From jeff_sumner at hotmail.com Sat Oct 1 17:14:30 2005 From: jeff_sumner at hotmail.com (Jeff Sumner) Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 00:14:30 +0000 Subject: APM: Back Issues of The Perl Journal for sale. 1996-2001 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I'm trying to gid rid of some of my things, and the Perl Journal is up for grabs. I have all 19 issues which were printed before they went to the online distribution. They are all in good condition. These are available for best offer I receive by Tuesday end of day, or free if no better offer. For pickup in central austin. Thanks, Jeff Sumner From mhc at texas.net Sun Oct 2 18:59:48 2005 From: mhc at texas.net (Mark Cunningham) Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 20:59:48 -0500 Subject: APM: Perl/SQL Server position in Houston, Texas References: Message-ID: <01fc01c5c7be$225b7560$d28ff746@CUNNINGHAM> I know this is a stretch but would anyone be crazy enough to relocate to Houston for this job? It's with a great employer (financial services arena) and they might even throw in some money for the relocation. It's an immediate hire for the right person. The most important requirement for this position is the Perl/RDBMS background... Thanks and please read below. Mark Cunningham The Bidding Network 512-527-0408 work 512-699-5719 cell mhc at texas.net www.thebiddingnetwork.com Position Description: Client is currently looking for a systems developer to help enhance, develop and maintain its weather data trading platform. The position will be a part of the Information Technology Team and will work closely with the Weather Data teams in Houston and London. KEY RESPONSIBILITIES ? Development, enhancement and maintenance of the weather data processing system. Manage data gathering process to ensure accuracy and timeliness of data downloads. ? Transform weather data into products that can be used by Meteorologists, Analysts and Traders to make business decisions. ? Closely interacting with the weather trading business team and meteorologists to gather detailed specification for required solutions. Work closely with the London business and IT teams to ensure that London requirements are addressed and coordinated with the Houston office. ? Work with Application Team Lead and members of the team in designing and implementing solutions. ? Analyze, design, develop, test, and deploy the solution. ? Maintain and enhance solutions as required by the business. Job Requirements: SKILLS / EXPERIENCE a.. Understanding of the energy trading business b.. Good understanding of front-office trading systems architecture c.. Some knowledge of derivatives and financial products d.. Minimum of 5 years of hands-on application development experience. e.. Desired Technology: a.. Unix/Linux - Weather data system is hosted on various types of Unix/Linux servers. Person must be very knowledgeable, and be able to answer questions from analysts. b.. Windows Desktop (2000, XP) - Front End Clients run on windows desktop environment. c.. Perl / Shell Scripting - Person must be able to script in a fast-paced environment. Typically, traders and meteorologists will have little time to fulfill requests, so quick turnaround is a must. d.. SQL (Oracle 9i/MySQL/PostgreSQL/Microsoft SQL) - The weather data system uses a Microsoft SQL Server database for data input, output and for holding some data. Also, we use very large file systems for storing algorithmic data from weather data models. e.. Networks - A basic understanding of networking will be needed to understand how the applications and servers communicate. f.. On-Call Support - off-hours support is needed to ensure applications and all other systems are available to risk analysts. f.. Additional Technology a.. Java/J2EE or C#/.Net b.. Business Objects c.. MATLAB d.. GrADS (Grid Analysis and Display System) / GRIB data format COMPETENCIES ? Business Knowledge: Demonstrates an understanding of the issues relevant to Merrill Lynch, its world-wide businesses, and the global financial services industry; maintains an up-to-date perspective and knowledge of the business; applies technology and business knowledge to solve business problems and create new opportunities. ? Technical Expertise: Demonstrates in-depth technical expertise and knowledge appropriate to functional role; stays abreast with emerging technologies and trends. Presents technical information in easily understood terms. ? Executes/Results-Driven: Sets and conveys clear goals and monitors progress; is accessible and supports relevant others; obtains results and adds value to the organization by making timely and sound