<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; "><BR><DIV><DIV>On Jul 18, 2007, at 5:10 PM, Jonathan Hogue wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV>good discussion. I was having this same conversationon the side.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To me, there's two points. perl's bit of a dieing language. ie, most new projects are in Java, .net or maybe Ruby. Most companies that do perl are in a containment mode or are in the process of converting to some other technology. And a lot of the talent that used to do Perl are now doing other things (java, .net, Ruby or something completely different).<BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Sometimes I ponder on that "dieing" thing. One doesn't see too many perl articles on dzone, digg, etc. But is that because the other languages don't have things like local perl monger's groups (I know CMH has a Ruby group now), perl Monks, use.perl and the best tool of all cpan? How many of those other languages that are always being blogged about have the vast resources that cpan gives perl, available to them - now?? Or is it because instead of blogging about 10 different variations of the same simple sets of ruby/php code, people are actually just coding away in Perl instead of blogging about it?</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>I guess it all depends on where you work. Some places are Perl shops. Some vb, .net, rails, java, c, whatever. Each has many frameworks, that different shops choose (or not) to use.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <DIV>I haven't worked in Perl in over 2 years. My experience is out dated. So most perl interviews are a waste of time because they end up being dead ends.</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV>But how many years did you spend coding in it? How fast, if you wanted to, do you think you could "pick it up again"?</DIV><DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <DIV>Also, because Perl is being used less and less in application development projects, and by doing Perl development I'm missing opportunities to learn more marketable technologies, it's a bit of a dead end career move to.<BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>I think it depends on where you work. But most places I've worked - learn something new? 'Do it on your own time.' Then they don't understand why you get hired away at a larger salary because you know more and you're more valuable. Hmmm. Seems like a pattern to me, but what do I know? ;) (as I pickup another programming book)</DIV><BR><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV> </DIV> <DIV> That doesn't mean that I won't take Perl positions, but I look to be paid a premium ($150-300 an hour) to even consider going through the interview process and jumping into a position whose main benefit is the pay.<BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Heh, I've never been paid to consider/go through an interview process. My hats off to ya :)</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV> Shane</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><BR><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV> </DIV><DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class="gmail_quote">On 7/18/07, <B class="gmail_sendername">shane</B> <<A href="mailto:shane@lottadot.com">shane@lottadot.com</A>> wrote:</SPAN> <BLOCKQUOTE class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"> <DIV style="WORD-WRAP: break-word">Ok, thanks. <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV>Well, I guess I'll just speak up. My reason for asking about the salary was slightly two-fold. I've heard of two people who "know their stuff" in Columbus being hired, starting in the 90's, this past month, for Perl programming. Yours is the second job posting in a week that I've been emailed about that wants someone who knows their stuff, would only do Perl, is advertising in the 80's and is having problems finding someone. These were guys who had a few years experience, not 7,10 or 15 like some of may around here. But they are good. </DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV>I'm not trying to diss on your parade by mentioning the above, nor start a salary-flame-war (is there such a thing? probably if I google it) but rather (bluntly) point out your range may be too low. And like HOGUEJ, I would rather see people sending job postings to the Columbus-pm when they're local here (rather than make you wade through the perljobs listserv which seems to rarely have Ohio jobs in it). </DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck,</DIV> <DIV><SPAN class="sg"> <DIV> Shane</DIV></SPAN> <DIV><SPAN class="e" id="q_113db1be475e80c1_2"> <DIV><BR> <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV><BR> <DIV> <DIV>On Jul 18, 2007, at 4:28 PM, Scott Blickhan wrote:</DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><SPAN style="WORD-SPACING: 0px; FONT: 12px Helvetica; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); TEXT-INDENT: 0px; WHITE-SPACE: normal; LETTER-SPACING: normal; BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px"> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV><P style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Thanks Shane –</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P><P style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> The salary range would be in the mid to upper 80's total compensation for a strong candidate.</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P><P style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><FONT face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: rgb(0,0,128); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Scott</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV><DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"> </SPAN></SPAN></FONT><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman">Salary range they are offering would be most helpful here. It'd show what level of "Lead Perl Developer" they're really wanting vs willing to pay for. </SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P> <DIV><DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"> </SPAN></SPAN></FONT><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV></DIV> <DIV><P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"> Shane</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <DIV><DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size="3"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times New Roman"> </SPAN></SPAN></FONT><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV><BR> </SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR> </DIV></DIV></SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Columbus-pm mailing list<BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://columbus.pm.org/Columbus-pm@pm.org" target="_blank"> http://columbus.pm.org/<BR>Columbus-pm@pm.org</A><BR><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/columbus-pm" target="_blank">http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/columbus-pm </A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><BR clear="all"><BR>-- <BR>Jonathan Hogue<BR><A href="mailto:jon@hogue.org">jon@hogue.org</A><BR>740-474-9170</BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></BODY></HTML>