From amoore at mooresystems.com  Thu Jan  6 12:45:19 2011
From: amoore at mooresystems.com (Andrew Moore)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 14:45:19 -0600
Subject: [Kc] January meeting
Message-ID: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>

Happy New Year, KC PMers -

The regularly scheduled January meeting falls on Tuesday the 11th.
Unfortunately, I'll be unable to attend. If there are a few folks that
would like to get together, could someone make sure to grab a table at
Barley's?

-Andy

From djgoku at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 16:09:24 2011
From: djgoku at gmail.com (Jonathan Otsuka)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 18:09:24 -0600
Subject: [Kc] January meeting
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F5E10E88-27CC-4E64-B316-229D63DA5FFD@gmail.com>

I plan on attending but will not be there until 7:50.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 6, 2011, at 2:45 PM, Andrew Moore <amoore at mooresystems.com> wrote:

> Happy New Year, KC PMers -
> 
> The regularly scheduled January meeting falls on Tuesday the 11th.
> Unfortunately, I'll be unable to attend. If there are a few folks that
> would like to get together, could someone make sure to grab a table at
> Barley's?
> 
> -Andy
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc

From djgoku at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 21:09:28 2011
From: djgoku at gmail.com (djgoku)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 23:09:28 -0600
Subject: [Kc] January meeting
In-Reply-To: <F5E10E88-27CC-4E64-B316-229D63DA5FFD@gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>
	<F5E10E88-27CC-4E64-B316-229D63DA5FFD@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=BQmM_E++QGwz-GNT+RvfT9051opAoza0bm4Rk@mail.gmail.com>

Anyone plan on being there tomorrow?

Jonathan

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Jonathan Otsuka <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:
> I plan on attending but will not be there until 7:50.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 6, 2011, at 2:45 PM, Andrew Moore <amoore at mooresystems.com> wrote:
>
>> Happy New Year, KC PMers -
>>
>> The regularly scheduled January meeting falls on Tuesday the 11th.
>> Unfortunately, I'll be unable to attend. If there are a few folks that
>> would like to get together, could someone make sure to grab a table at
>> Barley's?
>>
>> -Andy
>> _______________________________________________
>> kc mailing list
>> kc at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>

From stephenclouse at gmail.com  Tue Jan 11 15:40:34 2011
From: stephenclouse at gmail.com (Stephen Clouse)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 17:40:34 -0600
Subject: [Kc] January meeting
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=BQmM_E++QGwz-GNT+RvfT9051opAoza0bm4Rk@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>
	<F5E10E88-27CC-4E64-B316-229D63DA5FFD@gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BQmM_E++QGwz-GNT+RvfT9051opAoza0bm4Rk@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinG4aUjf-OgafBPGetA8puygnkkMBfjBfifpcoB@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:09 PM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:

> Anyone plan on being there tomorrow?
>

You know I'm always down as long as someone else is going.

But I hate taking the time to drive it and then having no one show.
Happened to me one too many times at Planet Sub, so I always wait until a
couple of people confirm before I officially commit.

-- 
Stephen Clouse <stephenclouse at gmail.com>
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From paul.millard at gmail.com  Tue Jan 11 16:02:06 2011
From: paul.millard at gmail.com (Paul Millard)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 18:02:06 -0600
Subject: [Kc] January meeting
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinG4aUjf-OgafBPGetA8puygnkkMBfjBfifpcoB@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinKcnMEf2KeEo4Ln0cy-CtLpFp=SmoaYFRk8QvV@mail.gmail.com>
	<F5E10E88-27CC-4E64-B316-229D63DA5FFD@gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BQmM_E++QGwz-GNT+RvfT9051opAoza0bm4Rk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinG4aUjf-OgafBPGetA8puygnkkMBfjBfifpcoB@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinOcvNr6oh-A21WcFFxC=u+Kk2RVav8jykvU8oD@mail.gmail.com>

I won't be able to make it this month, but hope to be there next month.