decisions and influencing others. ? Analytical Thinking: Intellectual capacity to break down a problem or situation into its component parts, identifying implications, timeframes and sequences. ? Attention to Detail: A concern for ensuring accuracy, clarity and quality of work reflecting an underlying drive to increase efficiency and track organizational measures. ? Collaboration And Teamwork: Creates commitment to common goals; identifies competing interests and finds ways to balance them; values contributions of all team members and other constituencies; values team accomplishments over individual accomplishments; leverages others' strengths and experiences to achieve team goals; co-operates with colleagues and shares resources. ? Client/Relationship Management: Establishes and builds relationships with clients. Applies knowledge to the business and provides personalized, value-added service. Demonstrates willingness to meet needs of clients by pursuing improved courses of action; delivers products and services that best serve client needs; uses client feedback as a basis for improving service and performs necessary follow-up work without being prompted. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/austin/attachments/20051003/3e35564f/attachment.html From dbii at interaction.net Mon Oct 10 07:52:51 2005 From: dbii at interaction.net (David Bluestein II) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 09:52:51 -0500 Subject: APM: Currency Formatting Message-ID: <204710aabceab6efc8c4b2eabf150ef7@interaction.net> Okay, I've got currency (some $00000.00, some 0000.00, some 000.0) that I need to run through a formatter and get out: $00,000.00 I have the cents, and the $ sign, but is there an easy way to get commas from sprint which is generating my decimal places? Or do I need to use something more like the Format.pm? I looked in cookbook, and it does commas based on straight numbers, not with decimals. Anyone have an elegant solution, since the ones I googled were not. Thanks- David ----------------------------------------------------------------------- David H. Bluestein II President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net ii, inc. http://www.interaction.net -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- From tim at toolman.org Mon Oct 10 08:06:49 2005 From: tim at toolman.org (Tim Peoples) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 10:06:49 -0500 Subject: APM: Currency Formatting In-Reply-To: <204710aabceab6efc8c4b2eabf150ef7@interaction.net> References: <204710aabceab6efc8c4b2eabf150ef7@interaction.net> Message-ID: <434A8389.6070805@toolman.org> How about something like this? 1 while $val =~ s/^(-?\$?\d+)(\d{3})/$1,$2/; Tim. David Bluestein II wrote: >Okay, I've got currency (some $00000.00, some 0000.00, some 000.0) that >I need to run through a formatter and get out: > >$00,000.00 > >I have the cents, and the $ sign, but is there an easy way to get >commas from sprint which is generating my decimal places? Or do I need >to use something more like the Format.pm? I looked in cookbook, and it >does commas based on straight numbers, not with decimals. Anyone have >an elegant solution, since the ones I googled were not. > >Thanks- > >David > >----------------------------------------------------------------------- >David H. Bluestein II >President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net >ii, inc. >http://www.interaction.net > -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- > >_______________________________________________ >Austin mailing list >Austin at pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin > > > -- _______________________________________________________________________ Timothy E. Peoples Have Camel, Will Code tim at toolman.org From hcoyote at ghostar.ath.cx Mon Oct 10 17:34:35 2005 From: hcoyote at ghostar.ath.cx (HCoyote) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 19:34:35 -0500 Subject: APM: Currency Formatting In-Reply-To: <204710aabceab6efc8c4b2eabf150ef7@interaction.net> References: <204710aabceab6efc8c4b2eabf150ef7@interaction.net> Message-ID: <20051011003435.GA82368@malkavian.ghostar.ath.cx> On Mon, Oct 10, 2005 at 09:52:51AM -0500, David Bluestein II wrote: > Okay, I've got currency (some $00000.00, some 0000.00, some 000.0) that > I need to run through a formatter and get out: > > $00,000.00 > > I have the cents, and the $ sign, but is there an easy way to get > commas from sprint which is generating my decimal places? Or do I need > to use something more like the Format.pm? I looked in cookbook, and it > does commas based on straight numbers, not with decimals. Anyone have > an elegant solution, since the ones I googled were not. You probably want one of: Locale::Currency::Format Number::Format Math::Currency all of which look like they have the formatting you want. Travis From wwalker at bybent.com Tue Oct 11 20:36:28 2005 From: wwalker at bybent.com (Wayne Walker) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 22:36:28 -0500 Subject: APM: NEW LIST CREATED - Please read - WAS - Re: [ctl-linux] Any Asterisk voip interest groups in Austin? In-Reply-To: <434C646F.2050600@mindspring.com> References: <434C646F.2050600@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <20051012033628.GD3541@bybent.com> http://www.bybent.com/mailman/listinfo/austin-asterisk-users-group I've setup a mailing list for those interested oin this group. It looks very much like a real group will exist shortly. Join quickly to get in your two cents worth. Please take this traffic off the other lists. Wayne On Tue, Oct 11, 2005 at 08:18:39PM -0500, Larry Alkoff wrote: > I'm interested in talking with others in the Austin area about setting > up an Asterisk pbx system for my house. > > There was some talk last year about an Austin Asterisk UG but haven't > heard anything recently. > > My Panasonic digital system has been destroyed by lightning and the > company has discontinued the equipment I was using, including over a > dozen proprietary digital phones. I'm looking for another solution that > includes at least one POTS line and voip capability. > > Larry > > -- > Larry Alkoff N2LA - Austin TX > Using Thunderbird on Slackware Linux > _______________________________________________ > linux at ctlug.org > http://www.ctlug.org/mailman/listinfo/linux -- Wayne Walker wwalker at bybent.com Do you use Linux?! http://www.bybent.com Get Counted! http://counter.li.org/ Perl - http://www.perl.org/ Perl User Groups - http://www.pm.org/ Jabber: wwalker at jabber.gnumber.com AIM: lwwalkerbybent IRC: wwalker on freenode.net From bill.raty at gmail.com Wed Oct 12 12:01:25 2005 From: bill.raty at gmail.com (Bill Raty) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 14:01:25 -0500 Subject: APM: Win32 & Perl-- can I get the command line given to an executable from its pid? Message-ID: <3be6deac0510121201i38732abeibffd0f5a689728db@mail.gmail.com> Perl programs run under MSWindows appear in the task manager as 'perl'. Thus if you have two perl sources that are hogging CPU you can't tell which source is causing the problem. Are there any Win32::* or ActiveState libraries that can let me see which perl source is running? Other techniques? FYI-- SysInternal's Process Explorer has been suggested. Thanks, -Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/austin/attachments/20051012/50526d60/attachment.html From tim at toolman.org Thu Oct 13 06:31:57 2005 From: tim at toolman.org (Tim Peoples) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2005 08:31:57 -0500 Subject: APM: Win32 & Perl-- can I get the command line given to an executable from its pid? In-Reply-To: <3be6deac0510121201i38732abeibffd0f5a689728db@mail.gmail.com> References: <3be6deac0510121201i38732abeibffd0f5a689728db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <434E61CD.2060300@toolman.org> Unfortunately, I don't have a Win32 box handy to try this but... ususally you can simply modify $0 to accomplish this (at least on most modern *nix type systems). Have you tried that? Tim. Bill Raty wrote: > Perl programs run under MSWindows appear in the task manager as > 'perl'. Thus if you have two perl sources that are hogging CPU you > can't tell which source is causing the problem. > > Are there any Win32::* or ActiveState libraries that can let me see > which perl source is running? Other techniques? > > FYI-- SysInternal's Process Explorer has been suggested. > > Thanks, > > -Bill > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Austin mailing list >Austin at pm.org >http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin > -- _______________________________________________________________________ Timothy E. Peoples Have Camel, Will Code tim at toolman.org From dbii at interaction.net Mon Oct 17 22:14:20 2005 From: dbii at interaction.net (David Bluestein II) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 00:14:20 -0500 Subject: APM: October Meeting: Perl & Eclipse (NEW MTG LOCATION) Message-ID: Heath Malmstrom will be presenting a review of the existing/new functionality of the Eclipse EPIC Perl Plugin. Covering refactoring tools, POD viewing, syntax highlighting, completion, etc. Wednesday, October 19, 7:00 pm NEW LOCATION This month, we will be meeting at ServerGraph. Go to building, call Mark's cell number for entry (additional instructions will be on the door). Servergraph 9600 N. Mopac Suite 600 Austin, TX 78759 Main Number: +1 (512) 482-6137 Marks Cell number: 689-7705 Map to Servergraph: http://maps.yahoo.com/ maps_resultaddr=9600++N.