From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 1 19:45:45 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: O'Reilly Publishes a Practical Approach to Algorithms with C Message-ID: <199909020040.UAA08433@astro.fccj.cc.fl.us> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Christina Silveira (707)829-0515 ext. 339 cms@oreilly.com http://www.oreilly.com September 1, 1999 O'Reilly Publishes a Practical Approach to Algorithms with C SEBASTOPOL, CA-O'Reilly and Associates, well-known (and respected) publishers of technical books, has ventured down the well-worn path of algorithm book publishing with two new algorithm books with a decidedly O'Reilly flavor. The just-released Mastering Algorithms with Perl book is the first book ever to focus on using algorithms in Perl. Mastering Algorithms with C, also just-released, takes a new approach to a somewhat older subject. There are many books on data structures and algorithms, but Mastering Algorithms with C, by Kyle Loudon, gives you a unique combination of theoretical background and working code. In offering robust solutions for everyday programming tasks, Mastering Algorithms with C avoids the abstract style of most classic data structures and algorithm texts but still provides all the information you need to understand the purpose and use of common programming techniques. "This is not a theoretical book," says O'Reilly editor Andy Oram. "It is an extremely practical approach to algorithms. The writing style is superb, and the code is very clean. This code is easy to update, and adaptable to a variety of situations. Loudon offers a collection of key algorithms that you'll use over and over again in your career." "When one studies data structures and algorithms, a fair amount of time is sent proving their correctness. Consequently, many books on this subject have an academic feel to them and details such as implementation and application are left to be resolved elsewhere," says author Kyle Loudon. "This book covers how and why certain data structures and algorithms work, real applications that use them (including many examples) and their implementation. Mathematical rigor appears only to the extent necessary in explanations." Implementations, as well as interesting, real-world examples of each data structure and algorithms, are shown in the text. Full source code appears on the accompanying disk. Loudon shows you how to use such essential data structures as lists, stacks, queues, sets, trees, heaps, priority queues, and graphs. He shows you how to use algorithms for sorting, searching, numerical analysis, data compression, data encryption, common graph problems, and computational geometry. He also describes the relative efficiency of all implementations. The compression and encryption chapters not only give you working code for reasonably efficient solutions, they explain concepts in an approachable manner for people who never have had the time or expertise to study them in depth. Anyone with a basic understanding of the C language can use this book. For more information about Mastering Algorithms with C, including Table of Contents, index, author bio, and sample chapter, see: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/masteralgoc/ For a cover graphic in jpeg format go to: ftp://ftp.ora.com/pub/graphics/book_covers/hi-res/1565924533.jpg ### Mastering Algorithms with C By Kyle Loudon 1st Edition August 1999 (US) 1-56592-453-3, 560 pages, $34.95 (US$), Includes Diskette (800) 998-9938 The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Tue Sep 21 15:33:53 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: No subject Message-ID: <19990921203353.2530.rocketmail@web903.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - Good afternoon Jax PM, Is it just me, or is perl just a lot easier with Linux/Apache? I just joined this list today, and I hope to learn a lot from it. I'm a novice perl cgi hacker, just trying to accept data from forms on a web page. The web page is a survey made up of a series of questions answered using radio buttons and text boxes. The web server is IIS 4.0 (actually "personal web server") running on NT4 WKS. The problem is that when I activate the link to a test perl script with a sample parameter, i.e. /cgi-bin/result.pl?flavor=mint and the script is this: use CGI qw(:cgi); print header(), start_html("Hello world"), h1("Hello world"); my $favorite = param("flavor"); print p("your favorite flavor is $favorite"); print end_html(); now when I click on it, the browser asks what to do with the file I want to download (you know the drill - open it or save it ;). I know the setup is hosed but click on "open it" anyways to see what will happen, and the server launches a CMD.EXE window with the script running in it, telling me: (offline mode: enter name=value pairs on standard input) Obviously the parameters didn't get passed to