:52:37 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (cajun@cajuninc.com) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <20021125173941.F30199@new.gerasimov.net> References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> <1038274603.3de2d02b98518@rattler.cajuninc.com> <20021125173941.F30199@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <1038275557.3de2d3e5cdaeb@rattler.cajuninc.com> Deal: my @beer= qw (good cold more); foreach (@beer){ print "$_ beer\n"; } Quoting David Alban : > At 2002/11/25/17:36 -0800 cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > Rats.... David beat me to it.... > > Hey, maybe we can have a little mini-sig-beer. :-) > > -- > Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. > *** > Join us at sig-beer-west! > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html > Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 19:59:07 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211251759.07399.george@metaart.org> On Monday 25 November 2002 5:20 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > ... this is a clever ruse > to get someone else to post something on this list. ... And, it elicited David A's first (and second) post. Thanks David, it's good to hear from you on the list. And Mike noticed and posted too. Very kool! From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 20:18:55 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <1038275330.3de2d3026469d@rattler.cajuninc.com> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> <1038275330.3de2d3026469d@rattler.cajuninc.com> Message-ID: <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> Mike, I hear you. Is your g/f willing to join the group and be Russian ambassador and Georgian ambasador? Does she have a name we are allowed to know? If she is willing to join the group that would be way kool! See http://marsneedswomen.pm.org for my sentiments on this. She doesn't need to get deep into perl, though it would be kool if she did Hello World or the like in Perl. Of course, if she likes Perl, ... Does this mean that you're OK with being ambasador to the US South? -- George P.S. The abbreviation g/f intrigues me. For reasons unknown, I had never encountered it before. How is it pronounced -- gif? For that matter how is .gif pronounced? On Monday 25 November 2002 5:48 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > George, you should edit your listing a bit. > > Russian - Mike's g/f > Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f > > Mike > > Quoting George Woolley : > > Belden, > > Kool! > > > > Why do I ask? > > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > > and all of which have to do with future contacts > > with PM groups around the world. > > > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all over" > > Quest, > > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > > I'd like to involve others in our group and > > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I ignored > > because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French ambassador. > > He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every day. > > He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. > > He's definitely interested. > > > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > > US South -- Mike > > > > Corsica -- Arden > > France -- Arden > > Russia -- Mike > > Taiwan -- Belden > > > > Central America -- George > > South America -- Belden > > > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or country. > > (Or not to be one at all) > > > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > > It's kool to know various languages, > > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > > which speak primarily English. > > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > > > Best wishes, > > George > > > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > > George Woolley wrote: > > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > > > around the world containing them? > > > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > > > where the ...s are the language characters > > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > > mostly. > > > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Oakland mailing list > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 21:41:36 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <1038275557.3de2d3e5cdaeb@rattler.cajuninc.com> References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173941.F30199@new.gerasimov.net> <1038275557.3de2d3e5cdaeb@rattler.cajuninc.com> Message-ID: <200211251941.36618.george@metaart.org> Hm, maybe you could add free to the list. -- George On Monday 25 November 2002 5:52 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > Deal: > > my @beer= qw (good cold more); > foreach (@beer){ > print "$_ beer\n"; > } > > Quoting David Alban : > > At 2002/11/25/17:36 -0800 cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > > Rats.... David beat me to it.... > > > > Hey, maybe we can have a little mini-sig-beer. :-) > > > > -- > > Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. > > *** > > Join us at sig-beer-west! > > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html > > Unix sysadmin available: > > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Mon Nov 25 22:33:21 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List Message-ID: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> Mike would like to create a Perl Basics Mailing List. Here's some snipets taken from our off-list discussion of his idea. (I view it as a Perl Quest, but I don't think we've talked about that.) Here's my shot of a description of the list: ============================================================== 1) Name: The Perl Basics Mailing List 2) Function: This is a place for asking and answering questions about Perl basics with the intent of mastering them, so that we may write more efficient, more understandable and more reliable Perl programs. Perl basics: (This would need to be defined, but certainly includes the basics of hashes and regular expressions which confuse a lot of people.) 3) Who for: This list is for beginners. It's also for anyone who wants to more deeply understand basics. One of the best ways to deepen one's understanding is to see the problems others have and help them get beyond those problems. No matter how advanced you are there is always more to grasp concerning basics. \=======================================================/ Mike is prepared to host this list: ======================================================= The mechanics of hosting the list isn't a problem. I have multiple servers here and can easily setup this or any other listserver in minutes. If the list grows too large, then bandwidth may be an issue. I don't know how big too big actually is though. \=======================================================/ Both and Mike and I would like to set this up for our group very soon. It might be expanded to include more people later. I think this is a great idea. Are you interested? Other thoughts? -- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Mon Nov 25 23:51:31 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <200211251941.36618.george@metaart.org> References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173941.F30199@new.gerasimov.net> <1038275557.3de2d3e5cdaeb@rattler.cajuninc.com> <200211251941.36618.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038289891.17578.4.camel@moe> My bad.... How could I have forgotten... On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 19:41, George Woolley wrote: > Hm, maybe you could add free to the list. -- George > > On Monday 25 November 2002 5:52 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > Deal: > > > > my @beer= qw (good cold more); > > foreach (@beer){ > > print "$_ beer\n"; > > } > > > > Quoting David Alban : > > > At 2002/11/25/17:36 -0800 cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > > > Rats.... David beat me to it.... > > > > > > Hey, maybe we can have a little mini-sig-beer. :-) > > > > > > -- > > > Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. > > > *** > > > Join us at sig-beer-west! > > > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html > > > Unix sysadmin available: > > > http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 00:23:47 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038291827.17578.14.camel@moe> Lay it all off on me huh George ? hehehe, that's ok. Looks like you and I may be the only die hard night owls... Else everyone else is parsing the idea..... M On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 20:33, George Woolley wrote: > Mike would like to create a Perl Basics Mailing List. > Here's some snipets taken from our off-list discussion of his idea. > (I view it as a Perl Quest, but I don't think we've talked about that.) > > Here's my shot of a description of the list: > ============================================================== > 1) Name: The Perl Basics Mailing List > 2) Function: This is a place for asking and answering questions > about Perl basics with the intent of mastering them, > so that we may write > more efficient, more understandable and more reliable Perl programs. > > Perl basics: (This would need to be defined, but certainly includes > the basics of hashes and regular expressions > which confuse a lot of people.) > 3) Who for: This list is for beginners. > It's also for anyone who wants to more deeply understand basics. > One of the best ways to deepen one's understanding is > to see the problems others have and help them get beyond > those problems. > No matter how advanced you are there is always more to grasp > concerning basics. > \=======================================================/ > > Mike is prepared to host this list: > ======================================================= > The mechanics of hosting the list isn't a problem. I have multiple servers > here and can easily setup this or any other listserver in > minutes. If the list grows too large, then bandwidth may be an issue. I > don't know how big too big actually is though. > \=======================================================/ > > Both and Mike and I would like to set this up > for our group very soon. > It might be expanded to include more people later. > > I think this is a great idea. > Are you