+Mopac+Suite+600&csz=Austin%2C+TX%2C+78759&count ry=us&new=1&name=&qty= Dinner will still be at Double Dave's on 11900 Metric Blvd., Ste. F., at 5:45pm'ish ----------------------------------------------------------------------- David H. Bluestein II President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net ii, inc. http://www.interaction.net -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- From dbii at interaction.net Wed Oct 19 06:53:32 2005 From: dbii at interaction.net (David Bluestein II) Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 08:53:32 -0500 Subject: APM: Meeting Tonight (NEW LOCATION FROM LAST MONTH) Message-ID: <79a11654d4f95ae66416777437b2c033@interaction.net> Everyone- Heath is presenting on Perl and Eclipse, a more in-depth followup to our earlier presentation several months ago. I just wanted to remind everyone we are meeting at ServerGraph this month. The directions are: NEW LOCATION This month, we will be meeting at ServerGraph. Go to building, call Mark's cell number for entry (additional instructions will be on the door). Servergraph 9600 N. Mopac Suite 600 Austin, TX 78759 Main Number: +1 (512) 482-6137 Marks Cell number: 689-7705 Map to Servergraph: http://maps.yahoo.com/ maps_resultaddr=9600++N.+Mopac+Suite+600&csz=Austin%2C+TX%2C+78759&count ry=us&new=1&name=&qty= Dinner will still be at Double Dave's on 11900 Metric Blvd., Ste. F., at 5:45pm'ish ----------------------------------------------------------------------- David H. Bluestein II President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net ii, inc. http://www.interaction.net -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- From mjacobsen at vadoinc.com Fri Oct 21 12:28:36 2005 From: mjacobsen at vadoinc.com (Michelle Jacobsen) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2005 12:28:36 -0700 Subject: APM: I am looking for an OO Perl Developer Message-ID: <1B150662A9D37442A93D76DECECD107A5FEC91@vadoex1.vadoconsulting.com> Hello Perl Mongers! My name is Michelle Jacobsen. I am a Technical Recruiter working for a company called Vado. We specialize in placing IT & Engineering professionals. We have a client in Austin who is looking for an OO Perl Developer. It is a 6+ contract position that could potentially go perm. Here is the job description: Senior developer with experience writing production-quality Perl. Expert in Object-Oriented programming. Deep knowledge of programming practices as indicated by experience with low-level languages, such as C and C++, IPC, distributed computing, data structures, algorithms, version control. Must be able to work independently with minimal direction, take initiative and be a self-starter. Please send resumes to mjacobsen at vadoinc.com or feel free to call (925) 824-3311. I look forward to speaking with you! Michelle Jacobsen VADO, Inc. (925) 824-3311 www.vadoinc.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/austin/attachments/20051021/a613faad/attachment.html From dbii at interaction.net Mon Oct 24 19:49:53 2005 From: dbii at interaction.net (David Bluestein II) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2005 21:49:53 -0500 Subject: APM: Live Support type Perl CGI? Message-ID: I'm looking for a good open source Live Support system based on Perl. This is the thing you see on sites where it says: "Click here for live help" then you get a popup chat window. Anyone had any experience with a Perl based solution? I've found some PHP ones, but with Perl I could hack it to my hearts content. Thanks- David ----------------------------------------------------------------------- David H. Bluestein II President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net ii, inc. http://www.interaction.net -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- From wwalker at bybent.com Tue Oct 25 09:17:43 2005 From: wwalker at bybent.com (Wayne Walker) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2005 11:17:43 -0500 Subject: APM: Live Support type Perl CGI? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20051025161743.GB3641@bybent.com> Search freshmeat.net for perl chat Quite a few interesting solutions. Then search for perl cgi irc client. One result. I've used that solution before. It's not pretty, but its very functional. Wayne On Mon, Oct 24, 2005 at 09:49:53PM -0500, David Bluestein II wrote: > I'm looking for a good open source Live Support system based on Perl. > This is the thing you see on sites where it says: "Click here for live > help" then you get a popup chat window. Anyone had any experience with > a Perl based solution? I've found some PHP ones, but with Perl I could > hack it to my hearts content. > > Thanks- > > David > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > David H. Bluestein II > President & Lead Developer dbii at interaction.net > ii, inc. > http://www.interaction.net > -- Specializing in Interactive, Database Driven Websites -- > > _______________________________________________ > Austin mailing list > Austin at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin -- Wayne Walker wwalker at bybent.com Do you use Linux?! http://www.bybent.com Get Counted! http://counter.li.org/ Perl - http://www.perl.org/ Perl User Groups - http://www.pm.org/ Jabber: wwalker at jabber.gnumber.com AIM: lwwalkerbybent IRC: wwalker on freenode.net From apthorpe+pm at cynistar.net Wed Oct 26 21:20:56 2005 From: apthorpe+pm at cynistar.net (Bob Apthorpe) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 23:20:56 -0500 Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system Message-ID: <436055A8.2050608@cynistar.net> Hi, It's been a while since I've done any CGI programming in perl but recently I took on a project where we're using HTML::Template to render pages. My preference is to use a templating system to separate the logic from the presentation and most recently I've been using PHP and the Smarty template system for web application development. Smarty has its quirks but it's easy enough to pass complex data structures into a template to generate rather elaborate pages. Not having any previous experience with HTML::Template aside from perldoc and some trivial examples, how do the two tools compare? Is there a better system to use that does not require mod_perl? I'm specifically eliminating HTML::Mason because it's too heavyweight for what I'm trying to do, i.e. I'm looking more for a templating system than an application framework (I'm still learning Rails...) The application is not expected to be high traffic so it can run as a CGI without worrying much about performance. Conversely, this is for a client and I would rather not have to specify a highly-tuned ("hacked") Apache configuration, which is why I don't want to mess with mod_perl. Google turns up http://perl.apache.org/docs/tutorials/tmpl/comparison/comparison.html and after reading that, I think Template Toolkit bears some investigation. Still, I'd appreciate hearing people's experiences with perl templating systems. Thanks, -- Bob From brentlavelle at yahoo.com Thu Oct 27 06:25:47 2005 From: brentlavelle at yahoo.com (Brent LaVelle) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 06:25:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system In-Reply-To: <436055A8.2050608@cynistar.net> Message-ID: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Warning: dated material I started using HTML::Template a while ago for simple projects like http://portfolio.cunninghamarchitects.com/cgi-bin/projects found it to be annoying. A good example is that inside a loop if I wanted to access variable outside the loop I had put them on each hash element I was looping over. I got real sick of HTML::Template fast. Also think of tables where rowspan and colspan are >1. However the thing I went onto you already do not want to use. I like Mason because of the content wrapping concept. Wrapping things like headers and footers around content, I found, is so much better than including stuff. Mason is a different way of thinking but very powerful. The idea of the user just hitting a page that is nothing more than a SQL statment that is then wrapped and wrapped until it makes a report is very powerful. So, I'd like to bring HTML::Template down a notch and tell you to possibly rethink the Mason solution. I suppose I would have been a real help if I had used something else. --- Bob Apthorpe wrote: > Hi, > > It's been a while since I've done any CGI programming in perl but > recently I took on a project where we're using HTML::Template to > render > pages. My preference is to use a templating system to separate the > logic > from the presentation and most recently I've been using PHP and the > Smarty template system for web application development. Smarty has > its > quirks but it's easy enough to pass complex data structures into a > template to generate rather elaborate pages. > > Not having any previous experience with HTML::Template aside from > perldoc and some trivial examples, how do the two tools compare? Is > there a better system to use that does not require mod_perl? I'm > specifically eliminating HTML::Mason because it's too heavyweight for > what I'm trying to do, i.e. I'm looking more for a templating system > than an application framework (I'm still learning Rails...) > > The application is not expected to be high traffic so it can run as a > CGI without worrying much about performance. Conversely, this is for > a > client and I would rather not have to specify a highly-tuned > ("hacked") > Apache configuration, which is why I don't want to mess with > mod_perl. > > Google turns up > http://perl.apache.org/docs/tutorials/tmpl/comparison/comparison.html > and after reading that, I think Template Toolkit bears some > investigation. Still, I'd appreciate hearing people's experiences > with > perl templating systems. > > Thanks, > > -- Bob > _______________________________________________ > Austin mailing list > Austin at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin > __________________________________ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com From chris at tooley.com Thu Oct 27 07:25:47 2005 From: chris at tooley.com (Chris Tooley) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 09:25:47 -0500 Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system In-Reply-To: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1130423147.22671.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> We use HTML::Template extensively and I really like it. We've used it for a long time. Like Smarty it has some quirks, but it's light, and easy to use, and since it's integrated well with CGI::Application it doesn't require any extra effort to use if you're using CGI::Application. If you're dead set on getting rid of HTML::Template though, I highly recommend Template Toolkit. TT allows you to do a lot of logic things in the template, but you can generally ignore them and use it specifically for layout. It also has the added benefit of being good for exporting the content in the template (with some prior care in the layout) to multiple things besides just HTML. So you can generate PDFs for instance. If you're working on something for a company that does press releases, the content can all go in one place and marketing gets the website updated, PDF's to send out as press releases, and something to put in their file, all in the same layout engine. TT is probably heavier than what you were looking for but unlike most of the heavy template engines it adds benefits beyond just web layout. It does however have a lot of benefits and version 3 which is coming soon, should add some support for other languages as well. > --- Bob Apthorpe wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > It's been a while since I've done any CGI programming in perl but > > recently I took on a project where we're using HTML::Template to > > render > > pages. My preference is to use a templating system to separate the > > logic > > from the presentation and most recently I've been using PHP and the > > Smarty template system for web application development. Smarty has > > its > > quirks but it's easy enough to pass complex data structures into a > > template to generate rather elaborate pages. > > > > Not having any previous experience with HTML::Template aside from > > perldoc and some trivial examples, how do the two tools compare? Is > > there a better system to use that does not require mod_perl? I'm > > specifically eliminating HTML::Mason because it's too heavyweight for > > what I'm trying to do, i.e. I'm looking more for a templating system > > than an application framework (I'm still learning Rails...) > > > > The application is not expected to be high traffic so it can run as a > > CGI without worrying much about performance. Conversely, this is for > > a > > client and I would rather not have to specify a highly-tuned > > ("hacked") > > Apache configuration, which is why I don't want to mess with > > mod_perl. > > > > Google turns up > > http://perl.apache.org/docs/tutorials/tmpl/comparison/comparison.html > > and after reading that, I think Template Toolkit bears some > > investigation. Still, I'd appreciate hearing people's experiences > > with > > perl templating systems. > > > > Thanks, > > > > -- Bob > > _______________________________________________ > > Austin mailing list > > Austin at pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. > http://farechase.