the script, since when I invoke the script from the command line as ./result.pl flavor=mint it outputs the full html output. I know that I have the modules loaded since the script outputs the html then it gets the parameters properly, I just can't pass them properly. Any ideas on how to fix this? (by the way I'm stuck with the NT/IIS combo ;) Thanks in advance, Nate === nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Byte/9853/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From jproctor at oit.umass.edu Wed Sep 22 08:29:14 1999 From: jproctor at oit.umass.edu (j proctor) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: your mail In-Reply-To: <19990921203353.2530.rocketmail@web903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; j proctor wrote - > Is it just me, or is perl just a lot easier with Linux/Apache? Yup. :) > The web server is IIS 4.0 (actually "personal web server") running on > NT4 WKS. > > The problem is that when I activate the link to a test perl script with > a sample parameter, i.e. /cgi-bin/result.pl?flavor=mint ... > now when I click on it, the browser asks what to do with the file I > want to download (you know the drill - open it or save it ;). > I know the setup is hosed but click on "open it" anyways to see what > will happen, and the server launches a CMD.EXE window with the script > running in it, telling me: > (offline mode: enter name=value pairs on standard input) I've never actually tried configuring IIS or, for that matter, running Perl on a Win32 system for anything other than minor tinkering, but it sounds like what's going on is that IIS doesn't realise /cgi-bin/result.pl is supposed to be executed as a CGI program, so it tries to send it to you, then your browser realises that it really is a program and runs the copy IIS sent (without all the handy parameter-passing that a web *server* is supposed to do for a CGI). Doublecheck your configs and make sure the server knows .pl files (in /cgi-bin) are supposed to be executable. j The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 22 08:22:03 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: Message-ID: <199909221319.JAA01905@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - > use CGI qw(:cgi); > print header(), start_html("Hello world"), h1("Hello world"); > my $favorite = param("flavor"); > print p("your favorite flavor is $favorite"); > print end_html(); One question I have is "Did you install ActiveState Perl?" ActiveState Perl has three different downloads, which installed in the wrong order can cause this type of behavior. You basically can correct it by associating the CGI type with the Perl executable. I am pretty sure that CGI scripts should be called somescriptname.cgi (you know, with a CGI extension.) ActiveState Perl, when installed wrong, can actually cause a big security hole in your system. I can write a script named deletedisks.pl and have you access it from a WWW server, it will ask you to download or open, etc; when you open it BANG bye bye disks... Be very careful with Perl on Windows (of any version.) HTH, -Sneex- :] ________________________________________________________ eval join '', map { (split //, (' $().s/rlenJ2Ei;o"_MNP' .'3Ot5{R}G*k,HILSTp1X\ab4cduvwhgA='))[$_] } split /\D+/, "d1o18n53'17t11_23y34o20u0_37t33h13i0n11k52_40t0h21a13t 27_35t0h19o23s20e29_13p27e36r0l11_0m42o45n31g5e16r10s48_ 14f8r8o9m0_21j9a7c8k0o19n16s10o51n9v7i5l0l11e41_10a17r 15e0_6c0o2o2l4?3_3y0o6u15_0k46n16o0w26_0t38h7a14t10_24t 0h5e47y43_5a24r7e2_1w18o32r12l25d3_15r0e28n0o49u50n14d8_ 9a0n2d0_5t6h2e2y4_3d4o26_12c22o28o3l0_1s12t0u2f4f3.2_4g 30i3v0e2_4y3o1u6r1s39e1l25f0_1t12e0n1_44p0o1i22n6t0s3"; The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Wed Sep 22 12:16:45 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: Perl and IIS trouble resolved Message-ID: <19990922171645.2219.rocketmail@web901.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - I fixed my problem, I just had to remember the Windows mentality: When all else fails- reinstall! Since it seemed that file associations were what was killing me, and newsgroup postings that swore would fix the problem just made it worse, I decided to reinstall ActivePerl. It associated the interpreter, the perlscript dll and (I think) perl for ISAPI all for me. Now the script runs fine :) Of course I'd still like to try this and see what happens: C:\perl -e 's/WinNT(4.0)/Linux(Debian-2.2)/' will WinNT go away and Linux appear on my desktop? Till next time - Nate === nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Byte/9853/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 22 13:04:23 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: Perl and IIS trouble resolved Message-ID: <199909221802.OAA06897@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - > Nate wrote - > > > I fixed my problem, :] > I just had to remember the Windows mentality: > When all else fails- reinstall! There-in lies the Windows paradox... > C:\perl -e 's/WinNT(4.0)/Linux(Debian-2.2)/' FORMAT C:\ is your friend! -Sneex- :] ____________________________________________________________________ Bill Jones * Data Security Specialist * http://jacksonville.pm.org/ FCCJ * 501 W State St * Jacksonville, FL 32202 * 1 (904) 632-3089 __ __ __ __ __ / // /__ ____ ___ __ __ / // /__ _____/ /_____ ____ / _ / _ `/ _ \/ _ \/ // / / _ / _ `/ __/ '_/ -_) __/ /_//_/\_,_/ .