interested? > Other thoughts? > -- George > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 00:27:07 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> <1038275330.3de2d3026469d@rattler.cajuninc.com> <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> Hmmm... not sure how willing she would be to join the group. She does have an interest in what I do, but not sure how deeply that interest runs. Her name is Tia. I'm sure she would translate anything in Russian or Georgian that we would need, unless maybe it was thousands of lines of code. Hmmm, is there a Russian version of Perl ? Probably a dumb question. Yes, I will be happy to be the Southern Ambassador to the group. I'll translate as required for the group.... M On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 18:18, George Woolley wrote: > Mike, > I hear you. > > Is your g/f willing to join the group > and be Russian ambassador and Georgian ambasador? > Does she have a name we are allowed to know? > If she is willing to join the group that would be way kool! > See http://marsneedswomen.pm.org for my sentiments on this. > She doesn't need to get deep into perl, > though it would be kool if she did Hello World or the like in Perl. > Of course, if she likes Perl, ... > > Does this mean that you're OK with being ambasador to the US South? > > -- George > > P.S. The abbreviation g/f intrigues me. > For reasons unknown, I had never encountered it before. > How is it pronounced -- gif? > For that matter how is .gif pronounced? > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 5:48 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > George, you should edit your listing a bit. > > > > Russian - Mike's g/f > > Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f > > > > Mike > > > > Quoting George Woolley : > > > Belden, > > > Kool! > > > > > > Why do I ask? > > > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > > > and all of which have to do with future contacts > > > with PM groups around the world. > > > > > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all over" > > > Quest, > > > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > > > I'd like to involve others in our group and > > > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I ignored > > > because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > > > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > > > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > > > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > > > > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French ambassador. > > > He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every day. > > > He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. > > > He's definitely interested. > > > > > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > > > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > > > > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > > > US South -- Mike > > > > > > Corsica -- Arden > > > France -- Arden > > > Russia -- Mike > > > Taiwan -- Belden > > > > > > Central America -- George > > > South America -- Belden > > > > > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or country. > > > (Or not to be one at all) > > > > > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > > > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > > > It's kool to know various languages, > > > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > > > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > > > which speak primarily English. > > > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > > > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > > > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > > > > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > George > > > > > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > > > George Woolley wrote: > > > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > > > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > > > > around the world containing them? > > > > > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > > > > where the ...s are the language characters > > > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > > > mostly. > > > > > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Oakland mailing list > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 01:01:22 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <1038291827.17578.14.camel@moe> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <1038291827.17578.14.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211252301.22277.george@metaart.org> All, OK. Let me try again. Mike and I would both like to start a Perl Basics Mailing List. Soon! Mike proposed the basic idea to me and we've been talking about it off-list. Anyone else interested? -- George On Monday 25 November 2002 10:23 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > Lay it all off on me huh George ? hehehe, that's ok. > > Looks like you and I may be the only die hard night owls... Else > everyone else is parsing the idea..... > > M > > On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 20:33, George Woolley wrote: > > Mike would like to create a Perl Basics Mailing List. > > Here's some snipets taken from our off-list discussion of his idea. > > (I view it as a Perl Quest, but I don't think we've talked about that.) > > > > Here's my shot of a description of the list: > > ============================================================== > > 1) Name: The Perl Basics Mailing List > > 2) Function: This is a place for asking and answering questions > > about Perl basics with the intent of mastering them, > > so that we may write > > more efficient, more understandable and more reliable Perl programs. > > > > Perl basics: (This would need to be defined, but certainly includes > > the basics of hashes and regular expressions > > which confuse a lot of people.) > > 3) Who for: This list is for beginners. > > It's also for anyone who wants to more deeply understand basics. > > One of the best ways to deepen one's understanding is > > to see the problems others have and help them get beyond > > those problems. > > No matter how advanced you are there is always more to grasp > > concerning basics. > > \=======================================================/ > > > > Mike is prepared to host this list: > > ======================================================= > > The mechanics of hosting the list isn't a problem. I have multiple > > servers here and can easily setup this or any other listserver in > > minutes. If the list grows too large, then bandwidth may be an issue. I > > don't know how big too big actually is though. > > \=======================================================/ > > > > Both and Mike and I would like to set this up > > for our group very soon. > > It might be expanded to include more people later. > > > > I think this is a great idea. > > Are you interested? > > Other thoughts? > > -- George > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 01:54:10 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211252354.10455.george@metaart.org> Mike, Re Tia: Thanks for telling us her name: Tia. I'm thinking of a (Perl) ambassador for our group as someone who makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users in the country or area they are ambassador to. In my opinion, it's not essential they know much Perl. Being Ambassador for Russia and Georgia would require some ingenuity since I haven't been able to identify a group in either country. If being such an ambassador doesn't strike her fancy, that's kool! Then again, it might be fun. As an alternative, if she liked the idea, we could list her as translator. There's nothing to translate from those countries now. But later, who knows. If it's really large gobs of stuff, let's not bother. Re You: Do I understand correctly that you are willing to be our Ambassador to Perl Groups in the Southern part of the United States? If so, kool! Translation may, indeed, be relevant. Best wishes, George On Monday 25 November 2002 10:27 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > Hmmm... not sure how willing she would be to join the group. She does > have an interest in what I do, but not sure how deeply that interest > runs. > > Her name is Tia. > > I'm sure she would translate anything in Russian or Georgian that we > would need, unless maybe it was thousands of lines of code. Hmmm, is > there a Russian version of Perl ? Probably a dumb question. > > Yes, I will be happy to be the Southern Ambassador to the group. I'll > translate as required for the group.... > > M > > On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 18:18, George Woolley wrote: > > Mike, > > I hear you. > > > > Is your g/f willing to join the group > > and be Russian ambassador and Georgian ambasador? > > Does she have a name we are allowed to know? > > If she is willing to join the group that would be way kool! > > See http://marsneedswomen.pm.org for my sentiments on this. > > She doesn't need to get deep into perl, > > though it would be kool if she did Hello World or the like in Perl. > > Of course, if she likes Perl, ... > > > > Does this mean that you're OK with being ambasador to the US South? > > > > -- George > > > > P.S. The abbreviation g/f intrigues me. > > For reasons unknown, I had never encountered it before. > > How is it pronounced -- gif? > > For that matter how is .gif pronounced? > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 5:48 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > > George, you should edit your listing a bit. > > > > > > Russian - Mike's g/f > > > Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > Quoting George Woolley : > > > > Belden, > > > > Kool! > > > > > > > > Why do I ask? > > > > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > > > > and all of which have to do with future contacts > > > > with PM groups around the world. > > > > > > > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all > > > > over" Quest, > > > > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > > > > I'd like to involve others in our group and > > > > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I > > > > ignored because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > > > > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > > > > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > > > > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > > > > > > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French > > > > ambassador. He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every > > > > day. He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. > > > > He's definitely interested. > > > > > > > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > > > > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > > > > > > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > > > > US South -- Mike > > > > > > > > Corsica -- Arden > > > > France -- Arden > > > > Russia -- Mike > > > > Taiwan -- Belden > > > > > > > > Central America -- George > > > > South America -- Belden > > > > > > > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or > > > > country. (Or not to be one at all) > > > > > > > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > > > > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > > > > It's kool to know various languages, > > > > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > > > > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > > > > which speak primarily English. > > > > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > > > > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > > > > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > > > > > > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > George > > > > > > > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > > > > George Woolley wrote: > > > > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > > > > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > > > > > around the world containing them? > > > > > > > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > > > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > > > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > > > > > where the ...s are the language characters > > > > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > > > > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > > > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > > > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > > > > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > > > > mostly. > > > > > > > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Oakland mailing list > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 02:06:22 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors Message-ID: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org> All, Unless there are significant objections to having Ambassadors, I'll go ahead with it. So, any objections? So what's an ambassador in this context? I'm thinking of a (Perl) ambassador for our group as someone who makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users in the country or area they are ambassador to. In my opinion, it's not essential they know much Perl. And what's such an ambassador do? This is largely up to you, i.e. the ambassador. But I suppose make connections with at least some of the Perl groups (or if there are no groups, with individual Perl users) in your area or city. Beyond that I don't know. Whatever is enjoyable. (And you define enjoyable.) Now, would be a good time to say, yes, you'd like to be Ambassador for the area I mentioned you for. Or to make an alternate suggestion. (Or to say no.) -- George David A., Are there any areas or cities that you'd like to take on? Let me, or all of us, know. -- George Anyone not listed on the earlier list, if you are interested in being an Ambassador, Let me know. -- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 02:12:56 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <200211252354.10455.george@metaart.org> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> <200211252354.10455.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038298376.17578.28.camel@moe> George, I'm sure Tia would like to help if she can. She maintains regular contact via phone and email with her relatives in Georgia. If there was a chance she could communicate with someone in Georgia or Russia on our behalf in the name of Perl, she'd likely enjoy it. I'll ask. Sure, I'll take on the Ambassadorship for the Southern US. I'm not precisely sure what I just volunteered myself for, but oh well..... M On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 23:54, George Woolley wrote: > Mike, > > Re Tia: > Thanks for telling us her name: Tia. > > I'm thinking of a (Perl) ambassador for our group as someone > who makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users > in the country or area they are ambassador to. > In my opinion, it's not essential they know much Perl. > > Being Ambassador for Russia and Georgia > would require some ingenuity > since I haven't been able to identify a group in either country. > If being such an ambassador doesn't strike her fancy, that's kool! > Then again, it might be fun. > > As an alternative, > if she liked the idea, we could list her as translator. > There's nothing to translate from those countries now. > But later, who knows. > If it's really large gobs of stuff, let's not bother. > > Re You: > Do I understand correctly that you are willing to be our Ambassador > to Perl Groups in the Southern part of the United States? > If so, kool! > Translation may, indeed, be relevant. > > Best wishes, > George > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 10:27 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > > Hmmm... not sure how willing she would be to join the group. She does > > have an interest in what I do, but not sure how deeply that interest > > runs. > > > > Her name is Tia. > > > > I'm sure she would translate anything in Russian or Georgian that we > > would need, unless maybe it was thousands of lines of code. Hmmm, is > > there a Russian version of Perl ? Probably a dumb question. > > > > Yes, I will be happy to be the Southern Ambassador to the group. I'll > > translate as required for the group.... > > > > M > > > > On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 18:18, George Woolley wrote: > > > Mike, > > > I hear you. > > > > > > Is your g/f willing to join the group > > > and be Russian ambassador and Georgian ambasador? > > > Does she have a name we are allowed to know? > > > If she is willing to join the group that would be way kool! > > > See http://marsneedswomen.pm.org for my sentiments on this. > > > She doesn't need to get deep into perl, > > > though it would be kool if she did Hello World or the like in Perl. > > > Of course, if she likes Perl, ... > > > > > > Does this mean that you're OK with being ambasador to the US South? > > > > > > -- George > > > > > > P.S. The abbreviation g/f intrigues me. > > > For reasons unknown, I had never encountered it before. > > > How is it pronounced -- gif? > > > For that matter how is .gif pronounced? > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 5:48 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > > > George, you should edit your listing a bit. > > > > > > > > Russian - Mike's g/f > > > > Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > Quoting George Woolley : > > > > > Belden, > > > > > Kool! > > > > > > > > > > Why do I ask? > > > > > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > > > > > and all of which have to do with future contacts > > > > > with PM groups around the world. > > > > > > > > > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all > > > > > over" Quest, > > > > > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > > > > > I'd like to involve others in our group and > > > > > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I > > > > > ignored because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > > > > > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > > > > > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > > > > > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > > > > > > > > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French > > > > > ambassador. He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it every > > > > > day. He's a linguist and he might later take on other countries. > > > > > He's definitely interested. > > > > > > > > > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > > > > > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > > > > > > > > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > > > > > US South -- Mike > > > > > > > > > > Corsica -- Arden > > > > > France -- Arden > > > > > Russia -- Mike > > > > > Taiwan -- Belden > > > > > > > > > > Central America -- George > > > > > South America -- Belden > > > > > > > > > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or > > > > > country. (Or not to be one at all) > > > > > > > > > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > > > > > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > > > > > It's kool to know various languages, > > > > > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > > > > > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > > > > > which speak primarily English. > > > > > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > > > > > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > > > > > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > > > > > > > > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > George > > > > > > > > > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > > > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > > > > > George Woolley wrote: > > > > > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > > > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides English) > > > > > > > well enough they can understand some of the Perl Mongers sites > > > > > > > around the world containing them? > > > > > > > > > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > > > > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > > > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > > > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party ...! > > > > > > > where the ...s are the language characters > > > > > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > > > > > > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > > > > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > > > > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > > > > > > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > > > > > mostly. > > > > > > > > > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Oakland mailing list > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 03:00:38 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <1038298376.17578.28.camel@moe> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211252354.10455.george@metaart.org> <1038298376.17578.28.