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Austin mailing list > Austin at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin -- Chris Tooley 512-646-1507 ctooley at gnumber.com From wwalker at bybent.com Thu Oct 27 07:44:25 2005 From: wwalker at bybent.com (Wayne Walker) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 09:44:25 -0500 Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system In-Reply-To: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <436055A8.2050608@cynistar.net> <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051027144425.GA10609@bybent.com> On Thu, Oct 27, 2005 at 06:25:47AM -0700, Brent LaVelle wrote: > Warning: dated material > > I started using HTML::Template a while ago for simple projects like > http://portfolio.cunninghamarchitects.com/cgi-bin/projects found it to > be annoying. A good example is that inside a loop if I wanted to > access variable outside the loop I had put them on each hash element I > was looping over. I got real sick of HTML::Template fast. > Also think of tables where rowspan and colspan are >1. I love HTML::Template. For the problem above, one ca do as Brent says and "drag" your "global variables" into the loop "rows", or you can just turn on global_vars in new(). In nested loops, there used to be some problem I had with globals, but I can't remember it and haven't seen it in a long time. They may have fixed the problem I saw. > --- Bob Apthorpe wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Not having any previous experience with HTML::Template aside from > > perldoc and some trivial examples, how do the two tools (Smarty) compare? I recommend sticking with HTML::Template. When you decide you just can't do it in HTML::Template (which means you probably are putting business logic in the .html files), look into Catalyst and Template::Toolkit. Anything in particular you want to knhow how to do in HTML::Template? -- Wayne Walker wwalker at bybent.com Do you use Linux?! http://www.bybent.com Get Counted! http://counter.li.org/ Perl - http://www.perl.org/ Perl User Groups - http://www.pm.org/ Jabber: wwalker at jabber.gnumber.com AIM: lwwalkerbybent IRC: wwalker on freenode.net From wwalker at bybent.com Thu Oct 27 07:49:07 2005 From: wwalker at bybent.com (Wayne Walker) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 09:49:07 -0500 Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system In-Reply-To: <1130423147.22671.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1130423147.22671.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20051027144907.GB10609@bybent.com> On Thu, Oct 27, 2005 at 09:25:47AM -0500, Chris Tooley wrote: > We use HTML::Template extensively and I really like it. We've used it > for a long time. Like Smarty it has some quirks, but it's light, and > easy to use, and since it's integrated well with CGI::Application it > doesn't require any extra effort to use if you're using > CGI::Application. CGI::Application Rocks!! Maypole, Catalyst, Ruby on Rails are all better, but MUCH heavier. If you want lightweight MVC with a short learning curve, CGI::Application and HTML::Template. > It (Template::Toolkit) does however have a lot of benefits and > version 3 which is coming soon, should add some support for other > languages as well. This remids me. HTML::Template is supported on lots of languages. Off the top of my head I believe that the HTML::Template engine exists for Ruby, Python, PHP, C++, Java, and, oh yeah... perl. Probably lots more now. that list is from a year or tow ago. -- Wayne Walker wwalker at bybent.com Do you use Linux?! http://www.bybent.com Get Counted! http://counter.li.org/ Perl - http://www.perl.org/ Perl User Groups - http://www.pm.org/ Jabber: wwalker at jabber.gnumber.com AIM: lwwalkerbybent IRC: wwalker on freenode.net From msouth at gmail.com Thu Oct 27 09:41:31 2005 From: msouth at gmail.com (Mike South) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 12:41:31 -0400 Subject: APM: Looking for a good HTML templating system In-Reply-To: <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <436055A8.2050608@cynistar.net> <20051027132547.21398.qmail@web32501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I second the sentiment below about HTML::Template limitations, but I would go Template Toolkit rather than Mason. It's easier to do very lightweight things in Toolkit (in my opinion--maybe my Mason experience is too little?). Bascially, I would put it like this: HTML::Template has a very small learning curve but will very likely run out of steam if your application grows Template Toolkit's learning curve is not much worse than HTML::Template's, and in fact it will let you write almost exactly the same template code as HTML::Template, but it will probably never run out of steam no matter what you decide you want it to do if your needs grow more complex. Mason will also let you do very flexible and powerful things like Toolkit, but it's harder to get up and running on it quickly. Here is an all-in-one-file (the template is stored at the end of the file in the __DATA__ section) script that shows you some of what Toolkit can do, some of which could not be easily done in HTML::Template (I posted this to the list a while back when there was a similar question): #!