__/ .__/\_, / /_//_/\_,_/\__/_/\_\\__/_/ /_/ /_/ /___/ Running LinuxPPC RedHat 5.0 (Hurricane) __ _ http://www.linuxppc.org / /(_)_ __ _ ___ __ http://www.apache.org / / | | '_ \| | | \ \/ / http://www.redhat.com / /__| | | | | |_| |> < http://www.perl.com \____/_|_| |_|\__,_/_/\_\ http://www.gimp.org The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Sun Sep 26 19:14:33 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: perl script design question Message-ID: <19990927001433.21659.rocketmail@web901.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - JaxPM gurus, Here's a question about the design of a perl script that I'd like some feedback on. Long story short: a web based survey saves its parameters (appends) into a flat file. Each query appends about 60 lines into the file. I'm now generating the script to parse the results and give a report on a web page for the administrator of this survey. My concern is for the performance of this design - parsing each line in the file (pseudocode: if key matched, then foreach loop to get the value for that key) instead of a DBM or other database. I only forsee having 50-200 people actually complete this survey, so is the flat file good enough? I'm certain that a full-fledged relational database isn't needed, but I know how much faster DBM files are than flat files. The only thing is the keys would be duplicated each time a new query was submitted, overwriting the old keys and values. Could/should I just parse the query as it came in from the browser, and increment some values in the flat file to register the values that they selected? This might not be too good if we get lots of hits at one time (like lunch or first thing in the AM). What are your thoughts? I know my sig says I'm a perl nut, and it's true, I'm just not too experienced a perl nut, yet. I'm actually amazed at how little I really know about perl, and how I can still produce very functional results with it. I just want to maximize the script ;) Of course I'm happy to give more details if I left anything out. ===== nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/catenate/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Sun Sep 26 19:48:13 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: perl script design question Message-ID: <19990927004813.10174.rocketmail@web904.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - > (pseudocode: > if key matched, then foreach loop to get the value for that key) Oops, you probably saw already that I meant I "foreach" through the file to find a match on a key, then multiple "if"s to get the value. Sorry, not that it really matters too much anyways... ===== nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/catenate/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Sun Sep 26 20:37:42 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: perl script design question Message-ID: <199909270136.VAA11324@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - > Nate wrote - > instead of a DBM or other database. I only forsee having 50-200 people > actually complete this survey, so is the flat file good enough? I do not foresee any problems. There are some die-hard DB fans that would say otherwise... > the keys would be duplicated each time a new query was submitted, > overwriting the old keys and values. Why? Generating unique keys would be a good thing, even for flat files... > Could/should I just parse the query as it came in from the browser, and > increment some values in the flat file to register the values that they > selected? This might not be too good if we get lots of hits at one time > (like lunch or first thing in the AM). If you get 'lots' of hits then whatever you do would be better than nothing. Besides, your idea of 'lots' of hits when you say only 200 would be visiting is sort of mutually exclusive. Now, if you are going to get 200,000 'visitors' then we can talk. My Ultra-1 starts having trouble at about 100 concurrent CGI's (each running a complete perl run-time environment.) To really get good performance you need to develop Apache Mod_Perl modules. > What are your thoughts? I know my sig says I'm a perl nut, and it's > true, I'm just not too experienced a perl nut, yet. I'm actually amazed > at how little I really know about perl, and how I can still produce > very functional results with it. I just want to maximize the script ;) Crawl, walk, run, ride