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211260100.38427.george@metaart.org> Mike, Re: Tia I think it would be fun. In fact, I'm committed to it being fun. Let us know what she says. I think we can give her some help. Perl (and Linux) people know other Perl people. Hey, I was able to contact a Perl user from Africa even though the one group listed in Africa was not real. I did it through a post on the London.pm mailing list. I'm told London.pm has around 300 members. And there can be surprising side effects. Beldin learned of this group from my post on the London.pm mailing list. Anyway there are people in our group who can help. Re you: Great! Let's make sure it's enjoyable. Best wishes, George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 12:12 am, M. Lewis wrote: > George, > > I'm sure Tia would like to help if she can. She maintains regular > contact via phone and email with her relatives in Georgia. If there was > a chance she could communicate with someone in Georgia or Russia on our > behalf in the name of Perl, she'd likely enjoy it. I'll ask. > > Sure, I'll take on the Ambassadorship for the Southern US. I'm not > precisely sure what I just volunteered myself for, but oh well..... > > M > > On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 23:54, George Woolley wrote: > > Mike, > > > > Re Tia: > > Thanks for telling us her name: Tia. > > > > I'm thinking of a (Perl) ambassador for our group as someone > > who makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users > > in the country or area they are ambassador to. > > In my opinion, it's not essential they know much Perl. > > > > Being Ambassador for Russia and Georgia > > would require some ingenuity > > since I haven't been able to identify a group in either country. > > If being such an ambassador doesn't strike her fancy, that's kool! > > Then again, it might be fun. > > > > As an alternative, > > if she liked the idea, we could list her as translator. > > There's nothing to translate from those countries now. > > But later, who knows. > > If it's really large gobs of stuff, let's not bother. > > > > Re You: > > Do I understand correctly that you are willing to be our Ambassador > > to Perl Groups in the Southern part of the United States? > > If so, kool! > > Translation may, indeed, be relevant. > > > > Best wishes, > > George > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 10:27 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > > > Hmmm... not sure how willing she would be to join the group. She does > > > have an interest in what I do, but not sure how deeply that interest > > > runs. > > > > > > Her name is Tia. > > > > > > I'm sure she would translate anything in Russian or Georgian that we > > > would need, unless maybe it was thousands of lines of code. Hmmm, is > > > there a Russian version of Perl ? Probably a dumb question. > > > > > > Yes, I will be happy to be the Southern Ambassador to the group. I'll > > > translate as required for the group.... > > > > > > M > > > > > > On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 18:18, George Woolley wrote: > > > > Mike, > > > > I hear you. > > > > > > > > Is your g/f willing to join the group > > > > and be Russian ambassador and Georgian ambasador? > > > > Does she have a name we are allowed to know? > > > > If she is willing to join the group that would be way kool! > > > > See http://marsneedswomen.pm.org for my sentiments on this. > > > > She doesn't need to get deep into perl, > > > > though it would be kool if she did Hello World or the like in Perl. > > > > Of course, if she likes Perl, ... > > > > > > > > Does this mean that you're OK with being ambasador to the US South? > > > > > > > > -- George > > > > > > > > P.S. The abbreviation g/f intrigues me. > > > > For reasons unknown, I had never encountered it before. > > > > How is it pronounced -- gif? > > > > For that matter how is .gif pronounced? > > > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 5:48 pm, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > > > > George, you should edit your listing a bit. > > > > > > > > > > Russian - Mike's g/f > > > > > Georgian (As in Fed. Rep. of Georgia) - Mike's g/f > > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > Quoting George Woolley : > > > > > > Belden, > > > > > > Kool! > > > > > > > > > > > > Why do I ask? > > > > > > Well, I'm aware of several motivations, two of which follow, > > > > > > and all of which have to do with future contacts > > > > > > with PM groups around the world. > > > > > > > > > > > > (1) I'm thinking of doing a follow up to my earlier "Perl is all > > > > > > over" Quest, > > > > > > with more and deeper coverage of the Globe. > > > > > > I'd like to involve others in our group and > > > > > > I'd also like us to be able to connect with some of the groups I > > > > > > ignored because of my limited knowlege of different languages. > > > > > > (2) I'm thinking it might be fun to have ambassadors > > > > > > (or some such) to other Perl groups, > > > > > > many of which are in other countries in other areas of the world. > > > > > > > > > > > > I've actually talked to Arden Schaeffer about being French > > > > > > ambassador. He knows French quite well and, in fact, speaks it > > > > > > every day. He's a linguist and he might later take on other > > > > > > countries. He's definitely interested. > > > > > > > > > > > > Hm, Let me imagine for a moment. > > > > > > Nobody has agreed to anything, but, who knows, maybe: > > > > > > > > > > > > other Bay Area PM -- Ken > > > > > > US South -- Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > Corsica -- Arden > > > > > > France -- Arden > > > > > > Russia -- Mike > > > > > > Taiwan -- Belden > > > > > > > > > > > > Central America -- George > > > > > > South America -- Belden > > > > > > > > > > > > Or perhaps you prefer to be ambassador to a different area or > > > > > > country. (Or not to be one at all) > > > > > > > > > > > > I like that there are lots of areas not covered, > > > > > > so newcomers could get involved easily, if they wanted to. > > > > > > It's kool to know various languages, > > > > > > but an ambassador doesn't absolutely have to know the language. > > > > > > Besides which, there are many openings for countries or areas > > > > > > which speak primarily English. > > > > > > Hey, who wants to be ambassador to the United Kingdom, > > > > > > which includes the wonderful London.pm. > > > > > > Or maybe there should be a separate ambassador for London. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now that I think of it, these two ideas work well together. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > George > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S> Belden, thanks for asking! > > > > > > > > > > > > On Monday 25 November 2002 3:33 pm, Belden Lyman wrote: > > > > > > > George Woolley wrote: > > > > > > > > Hm, Belden mentions Chinese in his recent post. > > > > > > > > Anyone know any other "natural" languages (i.e. besides > > > > > > > > English) well enough they can understand some of the Perl > > > > > > > > Mongers sites around the world containing them? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I grok Chinese and Spanish. Spanish gives me a toe-hold to > > > > > > > French and Portuguese. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For example: Taipei.pm site at http://taipei.pm.org > > > > > > > > The October 18 post looks like this to me: > > > > > > > > PHP, Perl, Python ..., ... Java. Net ..., ..., ... Party > > > > > > > > ...! where the ...s are the language characters > > > > > > > > of which I, unfortunately, am totally ignorant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They're saying that PHP, Perl, and Python are not > > > > > > > in the Taiwanese "Common Business Terms" dictionary > > > > > > > (or some similar title) - but Java and .NET are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I looked at the other websites and can follow them, > > > > > > > mostly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > George, why do you ask? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > > > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Oakland mailing list > > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Oakland mailing list > > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Oakland mailing list > > Oakland@mail.pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From david at wheeler.net Tue Nov 26 10:01:10 2002 From: david at wheeler.net (David Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <1038275557.3de2d3e5cdaeb@rattler.cajuninc.com> Message-ID: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:52 PM, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > my @beer= qw (good cold more); > foreach (@beer){ > print "$_ beer\n"; > } my @beer = qw(good cold more); while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n" } @beer } :-) David -- David Wheeler AIM: dwTheory david@wheeler.net ICQ: 15726394 http://david.wheeler.net/ Yahoo!: dew7e Jabber: Theory@jabber.org From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:32:18 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:23 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <200211251740.37709.george@metaart.org> <1038275330.3de2d3026469d@rattler.cajuninc.com> <200211251818.55826.george@metaart.org> <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> Message-ID: <3DE3A212.1080100@iii.com> M. Lewis wrote: > > Hmmm, is > there a Russian version of Perl ? > I just checked http://kobesearch.cpan.org ; there are a few Lingua::RU modules, but no Filter:: modules for Russian. > > Probably a dumb question. > Naah, no perl questions are dumb (see: "Perl can bite me" :) From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:35:27 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me References: <3DE2CC4A.5080001@iii.com> <20021125173245.D30199@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <3DE3A2CF.4020106@iii.com> David Alban wrote: > Belden, > > Your doing the: > > $uid = getpwnam($name); > > invocation. root's uid is zero, which is false. > > You probably should test for defined() rather than truth. > > Did I win? :-) > > ding-ding-ding, on the nose. From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:37:23 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me References: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> Message-ID: <3DE3A343.2090808@iii.com> David Wheeler wrote: > On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:52 PM, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > >> my @beer= qw (good cold more); >> foreach (@beer){ >> print "$_ beer\n"; >> } > > > my @beer = qw(good cold more); > while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n" } @beer } > my @beer = qw(good cold more); while (my $uid = getpwnam ... doh! From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:41:39 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <1038291827.17578.14.camel@moe> Message-ID: <3DE3A443.30103@iii.com> M. Lewis wrote: > Lay it all off on me huh George ? hehehe, that's ok. > > Looks like you and I may be the only die hard night owls... Else > everyone else is parsing the idea..... > > M > I have a few short windows through my (work) day that I check the list. From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:41:58 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <1038291827.17578.14.camel@moe> <200211252301.22277.