Paul Millard

BTW, our company has a 3 month contract-to-perm possibility right now, all
telecommute.  Working in Catalyst and other.  If interested you can contact
me, or contact direct - http://jobs.perl.org/job/13444.
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From djgoku at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 08:48:49 2011
From: djgoku at gmail.com (djgoku)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 10:48:49 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>

I thought I would ask here also. I am trying to tests some simple web
forms, but not sure what all needs to be tested. I can see at least 2
test cases. The form is submitted and a field isn't valid; The form is
submitted and is valid and user is redirect; I have been looking at
Test::WWW::Mechanize (submit_form_ok()), Test::WWW::Selenium and
Selenium IDE, but I am not sure the best way of testing all cases.

http://www.backup-manager.org/pipermail/dancer-users/2011-January/000814.html

Jonathan

From davidnicol at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 09:03:39 2011
From: davidnicol at gmail.com (David Nicol)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:03:39 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>

what's Dancer?

for simple web page testing, using curl or wget to fetch the page to
standard output and piping that through grep often is sufficient and
easier to set up than something more purpose-built.

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 10:48 AM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:
> I thought I would ask here also. I am trying to tests some simple web
> forms, but not sure what all needs to be tested. I can see at least 2
> test cases. The form is submitted and a field isn't valid; The form is
> submitted and is valid and user is redirect; I have been looking at
> Test::WWW::Mechanize (submit_form_ok()), Test::WWW::Selenium and
> Selenium IDE, but I am not sure the best way of testing all cases.
>
> http://www.backup-manager.org/pipermail/dancer-users/2011-January/000814.html
>
> Jonathan
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>



-- 
?The aeroplane is fatally defective. It is merely a toy?a sporting
play-thing. ?It can never become commercially practical." -- Nikola
Tesla

From doug.sparling at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 09:17:24 2011
From: doug.sparling at gmail.com (Doug Sparling)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:17:24 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=YSVers6CuTZrVnSGPOR-5c5QPMqhJMA3NJjxP@mail.gmail.com>

If you're automating your tests, I'd go with something like the Selenium
library. I haven't done much Perl for three or four years, so I can only
speak from experience that's non-Perl related. We used Selenium (and
Cucumber/Webrat, as at the time I was doing RoR) for automated integration
testing, testing forms, and TDD/BDD. If it's off the cuff/simple testing,
I'd use curl.

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:03 AM, David Nicol <davidnicol at gmail.com> wrote:

> what's Dancer?
>
> for simple web page testing, using curl or wget to fetch the page to
> standard output and piping that through grep often is sufficient and
> easier to set up than something more purpose-built.
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 10:48 AM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I thought I would ask here also. I am trying to tests some simple web
> > forms, but not sure what all needs to be tested. I can see at least 2
> > test cases. The form is submitted and a field isn't valid; The form is
> > submitted and is valid and user is redirect; I have been looking at
> > Test::WWW::Mechanize (submit_form_ok()), Test::WWW::Selenium and
> > Selenium IDE, but I am not sure the best way of testing all cases.
> >
> >
> http://www.backup-manager.org/pipermail/dancer-users/2011-January/000814.html
> >
> > Jonathan
> > _______________________________________________
> > kc mailing list
> > kc at pm.org
> > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
> >
>
>
>
> --
> ?The aeroplane is fatally defective. It is merely a toy?a sporting
> play-thing.  It can never become commercially practical." -- Nikola
> Tesla
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>
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From djgoku at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 09:25:01 2011
From: djgoku at gmail.com (djgoku)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:25:01 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinMNQ5eY6tgsqtXFryV12ZDdRgaAMhzJ-u9Xg7d@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:03 AM, David Nicol <davidnicol at gmail.com> wrote:
> what's Dancer?

Web framework similar to Sinatra but in perl.

http://perldancer.org/

> for simple web page testing, using curl or wget to fetch the page to
> standard output and piping that through grep often is sufficient and
> easier to set up than something more purpose-built.

Well I want something automated since I will have at least two other forms.

> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 10:48 AM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I thought I would ask here also. I am trying to tests some simple web
>> forms, but not sure what all needs to be tested. I can see at least 2
>> test cases. The form is submitted and a field isn't valid; The form is
>> submitted and is valid and user is redirect; I have been looking at
>> Test::WWW::Mechanize (submit_form_ok()), Test::WWW::Selenium and
>> Selenium IDE, but I am not sure the best way of testing all cases.
>>
>> http://www.backup-manager.org/pipermail/dancer-users/2011-January/000814.html
>>
>> Jonathan
>> _______________________________________________
>> kc mailing list
>> kc at pm.org
>> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ?The aeroplane is fatally defective. It is merely a toy?a sporting
> play-thing. ?It can never become commercially practical." -- Nikola
> Tesla
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc

From djgoku at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 09:31:25 2011
From: djgoku at gmail.com (djgoku)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:31:25 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=YSVers6CuTZrVnSGPOR-5c5QPMqhJMA3NJjxP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=YSVers6CuTZrVnSGPOR-5c5QPMqhJMA3NJjxP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimJNEiULsUfr8wL6Twd_2Ws90Cu4nL9BV-tdx=Y@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:17 AM, Doug Sparling <doug.sparling at gmail.com> wrote:
> If you're automating your tests, I'd go with something like the Selenium
> library. I haven't done much Perl for three or four years, so I can only
> speak from experience that's non-Perl related. We used Selenium (and
> Cucumber/Webrat, as at the time I was doing RoR) for automated integration
> testing, testing forms, and TDD/BDD. If it's off the cuff/simple testing,
> I'd use curl.

When you used Selenium did you do form testing? I am not sure what all
needs to be tested.

I currently have this(Test::WWW::Mechanize):
$mech->get_ok('http://localhost:3000/form');
$mech->title_is('AppName', 'Make sure were on the AppName page');
$mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1, fields => { name => 'test'
}}, 'adding a name worked');

But if I change submit_form_ok to (the test still passes even though I
didn't pass in the name field):
$mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1}, 'adding a name shouldn''t work');

Jonathan

From sterling at hanenkamp.com  Wed Jan 12 09:51:59 2011
From: sterling at hanenkamp.com (Sterling Hanenkamp)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:51:59 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimJNEiULsUfr8wL6Twd_2Ws90Cu4nL9BV-tdx=Y@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=YSVers6CuTZrVnSGPOR-5c5QPMqhJMA3NJjxP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimJNEiULsUfr8wL6Twd_2Ws90Cu4nL9BV-tdx=Y@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTik7+TT_JBJmrKPbDrww_g0+D0+J_BP4Xa3xvGMA@mail.gmail.com>

We use Selenium extensively to handle integration testing of our
Perl/JavaScript-based application and it works quite well. You have to spend
some time getting things bootstrapped for your needs, but after that it is
very nice. We started with a test suite like the one you show below, often
recorded using the Selenium IDE. After that we enhanced the system so that
now we have our own natural language layer we use to build tests. (The
natural language allows business analyst to read the tests.)

Selenium testing is valuable for regression testing as well. We can run the
test suite and know with reasonable certainty that new changes to the Perl
code or the JavaScript haven't broken the app in any of the major browsers.
(Or that it has and either a test or the app needs to be fixed.)

In general, when writing web applications, I would recommend writing
internal unit tests to verify that your models and business logic is
correct, but use Selenium or something like it to handle the integration
tests.

Unfortunately, I have no practical advice to offer since I'm not the testing
guru and haven't really messed with Selenium myself in 2-3 years. :)

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:31 AM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:17 AM, Doug Sparling <doug.sparling at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > If you're automating your tests, I'd go with something like the Selenium
> > library. I haven't done much Perl for three or four years, so I can only
> > speak from experience that's non-Perl related. We used Selenium (and
> > Cucumber/Webrat, as at the time I was doing RoR) for automated
> integration
> > testing, testing forms, and TDD/BDD. If it's off the cuff/simple testing,
> > I'd use curl.
>
> When you used Selenium did you do form testing? I am not sure what all
> needs to be tested.
>
> I currently have this(Test::WWW::Mechanize):
> $mech->get_ok('http://localhost:3000/form');
> $mech->title_is('AppName', 'Make sure were on the AppName page');
> $mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1, fields => { name => 'test'
> }}, 'adding a name worked');
>
> But if I change submit_form_ok to (the test still passes even though I
> didn't pass in the name field):
> $mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1}, 'adding a name shouldn''t work');
>
> Jonathan
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>