a bike, drive a car, fly a plane - we all must start somewhere :) > Of course I'm happy to give more details if I left anything out. Nah, we really don't write too many scripts on the JaxPM list; however, if you have a specific coding problem - then post it, someone may be able to help :) HTH, -Sneex- :] The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From dhowk at cybermax.net Mon Sep 27 04:42:01 1999 From: dhowk at cybermax.net (Doug Howk) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: nate Message-ID: <37EF3BE8.551750CD@cybermax.net> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Doug Howk wrote - At work, we use Access & Oracle for our web site; and have experienced some performance problems, ie.database server configuration problems, log files. If all you need for your web site is data from a form, I'd recommend appending records to a flat file as long as total size is reasonable. Only go to database if your site is dynameic or used for data entry. Doug The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From dstringf at fccjmail.fccj.cc.fl.us Mon Sep 27 08:59:39 1999 From: dstringf at fccjmail.fccj.cc.fl.us (Daniel Stringfield) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: Win32::OLE Message-ID: On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Daniel Stringfield wrote - I'm trying my hand at PERL on NT right now, and I am having some problems finding GOOD documentation on the Win32::OLE module. The only sample I have seen is the one that manipulates an Excel spreadsheet. What I'm trying to get examples of is manipulation of Word. There doesn't seem to be anything really out there. Any clues? -- ======= 40 4B 36 58 A0 C7 5A 8A 49 E0 39 54 00 20 A3 AA ======= Daniel Stringfield Florida Community College at Jacksonville ================================================================ The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From jproctor at oit.umass.edu Mon Sep 27 09:15:35 1999 From: jproctor at oit.umass.edu (j proctor) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: perl script design question In-Reply-To: <19990927001433.21659.rocketmail@web901.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; j proctor wrote - I think append and parse later is perfectly adequate for your needs this time. You're only talking about 1200 lines total; DBM may not actually be that much faster (especially if you've got the overhead of generating unique keys). Depending on the client and web server software, you may find that it's consistent in which order it reports the name/value pairs; I don't think the HTTP standard requires this, but they're passed through the environment (regardless of GET or POST) in a text string instead of a hash, so it's probably fairly trustworthy. Adding a record separator (a line of ___'s or something) and knowledge of what order you're getting the data can *greatly* speed up processing later. Run some tests to be sure; there may be some reason for a browser to deviate from orginial html form order, but I can't think of it--if you were a browser that needed to send a text string of form data back to a server, wouldn't you just go through the file and append input field names and user-entered values? If I had an actual database server running, I'd consider something like a queued transactional update, but on a survey of this size it would really be for the academic enjoyment of knowing I had written it than out of any necessity. j The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 29 08:42:06 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:07 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <199909291339.JAA12938@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - > Sorry about that That was sent from our office network . . . I was unaware > that it was set to send HTML rather than plain text . . . > > Are you all a pretty active group? > > Tim > Not really. Everyone is listening to everyone else (sort of like SETI) and no one wants to be the first to speak. A few are posting, to be fair, but it is really a trickle... -FCCJ Data Security Group- ___________________________________________________________________ FCCJ 501 W. State St. Jacksonville, FL 32202 1 (904) 632-3089 The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Wed Sep 29 09:01:36 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <19990929140136.14255.rocketmail@web901.