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DE3A456.3020305@iii.com> Ugh, to top-post or bottom-post... George Woolley wrote: > All, > OK. Let me try again. > > Mike and I would both like to start a Perl Basics Mailing List. Soon! > Mike proposed the basic idea to me > and we've been talking about it off-list. > Anyone else interested? -- George > Sure, this sounds like fun. Speaking of lists for learning more perl, check out MJD's Perl QOTW, http://perl.plover.com/qotw > > On Monday 25 November 2002 10:23 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > >>Lay it all off on me huh George ? hehehe, that's ok. >> >>Looks like you and I may be the only die hard night owls... Else >>everyone else is parsing the idea..... >> >>M >> >>On Mon, 2002-11-25 at 20:33, George Woolley wrote: >> >>>Mike would like to create a Perl Basics Mailing List. >>>Here's some snipets taken from our off-list discussion of his idea. >>>(I view it as a Perl Quest, but I don't think we've talked about that.) >>> >>>Here's my shot of a description of the list: >>>============================================================== >>>1) Name: The Perl Basics Mailing List >>>2) Function: This is a place for asking and answering questions >>>about Perl basics with the intent of mastering them, >>>so that we may write >>>more efficient, more understandable and more reliable Perl programs. >>> >>>Perl basics: (This would need to be defined, but certainly includes >>> the basics of hashes and regular expressions >>>which confuse a lot of people.) >>>3) Who for: This list is for beginners. >>> It's also for anyone who wants to more deeply understand basics. >>>One of the best ways to deepen one's understanding is >>>to see the problems others have and help them get beyond >>>those problems. >>>No matter how advanced you are there is always more to grasp >>>concerning basics. >>>\=======================================================/ >>> >>>Mike is prepared to host this list: >>>======================================================= >>>The mechanics of hosting the list isn't a problem. I have multiple >>>servers here and can easily setup this or any other listserver in >>>minutes. If the list grows too large, then bandwidth may be an issue. I >>>don't know how big too big actually is though. >>>\=======================================================/ >>> >>>Both and Mike and I would like to set this up >>>for our group very soon. >>>It might be expanded to include more people later. >>> >>>I think this is a great idea. >>>Are you interested? >>>Other thoughts? >>> -- George >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Oakland mailing list >>>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>Oakland mailing list >>Oakland@mail.pm.org >>http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland >> > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > > > From blyman at iii.com Tue Nov 26 10:45:22 2002 From: blyman at iii.com (Belden Lyman) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors References: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <3DE3A522.2060809@iii.com> George Woolley wrote: > > Now, would be a good time to say, > yes, you'd like to be Ambassador for the area I mentioned you for. > Or to make an alternate suggestion. > (Or to say no.) > -- George > I'll try it. If it's too much, I'll pare down. Belden From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 10:59:39 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] "Natural" Languages In-Reply-To: <3DE3A212.1080100@iii.com> References: <200211251451.39660.george@metaart.org> <1038292027.17578.19.camel@moe> <3DE3A212.1080100@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211260859.39759.george@metaart.org> Belden, Kool. Russian modules! Yeah, I agree, "no perl questions are dumb". So, Belden, can you relate to the ambassadors thought? Are you interested in being the South American ambassador, the Taiwan ambassador or any other ambassador? Could be fun, interesting. -- George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:32 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > M. Lewis wrote: > > Hmmm, is > > there a Russian version of Perl ? > > I just checked http://kobesearch.cpan.org ; there are a > few Lingua::RU modules, but no Filter:: modules for Russian. > > > Probably a dumb question. > > Naah, no perl questions are dumb (see: "Perl can bite me" :) > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 11:16:16 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> References: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> Message-ID: <200211260916.16939.george@metaart.org> On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:01 am, David Wheeler wrote: > On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:52 PM, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > my @beer= qw (good cold more); > > foreach (@beer){ > > print "$_ beer\n"; > > } > > my @beer = qw(good cold more); > while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n" } @beer } > > :-) > > David For those who like to savor their imaginary beers, I suggest: my @beer = qw(good cold more); while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n"; sleep(2); } @beer } :-)ing George From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 11:23:10 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <3DE3A343.2090808@iii.com> References: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> <3DE3A343.2090808@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211260923.10374.george@metaart.org> ray! me! more beer! more beer! On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:37 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > David Wheeler wrote: > > On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:52 PM, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > >> my @beer= qw (good cold more); > >> foreach (@beer){ > >> print "$_ beer\n"; > >> } > > > > my @beer = qw(good cold more); > > while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n" } @beer } > > my @beer = qw(good cold more); > while (my $uid = getpwnam ... > > doh! > > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 11:29:42 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] perl can bite me In-Reply-To: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> References: <48214AFA-0158-11D7-BF52-0003931A964A@wheeler.net> Message-ID: <200211260929.42810.george@metaart.org> David, Oh, yeah, and thanks for posting! :) George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:01 am, David Wheeler wrote: > On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:52 PM, cajun@cajuninc.com wrote: > > my @beer= qw (good cold more); > > foreach (@beer){ > > print "$_ beer\n"; > > } > > my @beer = qw(good cold more); > while (1) { map { print "$_ free beer\n" } @beer } > > :-) > > David From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 11:39:19 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors In-Reply-To: <3DE3A522.2060809@iii.com> References: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org> <3DE3A522.2060809@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211260939.19485.george@metaart.org> Belden, Kool! Yeah, no need to do more than is enjoyable. -- George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:45 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > George Woolley wrote: > > Now, would be a good time to say, > > yes, you'd like to be Ambassador for the area I mentioned you for. > > Or to make an alternate suggestion. > > (Or to say no.) > > -- George > > I'll try it. If it's too much, I'll pare down. > > Belden > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 11:51:38 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <3DE3A456.3020305@iii.com> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <200211252301.22277.george@metaart.org> <3DE3A456.3020305@iii.com> Message-ID: <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> Belden, Thanks. -- George Mike, Could you set up such a list at your convenience? Maybe call it Perl Basics. And perhaps tack on a .5 (version number) somewhere. -- George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:41 am, Belden Lyman wrote: ... > George Woolley wrote: > > All, > > OK. Let me try again. > > > > Mike and I would both like to start a Perl Basics Mailing List. Soon! > > Mike proposed the basic idea to me > > and we've been talking about it off-list. > > Anyone else interested? -- George > > Sure, this sounds like fun. ... From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 12:05:50 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <200211252301.22277.george@metaart.org> <3DE3A456.3020305@iii.com> <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038333950.17579.33.camel@moe> You should have just been subscribed George. M On Tue, 2002-11-26 at 09:51, George Woolley wrote: > Belden, Thanks. -- George > > Mike, Could you set up such a list at your convenience? > Maybe call it Perl Basics. > And perhaps tack on a .5 (version number) somewhere. > -- George > > On Tuesday 26 November 2002 8:41 am, Belden Lyman wrote: > ... > > George Woolley wrote: > > > All, > > > OK. Let me try again. > > > > > > Mike and I would both like to start a Perl Basics Mailing List. Soon! > > > Mike proposed the basic idea to me > > > and we've been talking about it off-list. > > > Anyone else interested? -- George > > > > Sure, this sounds like fun. > ... > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 13:07:21 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <200211252301.22277.george@metaart.org> <3DE3A456.3020305@iii.com> <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038337641.17578.55.camel@moe> For those who might like to join our new list, please use the following URL: http://rattler.cajuninc.com/mailman/listinfo/pbml NOTE: George and Belden, please sign up using this URL. You are NOT currently signed up. I found that Mailman doesn't like spaces and brackets in the list names. Therefore I deleted the previous attempt. Mike From george at metaart.org Tue Nov 26 13:56:57 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <1038337641.17578.55.camel@moe> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> <1038337641.17578.55.