/usr/bin/perl use strict; use Template; my $folks = [ { name => 'bob', fruit =>'kiwi', friends => [qw/ sally jessie raphael/], }, { name => 'sally', fruit => 'kumquat', friends =>[], }, { name => 'misery', fruit => 'company', friends =>[qw/ avarice sloth /], }, { name => 'batman', fruit => 'robin', friends =>[qw/ catwoman /], }, ]; #and you pass that in to a template as 'folks', you can have a loop like this: my $template = Template->new(); my $output; $template->process(\*DATA, {folks=>$folks}, \$output) || die $template->error; print $output; __DATA__ [%- FOREACH person = folks %] ====================== [%- person.name %] likes [% person.fruit %] [%- FOREACH friend = person.friends -%] [%- IF loop.first %] [% person.name %] is a friend of:[% END -%] [%- IF loop.last && person.friends.size > 1 %] and[%END %] [% friend %][% IF not loop.last and person.friends.size > 2%],[% END -%] [%- END -%] [%- IF loop.last %] ====================== [%- END -%] [%- END %] This prints ====================== bob likes kiwi bob is a friend of: sally, jessie, and raphael ====================== sally likes kumquat ====================== misery likes company misery is a friend of: avarice and sloth ====================== batman likes robin batman is a friend of: catwoman ====================== On 10/27/05, Brent LaVelle wrote: > Warning: dated material > > I started using HTML::Template a while ago for simple projects like > http://portfolio.cunninghamarchitects.com/cgi-bin/projects found it to > be annoying. A good example is that inside a loop if I wanted to > access variable outside the loop I had put them on each hash element I > was looping over. I got real sick of HTML::Template fast. > Also think of tables where rowspan and colspan are >1. > > However the thing I went onto you already do not want to use. I like > Mason because of the content wrapping concept. Wrapping things like > headers and footers around content, I found, is so much better than > including stuff. Mason is a different way of thinking but very > powerful. The idea of the user just hitting a page that is nothing > more than a SQL statment that is then wrapped and wrapped until it > makes a report is very powerful. > > So, I'd like to bring HTML::Template down a notch and tell you to > possibly rethink the Mason solution. I suppose I would have been a > real help if I had used something else. > > --- Bob Apthorpe wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > It's been a while since I've done any CGI programming in perl but > > recently I took on a project where we're using HTML::Template to > > render > > pages. My preference is to use a templating system to separate the > > logic > > from the presentation and most recently I've been using PHP and the > > Smarty template system for web application development. Smarty has > > its > > quirks but it's easy enough to pass complex data structures into a > > template to generate rather elaborate pages. > > > > Not having any previous experience with HTML::Template aside from > > perldoc and some trivial examples, how do the two tools compare? Is > > there a better system to use that does not require mod_perl? I'm > > specifically eliminating HTML::Mason because it's too heavyweight for > > what I'm trying to do, i.e. I'm looking more for a templating system > > than an application framework (I'm still learning Rails...) > > > > The application is not expected to be high traffic so it can run as a > > CGI without worrying much about performance. Conversely, this is for > > a > > client and I would rather not have to specify a highly-tuned > > ("hacked") > > Apache configuration, which is why I don't want to mess with > > mod_perl. > > > > Google turns up > > http://perl.apache.org/docs/tutorials/tmpl/comparison/comparison.html > > and after reading that, I think Template Toolkit bears some > > investigation. Still, I'd appreciate hearing people's experiences > > with > > perl templating systems. > > > > Thanks, > > > > -- Bob > > _______________________________________________ > > Austin mailing list > > Austin at pm.org > > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. > http://farechase.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Austin mailing list > Austin at pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/austin >