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - --- Bill Jones wrote: > On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; > "Bill Jones" wrote - > > Are you all a pretty active group? > > > > Tim > > > > Not really. Everyone is listening to everyone else (sort of like > SETI) and no one wants to be the first to speak. > > A few are posting, to be fair, but it is really a trickle... Last week I kind of felt out the group by asking a nuber of questions that might have gotten me flamed on certain lists (read: metioned Windoze), and I was pleasently surprised at the response. I got a number of intelligent and helpful replies, and no one told me not to post the things I had posted. If we don't really have a protocol established on the list, I'd like to propose one now. I'm really still a Perl beginner and I'd like to be able to ask for help not just with specific problems (like "How do I process binary data?") but with questions on general program design and approach to new Perl projects. I'd particulary like to see some experts discuss the approach/design issues. I say this because I can always read the Camel book or Perl Cookbook and see how to solve particular problems, but sometimes I'd like to hear from an experienced Perl hacker how they would approach a problem that I or others on the list might be facing. I have only Microsoft ASP people around me here, and they ARE NOT a valuable source of info on program design (read: couldn't tell you how to exit a MS-DOS prompt). I hope I'm not overstepping my bounds here, I just hope we can make this a good forum for newbies and experienced hackers alike. Responses/flames anyone? ===== nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/catenate/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 29 09:02:40 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Lost one... Message-ID: <199909291400.KAA13372@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - We lost a subscriber, so now we are at 14 members :( 14 is not too bad :) -Sneex- :] The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 29 09:11:41 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <199909291409.KAA13539@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - >> > Are you all a pretty active group? >> > We now have 14 members (lost one just a second ago...) >> >> Not really. Everyone is listening to everyone else (sort of like >> SETI) and no one wants to be the first to speak. >> >> A few are posting, to be fair, but it is really a trickle... > > Last week I kind of felt out the group by asking a nuber of questions > that might have gotten me flamed on certain lists (read: metioned > Windoze), and I was pleasently surprised at the response. > > I got a number of intelligent and helpful replies, and no one told me > not to post the things I had posted. That is sort of the point of local groups - to prevent BS from swamping the usenet groups and thus prevent flamewars, which are BS anyways... > If we don't really have a protocol established on the list, I'd like to > propose one now. > > > I'm really still a Perl beginner and I'd like to be able to ask for > help not just with specific problems (like "How do I process binary > data?") but with questions on general program design and approach to > new Perl projects. At one time I had started posting what I felt were beginner Scripts, but those who are more experienced got bored and the others were either VERY VERY quiet or just lost. I think mostly I am talking to myself, so ... I stopped talking as well :) > I'd particulary like to see some experts discuss the approach/design > issues. I say this because I can always read the Camel book or Perl > Cookbook and see how to solve particular problems, but sometimes I'd > like to hear from an experienced Perl hacker how they would approach a > problem that I or others on the list might be facing. I have only > Microsoft ASP people around me here, and they ARE NOT a valuable source > of info on program design (read: couldn't tell you how to exit a MS-DOS > prompt). > See my sig line for a possible resolution for MS-DOS... > I hope I'm not overstepping my bounds here, I just hope we can make > this a good forum for newbies and experienced hackers alike. > > > Responses/flames anyone? No, you are allowed to suggest a proposed course the group could take - but more than likely people will post what they working on at the time and not really follow a particular discussion corriculum... We are not moderated (yet), so if the discussions really get out of hand I can lock 'er up... I am not an expert by any stretch, but we as a group should be able to figure out just about anything. No? HTH, -Sneex- :] _____________________________________________________ c:\winnt> secure_nt.exe Securing NT. Insert Linux boot disk to continue... The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 29 09:14:23 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <199909291411.KAA13582@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - >>> > Are you all a pretty active group? >>> > > > We now have 14 members (lost one just a second ago...) > Oops! Make that 15! We just had another join! Waaa-hoooo! Now we're smokin' :) Everyone say Hi to the new member! -Sneex- :] PS - I'll shut up now ;) The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From webmaster at blindswholesale.com