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211261156.57685.george@metaart.org> Mike, And now there are 3 people on it. How kool is that!? Very! -- George On Tuesday 26 November 2002 11:07 am, M. Lewis wrote: > For those who might like to join our new list, please use the following > URL: > > http://rattler.cajuninc.com/mailman/listinfo/pbml > > NOTE: George and Belden, please sign up using this URL. You are NOT > currently signed up. I found that Mailman doesn't like spaces and > brackets in the list names. Therefore I deleted the previous attempt. > > Mike From cajun at cajuninc.com Tue Nov 26 14:13:51 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (cajun@cajuninc.com) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Basics Mailing List In-Reply-To: <200211261156.57685.george@metaart.org> References: <200211252033.21185.george@metaart.org> <200211260951.38645.george@metaart.org> <1038337641.17578.55.camel@moe> <200211261156.57685.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038341631.3de3d5ff54b7d@rattler.cajuninc.com> Hmmm..... I see 4 Quoting George Woolley : > Mike, > And now there are 3 people on it. > How kool is that!? Very! > -- George > > On Tuesday 26 November 2002 11:07 am, M. Lewis wrote: > > For those who might like to join our new list, please use the following > > URL: > > > > http://rattler.cajuninc.com/mailman/listinfo/pbml > > > > NOTE: George and Belden, please sign up using this URL. You are NOT > > currently signed up. I found that Mailman doesn't like spaces and > > brackets in the list names. Therefore I deleted the previous attempt. > > > > Mike > > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 27 00:01:02 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors List Message-ID: <200211262201.02476.george@metaart.org> Everyone I've communicated to on the earlier list of possible Ambassadors has accepted. I haven't talked to Ken yet. And Mike hasn't gotten back to me about Tia yet. Here's the current list. ======================================================== Other Bay Area Groups - Ken - ? United States South - Mike Lewis - ACCEPTED Corsica - Arden Schaeffer - ACCEPTED France - Arden Schaeffer - ACCEPTED Georgia - Tia - ? New Zealand - George Woolley - ACCEPTED Russia - Tia - ? Taiwan - Belden Lyman - ACCEPTED Central America - George Woolley - ACCEPTED South America - Belden Lyman - ACCEPTED \========================================================/ This leaves open many possibilities for new people, and for other people in the group who aren't ambassadors yet. Here's a snipet about Ambassadors from an earlier post: ========================================================= So what's an ambassador in this context? I'm thinking of a (Perl) ambassador for our group as someone who makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users in the country or area they are ambassador to. In my opinion, it's not essential they know much Perl. And what's such an ambassador do? This is largely up to you, i.e. the ambassador. But I suppose make connections with at least some of the Perl groups (or if there are no groups, with individual Perl users) in your area or city. Beyond that I don't know. Whatever is enjoyable. (And you define enjoyable.) \=======================================================/ From david at wheeler.net Wed Nov 27 00:52:53 2002 From: david at wheeler.net (David Wheeler) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Another SFPUG Message-ID: Hi All, Good to see a few of you tonight. The new SFPUG I mentioned is neither the San Francisco Perl Users Group nor the San Francisco Palm Users Group. No, this is the San Francisco PostgreSQL Users Group! They've had their inaugural meeting a couple of weeks ago, and the second meeting will be on December 11th. If you're interested, join the mail list by sending mail to majordomo@postgresql.org with the words "subscribe sfpug" in the body of the message. I quote the latest announcement: > Next meeting: > > Wednesday, December 11th > Zapatec HQ in North Berkeley > 7:00PM > > Dror will provide directions and coordinate take-out, since it''s his > office. > > Presentations: > 1. Dror will present the Zapatec framework > 2. I may/may not have a presentation based on a training session the > previous > day. For those who were interested in the new OSS database I heard about, it's called Firebird, and is a Fork from the Borland (formerly Inprise, (formerly Borland)) InterBase database: http://firebird.sf.net/ Enjoy! David -- David Wheeler AIM: dwTheory david@wheeler.net ICQ: 15726394 http://david.wheeler.net/ Yahoo!: dew7e Jabber: Theory@jabber.org From extasia at mindspring.com Wed Nov 27 21:57:07 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors In-Reply-To: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org>; from george@metaart.org on Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 12:06:22AM -0800 References: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20021127195707.C16532@new.gerasimov.net> At 2002/11/26/00:06 -0800 George Woolley wrote: > David A., > Are there any areas or cities that you'd like to take on? > Let me, or all of us, know. -- George Hmmm, I'm on the D.C. list. Maybe I could try being the D.C. Ambassador... Initially bothered by the lack of definition of an ambassadors duties, I figured I had the wrong attitude. So, O.K. Here are some ideas. . Ask the "foreign" group what works for them. Both with regard to their mailing list and their meetings/other activities. Report back to opug. . Encourage members of the foreign group to post on opug (that's what I call this list :-) "Introduction" style posts would be welcome, too. Kind of like being an exchange student... . Ask the foreign group if it's O.K. for opug folks to occasionally post on the foreign list. (Assuming lack of language issues.) . Ask the foreign group what the job situation is in their neck of the woods. Report back to opug. Just some ideas. That's all I can come up with at the moment. Maybe opug folk could suggest more? Oh, and I would say, don't "push" the foreign group. Pace your posts/contact so that they don't perceive you as pushy or get pissed at you 'cause you're an uppity guest. David -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021127/2b9e5aa6/attachment.bin From extasia at mindspring.com Wed Nov 27 23:12:26 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Mini-sig-beer-oakland? Message-ID: <20021127211226.A17612@new.gerasimov.net> Skipped content of type multipart/mixed-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021127/98086aad/attachment.bin From george at metaart.org Wed Nov 27 23:17:48 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors In-Reply-To: <20021127195707.C16532@new.gerasimov.net> References: <200211260006.22122.george@metaart.org> <20021127195707.C16532@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <200211272117.48096.george@metaart.org> David, Ambassador to the District of Columbia: OK, D.C. it is! (Wonderful place! Hey, I went to high school there.) Go for it. I'll be interested in hearing your reports. OPUG: Yeah, when an abbreviation is called for, that's what I've been using. See the akas on our home page. You are not alone. :-) Ambassador Ideas: Good ideas! "Maybe opug folk could suggest more?" Hey, you are opug folk! Alright, everyone, more ideas? Posting on "Foreign" Groups Mailing Lists: "Ask the foreign group if it's O.K. for opug folks to occasionally post on the foreign list." Beldin originally heard of Oakland.pm from my only post to the London.pm mailing list. Hm, I wonder if I should have asked first? -- George On Wednesday 27 November 2002 7:57 pm, David Alban wrote: > At 2002/11/26/00:06 -0800 George Woolley wrote: > > David A., > > Are there any areas or cities that you'd like to take on? > > Let me, or all of us, know. -- George > > Hmmm, I'm on the D.C. list. Maybe I could try being the D.C. > Ambassador... > > Initially bothered by the lack of definition of an ambassadors duties, I > figured I had the wrong attitude. So, O.K. Here are some ideas. > > . Ask the "foreign" group what works for them. Both with regard to > their mailing list and their meetings/other activities. Report > back to opug. > > . Encourage members of the foreign group to post on opug (that's > what I call this list :-) "Introduction" style posts would be > welcome, too. Kind of like being an exchange student... > > . Ask the foreign group if it's O.K. for opug folks to occasionally > post on the foreign list. (Assuming lack of language issues.) > > . Ask the foreign group what the job situation is in their neck of > the woods. Report back to opug. > > Just some ideas. That's all I can come up with at the moment. Maybe > opug folk could suggest more? > > Oh, and I would say, don't "push" the foreign group. Pace your > posts/contact so that they don't perceive you as pushy or get pissed > at you 'cause you're an uppity guest. > > David From extasia at mindspring.com Wed Nov 27 23:43:40 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org>; from georgepw@metaart.org on Sun, Nov 24, 2002 at 09:15:53PM -0800 References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> Message-ID: <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> Greetings! At 2002/11/24/21:15 -0800 George Woolley wrote: > * introduce yourself David Alban unix sysadmin, tools guy Been doing perl for four years, but not as primary job responsibility. I use perl mostly for unix tools: general and sysadmin. Did then in #!