-- 
Andrew Sterling Hanenkamp
sterling at hanenkamp.com
785.370.4454
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From amoore at mooresystems.com  Wed Jan 12 09:57:34 2011
From: amoore at mooresystems.com (Andrew Moore)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 11:57:34 -0600
Subject: [Kc] Testing Forms
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimJNEiULsUfr8wL6Twd_2Ws90Cu4nL9BV-tdx=Y@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=k6B5cq5XwFeGaPr-K0RkDohV+TMwhchnycCWP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=vCyMc6q0=QtJ+c=usAbAqBFxyb-oyvorXvXs7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=YSVers6CuTZrVnSGPOR-5c5QPMqhJMA3NJjxP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimJNEiULsUfr8wL6Twd_2Ws90Cu4nL9BV-tdx=Y@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin1JUJ+LyR5iY+bNDcSF0SEVxSusiLfGX2=KFw2@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:31 AM, djgoku <djgoku at gmail.com> wrote:
> When you used Selenium did you do form testing? I am not sure what all
> needs to be tested.
>
> I currently have this(Test::WWW::Mechanize):
> $mech->get_ok('http://localhost:3000/form');
> $mech->title_is('AppName', 'Make sure were on the AppName page');
> $mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1, fields => { name => 'test'
> }}, 'adding a name worked');
>
> But if I change submit_form_ok to (the test still passes even though I
> didn't pass in the name field):
> $mech->submit_form_ok({form_number => 1}, 'adding a name shouldn''t work');

It looks to me like that probably should pass. It's checking that you
were able to successfully submit the form. Now, you may want to check
that the page that you received is the form again (and not the
"success" page) and has some kind of error message on it, like "You
forgot to fill out the name field" or some such.

Does that make sense?

-Andy

From davidnicol at gmail.com  Thu Jan 27 10:06:20 2011
From: davidnicol at gmail.com (David Nicol)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 12:06:20 -0600
Subject: [Kc] any underemployed Oracle/DBI gurus?
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=i3jeTQHbqkSEfZbfGtG_t-giNHjQurVvRoXOJ@mail.gmail.com>

That may be an oxymoron. I've been offered a referral bonus.

From hochwender at centurytel.net  Sat Jan 29 14:01:29 2011
From: hochwender at centurytel.net (Curt Hochwender)
Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 16:01:29 -0600
Subject: [Kc] any underemployed Oracle/DBI gurus?
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=i3jeTQHbqkSEfZbfGtG_t-giNHjQurVvRoXOJ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <OHEFLONHACLKBFFJPOOOIEBOCAAA.hochwender@centurytel.net>

Any details? part-time, full-time, or contact?

-----Original Message-----
From: kc-bounces+hochwender=centurytel.net at pm.org
[mailto:kc-bounces+hochwender=centurytel.net at pm.org]On Behalf Of David
Nicol
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 12:06 PM
To: kcpm
Subject: [Kc] any underemployed Oracle/DBI gurus?


That may be an oxymoron. I've been offered a referral bonus.
_______________________________________________
kc mailing list
kc at pm.org
http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc


From jamithireddy at gmail.com  Sat Jan 29 14:56:03 2011
From: jamithireddy at gmail.com (jamithireddy ramakrishna)
Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 16:56:03 -0600
Subject: [Kc] any underemployed Oracle/DBI gurus?
In-Reply-To: <OHEFLONHACLKBFFJPOOOIEBOCAAA.hochwender@centurytel.net>
References: <AANLkTi=i3jeTQHbqkSEfZbfGtG_t-giNHjQurVvRoXOJ@mail.gmail.com>
	<OHEFLONHACLKBFFJPOOOIEBOCAAA.hochwender@centurytel.net>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimcJDD89kRUrEw1LFQwVPuWFNM-DN0zB+at4tW7@mail.gmail.com>

Looking for fulltime.

Regards,
Venkata
On Jan 29, 2011 4:01 PM, "Curt Hochwender" <hochwender at centurytel.net>
wrote:
>
> Any details? part-time, full-time, or contact?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: kc-bounces+hochwender=centurytel.net at pm.org
> [mailto:kc-bounces+hochwender <kc-bounces%2Bhochwender>=centurytel.net@
pm.org]On Behalf Of David
> Nicol
> Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 12:06 PM
> To: kcpm
> Subject: [Kc] any underemployed Oracle/DBI gurus?
>
>
> That may be an oxymoron. I've been offered a referral bonus.
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
>
> _______________________________________________
> kc mailing list
> kc at pm.org
> http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/kc
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