Wed Sep 29 09:21:34 1999 From: webmaster at blindswholesale.com (Tim Dumas - Webmaster) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <008701bf0a85$f24ca2a0$8021c7d8@jamehm> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Tim Dumas - Webmaster" wrote - Hey, everyone (all 14 of you), have any of you ever gotten together at all or do you all prefer lurking around watching Bill post things and muttering to himself. Personally I think this could be a really helpful forum for beginners and veterans alike. Tim Dumas - Webmaster www.blindswholesale.com webmaster@blindswholesale.com ($_ = "010010100111010101110011 01110100001000000110000101101 11001101111011101000110100001 10010101110010001000000010001 10010000100101111011101010111 00110111001000101111011000100 11010010110111000101111011100 00011001010111001001101100001 00000011010000110000101100011 01101011011001010111001000100 001") =~ s/([0|1]{8})/pack("C", unpack ("N", pack("B32", substr("0" x 32 . $1, -32))))/ge; print; The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From bill at fccj.org Wed Sep 29 09:51:17 1999 From: bill at fccj.org (Bill Jones) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] .Sig War! Message-ID: <199909291448.KAA13835@astro.fccj.org> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; "Bill Jones" wrote - Cute :) > ($_ = "010010100111010101110011 > 01110100001000000110000101101 > 11001101111011101000110100001 > 10010101110010001000000010001 > 10010000100101111011101010111 > 00110111001000101111011000100 > 11010010110111000101111011100 > 00011001010111001001101100001 > 00000011010000110000101100011 > 01101011011001010111001000100 > 001") =~ s/([0|1]{8})/pack("C", unpack > ("N", pack("B32", substr("0" x 32 . $1, > -32))))/ge; print; Actually - print unpack("u*", q{M(R$O=7-R+V)I;B]E;G8@8'1Y<&4@<&5R;"!\("]U; __DATA__ -Sneex- :] Just Another Perl Monger... _________________________________________________________________________ Bill Jones | Data Security Specialist | http://www.fccj.org/cgi/mail?dss FCCJ | 501 W State St | Jacksonville, FL 32202 | 1 (904) 632-3089 $_="JOIN THE JAX PERL MONGERS J zbjrnmuhkkd Pdqk Mnmfdqr J\n"; tr/za-y/a-z/; / ((.)) /; do { print substr($_,25); } while ( s/((.).{23}) $2 (.)(.*) (.)$/$1$5 $2 $4 $3/ ) The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From jproctor at oit.umass.edu Wed Sep 29 10:13:14 1999 From: jproctor at oit.umass.edu (j proctor) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] In-Reply-To: <199909291409.KAA13539@astro.fccj.org> Message-ID: On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; j proctor wrote - Welcome to the list, Tim, and whoever else just joined. >>> Not really. Everyone is listening to everyone else (sort of like >>> SETI) and no one wants to be the first to speak. Oh, I'd say we definitely fail SETI's tests. Remember, they require a regularly duplicable signal in the same location. Two of the most frequent posters on this list aren't even in Florida. :) >> Last week I kind of felt out the group by asking a nuber of questions >> that might have gotten me flamed on certain lists (read: metioned >> Windoze), and I was pleasently surprised at the response. >> >> I got a number of intelligent and helpful replies, and no one told me >> not to post the things I had posted. > > That is sort of the point of local groups - to prevent BS from swamping the > usenet groups and thus prevent flamewars, which are BS anyways... Well, not all lists are like that all the time. In my experience this past spring, the New York list (the original, actually, for those of you who aren't up on your PM history) was not friendly to non-expert type questions. It was curious, though, in that it wasn't like an elitism based on technical skill (there were acknowledged newbies on the list) or something like UNIX vs. Windows, it was simply that they consider themselves primarily a social group, so their list simply wasn't (isn't) the proper forum for technical questions. I enjoy this list and the others like it that allow anything (except flames, spam, and blatant job recruitment efforts). I unsubscribed from NY.pm in June. >> If we don't really have a protocol established on the list, I'd like to >> propose one now. No! No one's allowed to do anything like that without administrative approval! Fill out this form in triplicate (do not fold, spindle, staple, or mutilate), sign in the presence of a notary (affix seal below), and mail in an envelope to... [insert record-scratching noise] Yeah, whatever. I agree with Bill--people are going to post whatever Perl-like subject is of interest to them at the time. Sometimes it'll be amusing, more often I suspect it'll be a question related to a problem at hand. Even those of us who are more experienced with Perl sometimes miss something obvious that fresh eyes can spot. > I think mostly I am talking to myself, so ... And this is different