/bin/sh before discovering perl. Very comfortable with perl, but don't know web/cgi or object oriented. Love complex data structures in perl (but again, don't know oo). Latest perl project: Log::Monkey Live on the peninsula Attend baylisa, sf-perl, kabuki-west; looking to attend this group Sing in two different choral groups (sang at San Quentin on Halloween) Co-founder of sig-beer-west (see .sig below) Currently reading: _Across_Realtime_ by Vernor Vinge, an awesome sci-fi author Current mp3 playing: Zappa's cover of Whipping Post from "Them or Us" Movie I'd like to see soon: Solaris Movie I'd like to see soon: the new ST Next Generation flick Movie I wish would freakin' hurry up and get released: Matrix 2 Movie question: Why did Bab 5 never have any movie theater movie releases? Machines at home: . intel p133 running suse linux (seven years old and going strong! :-) [knock on wood] . thinkpad running suse linux . indy running irix 6.2 . ultra 30 running solaris 9 . G3 tower running mac os 9.2.1 Unemployed for a while (see .sig below) Wonder whether we should be adding the concept of checks-and-balances to the endangered species list. > * ask a question about Perl What are all of those funny punctuation marks for? > * make a suggestion about the group Could someone do a presentation that is an introduction to object oriented perl programming? > * do something else O.K. May I request that folks make a reasonable attempt to trim the quoted material in their posts? There was one thread in which each message in the thread contained the entire thread. To something like ten levels of quoting. O.K. That's me. You're next... :-) David -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021127/ef98b4b3/attachment.bin From george at metaart.org Thu Nov 28 01:00:35 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <200211272300.35034.george@metaart.org> On Wednesday 27 November 2002 9:43 pm, David Alban wrote: > Greetings! > At 2002/11/24/21:15 -0800 George Woolley wrote: > > * introduce yourself > David Alban > unix sysadmin, tools guy ... Thanks > > * ask a question about Perl > What are all of those funny punctuation marks for? Yeah, there sure are a lot of them. It's a mystery! > > * make a suggestion about the group > Could someone do a presentation that is an introduction to object > oriented perl programming? Sure, we ought to be able to get someone to do that. > > * do something else > O.K. ... attempt to trim the quoted material in ... posts ... Good idea. Hey, I look at the archives from time to time too. I've been working on learning to trim appropriately. --- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Thu Nov 28 05:11:11 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe> Hi David. Nice to meet up with you. You sound like my kind of guy. If you check the archives, my intro is there a few days ago. Basically, primarily Linux, Sys Admin, use Perl for parsing logs, making my life easier. I don't know OO either. Mike On Wed, 2002-11-27 at 21:43, David Alban wrote: > Greetings! > > At 2002/11/24/21:15 -0800 George Woolley wrote: > > * introduce yourself > > David Alban > unix sysadmin, tools guy > Been doing perl for four years, but not as primary job responsibility. > I use perl mostly for unix tools: general and sysadmin. Did then > in #!/bin/sh before discovering perl. > Very comfortable with perl, but don't know web/cgi or object oriented. > Love complex data structures in perl (but again, don't know oo). > Latest perl project: Log::Monkey > > Live on the peninsula > Attend baylisa, sf-perl, kabuki-west; looking to attend this group > Sing in two different choral groups (sang at San Quentin on Halloween) > Co-founder of sig-beer-west (see .sig below) > Currently reading: _Across_Realtime_ by Vernor Vinge, an awesome sci-fi > author > Current mp3 playing: Zappa's cover of Whipping Post from "Them or Us" > Movie I'd like to see soon: Solaris > Movie I'd like to see soon: the new ST Next Generation flick > Movie I wish would freakin' hurry up and get released: Matrix 2 > Movie question: Why did Bab 5 never have any movie theater movie releases? > Machines at home: > . intel p133 running suse linux (seven years old and going strong! :-) > [knock on wood] > . thinkpad running suse linux > . indy running irix 6.2 > . ultra 30 running solaris 9 > . G3 tower running mac os 9.2.1 > Unemployed for a while (see .sig below) > Wonder whether we should be adding the concept of checks-and-balances > to the endangered species list. > > > * ask a question about Perl > > What are all of those funny punctuation marks for? > > > * make a suggestion about the group > > Could someone do a presentation that is an introduction to object > oriented perl programming? > > > * do something else > > O.K. May I request that folks make a reasonable attempt to trim the > quoted material in their posts? There was one thread in which each > message in the thread contained the entire thread. To something like > ten levels of quoting. > > O.K. That's me. You're next... :-) > > David > -- > Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. > *** > Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html > Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html From george at metaart.org Thu Nov 28 10:03:35 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211280803.35574.george@metaart.org> On Thursday 28 November 2002 3:11 am, M. Lewis wrote: > ... Yeah, I've got a lot to be thankful for. Have a good Thanksgiving everyone! ... George From extasia at mindspring.com Thu Nov 28 10:12:01 2002 From: extasia at mindspring.com (David Alban) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe>; from cajun@cajuninc.com on Thu, Nov 28, 2002 at 03:11:11AM -0800 References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <20021127214340.A17648@new.gerasimov.net> <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe> Message-ID: <20021128081201.A20409@new.gerasimov.net> At 2002/11/28/03:11 -0800 M. Lewis wrote: > Hi David. Nice to meet up with you. You sound like my kind of guy. If > you check the archives, my intro is there a few days ago. Basically, > primarily Linux, Sys Admin, use Perl for parsing logs, making my life > easier. I don't know OO either. I try to make the case to managers that there are a huge number of user and system related problems/issues whose solutions cannot be addressed by shrink wrapped software. And in the cases where a shrink wrapped solution does address an issue, it's like using a jack hammer to install a picture hanger. Many times, a very expensive jack hammer. :-) -- Live in a world of your own, but always welcome visitors. *** Join us at sig-beer-west! http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/sig.beer.west.html Unix sysadmin available: http://www.gerasimov.net/~alban/jac/resume.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 232 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/oakland/attachments/20021128/38a85778/attachment.bin From george at metaart.org Thu Nov 28 10:32:29 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Introduction In-Reply-To: <20021128081201.A20409@new.gerasimov.net> References: <200211242115.53461.georgepw@metaart.org> <1038481871.29342.33.camel@moe> <20021128081201.A20409@new.gerasimov.net> Message-ID: <200211280832.29533.george@metaart.org> On Thursday 28 November 2002 8:12 am, David Alban wrote: > At 2002/11/28/03:11 -0800 M. Lewis wrote: > ... Sys Admin, use Perl for parsing logs, making my life > > easier. ... > I try to make the case to managers that there are a huge number of > user and system related problems/issues whose solutions cannot be > addressed by shrink wrapped software. And in the cases where a > shrink wrapped solution does address an issue, it's like using a jack > hammer to install a picture hanger. Many times, a very expensive jack > hammer. :-) Yes! Could you describe one of those problems/issues that ... cannot be addressed by shrink wrapped software. From george at metaart.org Thu Nov 28 15:15:43 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Ambassadors Message-ID: <200211281315.43067.george@metaart.org> ============= Current List of Ambassadors ==================== District of Columbia - David Alban <<< New! Other Bay Area Groups - (Ken?) United States South - Mike Lewis Corsica - Arden Schaeffer France - Arden Schaeffer Georgia - (Tia?) New Zealand - George Woolley Russia - (Tia?) Taiwan - Belden Lyman Central America - George Woolley South America - Belden Lyman \========================================================/ This leaves open many possibilities for new people, and for other people in the group who aren't ambassadors yet. ============== What is an Ambassador? ========================= An ambassador from the Oakland.pm is * to a specified area (e.g. continent, country, region, city) * represents us to that area * makes and/or strengthens connections with Perl groups/users in his/her area. See David Alban's recent post for some thoughts on what an ambassador might do and how. \============================================================/ ============== Some Questions ============================== * Anyone else want to be an ambassador? * Mike, what states are included in the South? Maybe Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Louisana, Mississipi, South Carolina and North Carolina and Tennessee? * Mike, what's Tia say? * Anyone have any thoughts on "What is an Ambassador?" above? (It's derived from an earlier post.) * Anyone have any comments on David's post? \===========================================================/ From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 29 01:27:51 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Brother Groups Message-ID: <200211282327.51450.george@metaart.org> All, and especially Ambassadors, Oakland has sister cities in other parts of the world. I would like us to have brother groups with other Perl groups. Hm, is brother group the right name? Sister group? Other suggestions? The idea is that we would keep in contact, watch out for each other, and help each other when we could. Like brothers, except we're groups. This would help me in making stronger connection with certain other groups that are within the areas I am ambassador to. Thoughts? -- George From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 29 14:17:14 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Scripts for Your Linux Environment Message-ID: <200211291213.37999.george@metaart.org> All, I believe that most of the people particpating in this group have at least one Linux system at home. (Mike, I believe, has nine!) I'm wondering what Perl scripts you have acquired or written that tailor your environment to your liking. Someone else in the group might want to have the same script or a similar script. Or if you've written such a script, and there is interest, perhaps you'd be willing to give a talk about it. I think of four such scripts, I've written for my system. The most interesting one (to me anyway) is a script that generates aliases to many (113 last time) of my directories so I don't have to remember the paths to them. It makes my life way easier. By the way, if giving a talk seems intimidating, how about giving a lightning talk, which cannot be more than 5 minutes and can be as short as you want. -- George From jen at e-tudes.net Fri Nov 29 15:33:10 2002 From: jen at e-tudes.net (Jennifer Palm) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] wish/suggestion for learning Message-ID: <3DE7DD16.7040706@e-tudes.net> Hello, I'm a post-novice perl person, having used it about 3+ years in corporate web teams and with personal web projects. Have been isolated from fellow perl users for too long now; am probably coding in the stone ages. My suggestions for learning and/or meeting topics: - useful modules for web/cgi, esp. template modules - tips for documenting one's own scripts and applications. - mySQL - always up for review on any basic perl topics - reg exes, lists, references Very glad about new Oakland group! -JP From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 29 16:07:33 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] wish/suggestion for learning In-Reply-To: <3DE7DD16.7040706@e-tudes.net> References: <3DE7DD16.7040706@e-tudes.net> Message-ID: <200211291407.33835.george@metaart.org> Jennifer, Welcome to Oakland Perl Mongers. Thanks for posting about yourself and making suggestions. We're having our second meeting Tuesday, December 10th at 7:30pm. We'd be most pleased to see you there, if that's convenient. Basic information about the meeting is in the upper right on our home page: http://oakland.pm.org/ I hope you can come. Glad you've joined us on this mailing list! George Woolley On Friday 29 November 2002 1:33 pm, Jennifer Palm wrote: > Hello, > > I'm a post-novice perl person, having used it about 3+ years in > corporate web teams and with personal web projects. > Have been isolated from fellow perl users for too long now; am probably > coding in the stone ages. > My suggestions for learning and/or meeting topics: > - useful modules for web/cgi, esp. template modules > - tips for documenting one's own scripts and applications. > - mySQL > - always up for review on any basic perl topics - reg exes, lists, > references > > Very glad about new Oakland group! > > -JP From cajun at cajuninc.com Fri Nov 29 19:02:58 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Brother Groups In-Reply-To: <200211282327.51450.george@metaart.org> References: <200211282327.51450.george@metaart.org> Message-ID: <1038618178.18656.13.camel@moe> Hmmm.... I'm pretty dense George. I'm not sure what the purpose of Brother Groups, Sister Groups, Ambassadors are yet. -Is this something all .pm groups are doing ? -What specifically does it entail ? -It seems to me the fact that we have joined Oakland.pm sort of automatically makes us all ambassadors. Maybe I'm missing the point... M On Thu, 2002-11-28 at 23:27, George Woolley wrote: > All, and especially Ambassadors, > > Oakland has sister cities in other parts of the world. > I would like us to have brother groups with other Perl groups. > > Hm, is brother group the right name? > Sister group? Other suggestions? > > The idea is that we would keep in contact, > watch out for each other, > and help each other when we could. > Like brothers, except we're groups. > > This would help me in making stronger connection > with certain other groups > that are within the areas I am ambassador to. > > Thoughts? > -- George > > > _______________________________________________ > Oakland mailing list > Oakland@mail.pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/oakland From george at metaart.org Fri Nov 29 22:51:44 2002 From: george at metaart.org (George Woolley) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Brother Groups In-Reply-To: <1038618178.18656.13.camel@moe> References: <200211282327.51450.george@metaart.org> <1038618178.18656.13.camel@moe> Message-ID: <200211292051.44635.george@metaart.org> Mike, I don't think you are dense at all. I also think it makes sense to talk about Brother Groups and Ambassadors together, as you do. OK, let me put forward a couple of possibly relevant thoughts and then I'll respond to your specific concerns as best I can. Possibly Relevant Thoughts: I think, but am not sure, that you are just a bit uncomfortable with what, in my experience, is the norm in the early stages of a creation. One of the things I love is Perl. Another is connecting with people. Connecting with people in relation to Perl is megakool. (for me, that is) When there is such a convergence, I've noticed that surprising and enjoyable things often happen. I like that. --- The Purpose of Ambassadors, ... What I mean by a purpose is a direction. Something which by it's nature cannot be fulfilled. Something from which goals are generated. What I think we need most to connect with the purpose of these things is concrete shared experiences relating to them. I have some experiences that have not been fully communicated. We need more. But I suspect you are using purpose in some other way. If you say what you mean by purpose I'll respond to that, as best I can. --- What Do Other Groups Do?: I don't know of other groups that are doing this. Hm, but perhaps we're all already ambassadors as you suggest: "It seems to me the fact that we have joined Oakland.pm sort of automatically makes us all ambassadors". Perhaps my intent here is in part to get rid of the "sort of". --- What Specifically Does It Entail?: I would guess that would vary from ambassador to ambassador. For you, perhaps, a good starting point would be your sense of what you feel "makes us all ambassadors". I would prefer, especially at this stage, to leave things very open. We are all different and we are learning. An example: I have Central America and New Zealand. All together there are only 3 groups. Two of those groups are in the formative stages. I've been able to give some support to the group leaders of both groups relating to web pages, mailing lists, web design and even CGIs. I learned a lot in the process in different areas on subjects ranging from CGIs to geography. The third group gives signs of being active, but so far I'm not in contact with them. But the process of trying is interesting. Concluding Thought: I suggest focusing on what's enjoyable. Best wishes, George On Friday 29 November 2002 5:02 pm, M. Lewis wrote: > Hmmm.... I'm pretty dense George. I'm not sure what the purpose of > Brother Groups, Sister Groups, Ambassadors are yet. > > -Is this something all .pm groups are doing ? > -What specifically does it entail ? > -It seems to me the fact that we have joined Oakland.pm sort of > automatically makes us all ambassadors. Maybe I'm missing the point... > > M > > On Thu, 2002-11-28 at 23:27, George Woolley wrote: > > All, and especially Ambassadors, > > > > Oakland has sister cities in other parts of the world. > > I would like us to have brother groups with other Perl groups. > > > > Hm, is brother group the right name? > > Sister group? Other suggestions? > > > > The idea is that we would keep in contact, > > watch out for each other, > > and help each other when we could. > > Like brothers, except we're groups. > > > > This would help me in making stronger connection > > with certain other groups > > that are within the areas I am ambassador to. > > > > Thoughts? > > -- George From cajun at cajuninc.com Sat Nov 30 23:23:38 2002 From: cajun at cajuninc.com (M. Lewis) Date: Mon Aug 2 21:33:24 2004 Subject: [oak perl] Perl Scripts for Your Linux Environment Message-ID: <1038720218.18656.38.camel@moe> George asked for scripts that are being used, so I figured I would start the ball rolling with a 'tagline rotator' script. It's not very fancy, but it does the job. Start by putting your favorite taglines in a file somewhere. One per line, like so: This mail certified anthrax free. rm -fr /bin/laden shred -uzf /bin/laden Next setup a cron job to run your script how ever frequently you want to rotate your tagline. My cronjob looks like this: 0-59/5 * * * * /home/cajun/HOME/bin/makesig The cron job just runs the script 'makesig' every 5 minutes. Oh, and don't forget to setup your mailer to add your signature to all messages. The script writes out the signature to ~/.signature And lastly, here's the script: #!/usr/bin/perl -w use strict; my $debug=0; my $home='/home/cajun'; my $siginfile="$home/HOME/sig/sigfile"; my $tearline=" \n"; my $uptime=`uptime`; my $outfile="$home/\.signature"; my $linuxreg=" Linux Registered User #241685 http://counter.li.org\n"; open(INFILE,"$siginfile") or die "Can't open $siginfile :$!"; open(OUTFILE,">$outfile") or die "Sorry, but I can't write to $outfile :$!"; my %hash; while(){ # build a hash with $. as key and $_ as value $hash{$.}=$_; } my $rand=rand($.); my @body; push (@body, $tearline); push (@body, qq( $hash{sprintf("%.0f", ($rand))})); push (@body, $uptime); push (@body, $tearline); push (@body, $linuxreg); if ($debug){ print @body; } else { print OUTFILE @body; } close INFILE; close OUTFILE; Thanks, Mike -- Netnews is like yelling, "Anyone want to buy a used car?" in a crowded theater. 9:09pm up 8 days, 20:48, 4 users, load average: 1.13, 1.19, 1.09 Linux Registered User #241685 http://counter.li.org