from normal how? :) (No offence, Bill. I probably shouldn't tease someone so much that I haven't ever actually met, but you're a convenient twelve or thirteen hundred miles away, and a ready target.) >> I'd particulary like to see some experts discuss the approach/design >> issues. This does sound interesting, even as one of the folks that would probably get lumped into the "expert" category (at least on this list). It's difficult to describe how I know which approach I want to take when solving a new problem. There is a definite art to programming (probably more so than science, although that doesn't stop schools from churning out CS majors to become programmers). I'm certainly not above discussing my art, as well as learning about the techniques of others. But, did you have any examples in mind? Post a problem and see how a couple of us respond to it? We tried that, didn't we, with only a couple fewer listmembers? As strange as it is to try to put words to how I know I'll want a particular data structure later on in my code, it's even weirder to think about some general rules for "What to Think about When You Have to Write a Perl Program". Talk to us, Nate. Okay, that's enough rambling from me. j P.S. I got "mail in an envelope to" from the change of address form on the web site of the Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles. I just moved, and I was really hoping to mail my change of address form in a beat up old shoebox (since I haven't found and unpacked the envelopes yet). The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From catenate at yahoo.com Wed Sep 29 11:38:40 1999 From: catenate at yahoo.com (Nate) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] Message-ID: <19990929163840.21656.rocketmail@web904.mail.yahoo.com> On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; Nate wrote - --- j proctor wrote: > On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; > j proctor wrote - > > >> If we don't really have a protocol established on the list, I'd > like to > >> propose one now. > > No! No one's allowed to do anything like that without administrative > approval Point taken, but I just wanted to see not so much if it was allowed as perhaps disallowed. I was seeing if this list would respond with something like what you said the people on the New York list said. > > >> I'd particulary like to see some experts discuss the > approach/design > >> issues. > > This does sound interesting, even as one of the folks that would > probably > get lumped into the "expert" category (at least on this list). It's > difficult to describe how I know which approach I want to take when > solving a new problem. There is a definite art to programming > (probably > more so than science, although that doesn't stop schools from > churning out > CS majors to become programmers). I'm certainly not above discussing > my > art, as well as learning about the techniques of others. > > But, did you have any examples in mind? Post a problem and see how a > couple of us respond to it? I don't have any new ones to ask about right now but I'm glad that I can do this, since I have no real "mentor" type people at work. I'm trapped in an NT world here (Naval Hospital Jacksonville) for another few weeks until I transfer back into civilian life (in CA) again. Boy I'll be glad to leave it behind. I'll certainly stay on this list, though, since so far now I've come into contact with about 5 different Perl hackers that actually typed out multi-page emails to help me out :) Thanks guys, ===== nate catenate@yahoo.com [infosec|linux|perl] nut my infosec favorites -> www.geocities.com/catenate/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments... From jproctor at oit.umass.edu Wed Sep 29 11:56:03 1999 From: jproctor at oit.umass.edu (j proctor) Date: Thu Aug 5 00:03:08 2004 Subject: [JaxPM] In-Reply-To: <19990929163840.21656.rocketmail@web904.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On the Jax.PM jacksonville-pm-list; j proctor wrote - >> No! No one's allowed to do anything like that without administrative >> approval > > Point taken, but I just wanted to see not so much if it was allowed as > perhaps disallowed. I was seeing if this list would respond with > something like what you said the people on the New York list said. Psst. I was kidding. > I'm trapped in an NT world here (Naval Hospital Jacksonville) for > another few weeks until I transfer back into civilian life (in CA) > again. Boy I'll be glad to leave it behind. I'll certainly stay on this > list, though, since so far now I've come into contact with about 5 > different Perl hackers that actually typed out multi-page emails to > help me out :) Drat. Then I won't be the farthest from Jax anymore. j The Jacksonville Perl Monger's Group is operated by - Bill -Sneex- Jones ( sneex@usa.net ), to whom send all praises, complaints, or comments...